camtang Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 Nope just a theory. A very very good theory, but a theory none-the-less. You learn something every day thanks P44 I prefer to make my own food. Much nicer than takeaways !drool: I'm about to make another curry shortly :bounce: No way, I am yet to make a better curry then the India duo down the road from me. and I have tryed plenty of time, nobady can take there curry king title Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Godly3vil Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 Taniwhas are real. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livebearer_breeder Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 evolution just presents us with a coherent, widely collaborated intelligent argument for the beginning of life and the cluster affect since then that doesn't require us to look at something we don't understand and grunt "god" at anymore. But yes it still is just a theory and i have to say i'm not completely sold on Darwinism. I really hope there is God! I've spent a huge portion of my life trying to make sense of religions and evolution and other theories. Obviously i have to make the most sensible decision for me on a personal level. So although i do believe in a entity i don't understand, i don't think the bible could accurately describe him/it, the purpose or the truth behind what he is, as it was written by man, and i think that masking that question with the answer "it was divinely inspired" is a bit of a cop out, also there are just some huge basic fundamentals i would expect a book written by god to obtain, like things about the universe and that the world is round for example, also that we are obviously a race older than 6000 years. And i also think that the bible (as great a book it is) should not be taking in its entire sense factually and rather as more of a guideline to a good and sensible lifestyle (if you were to ignore parts). I also think that westernized religion is traditionally very selfish, in its actions, establishments, through prayer and worship (where often people are asking god for something for themselves). And this is usually where Christians get angry with me, because they've been told that they must accept the bible in its entirety as fact or they aren't true believers, and i feel like that's really unfair. All I've ever sought after is the absolute truth and if i were a pastor i would encourage people to start asking these really hard questions, cause we may get some really awesome and astounding answers. If we press ourselves and what we know hard enough, surely at the end we will eventually come to an understanding and agreement and if nothing else be more steadfast in our beliefs because we challenged them in the first place. Another thing that really concerns me is this marriage debacle that's going on. Marriage was NOT invented or created by religion, It pre-dates the modern gods and old gods by a substantial amount. forcing very abortionistic, prejudice, stone aged, contradictory views on people who just want to make a real and true commitment to one another, regardless of their sexuality. Its about being faithful and making sacrifices for one another, it is NOT about a book that contradicts itself, by its very nature evolves from one testament to the next, claims absolutes with fear mongering and then presents us with no factual evidence to support it. If you are a human being, you have the right to marry if you so choose, simple as that. Alan i too find religious history very interesting in that manner, so many extremely similar events that are taught as fact for each faith, ancient history has this too, with the samarians, Aztecs, Mesopotamians and egyptians to name a few all building temples to large gods who descended from the heavens in ships that glowed or were made of light and gave them knowledge, there are even records of this in the bible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
camtang Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 Thats something that intrigues me too. At the time the bible was written peoples scientific understanding was so limited that trying to bring them up to speed on how the world was created would have taken ten times the pages, so it was far easier to say wham bam done in seven days and get on with the other stuff. Grand scheme of things our scinetific knowledge is miniscul. bigger then that era but still very very small in the grand plan of it all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
camtang Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 Another thing that really concerns me is this marriage debacle that's going on. Marriage was NOT invented or created by religion, It pre-dates the modern gods and old gods by a substantial amount. forcing very abortionistic, prejudice, stone aged, contradictory views on people who just want to make a real and true commitment to one another, regardless of their sexuality. Its about being faithful and making sacrifices for one another, it is NOT about a book that contradicts itself, by its very nature evolves from one testament to the next, claims absolutes with fear mongering and then presents us with no factual evidence to support it. If you are a human being, you have the right to marry if you so choose, simple as that. ALL FOR GAY MARRIGE!!!! :thup: :thup: :thup: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livingart Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 Taniwhas are real. yes i used to have a small one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Godly3vil Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 That's the bugger! Common as. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenix44 Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 just came across this and loled ahha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamH Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 Obvious troll is obvious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheepsnana Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 the vast majority of religious people in new zealand follow a religion that says this: "I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent" I'm yet to find that anywhere. Joe, that is a very profound quote and will offend plenty of christians but I tend to agree with you. I'm not offended. People are entitled to their free will. Many Christians forget this. food glourious food /AGREE :thup: "proof" of Gods existance would defeat the purpose of "faith". And [seems how someone needs to play devils advocate if this is to be a discussion of any sorts], with regard to the quote, it doesn't really make sense. If the bible is to be believed then God made the world perfect and man mucked it up, Epicurus seems to blame God for mans evil (despite us supposedly being made as free-willed beings) and thinks because he hasn't come and sorted out his troubles he therefor doesn't exist (or isn't worth believeing in). It seems to me that many people get God and Santa muddled up... Proof defeats Faith. Hear me out here, and try to keep an open mind: When God created all of the Angels, they were aware of him and loved him. Praised and Glorified him. How long until you get sick of that? You don't play a game to win every time, you want a challenge! So... Lucifer gets power hungry, gets kicked out of the fan club, and now every Friday God and Lucifer sit down for a drink and say "So, who do we tempt this weekend?" Free will is God giving us a choice. I met a Scientologist who is married to a Christian. She was discussing the teachings and faith with her inlaws. They said "There is a road going one way and a road going the other way. one way leads to hell, the other way leads to heaven. Knowing this, how can you choose to walk the path to hell?" She replied "God gave us a choice. We don't have to follow him. I choose not too.... By the way, there's a rope over there, I'm taking that." I find it impossible to believe the world is only six thousand years old, but equally difficult to believe that life can come from a completely inert nothingness (I have no problem with Darwins theory of natural selection, you'd be a mug to not be able to understand how that works on some scale, but its the very beginning where it falls over for me). There is a theory of an old world, that is repopulated. This could explain dino's. Evolution happens. There is no doubt. I don't think we evolved from Monkeys, but there are introduced birds around NZ that have evolved into completely different species, to the point where they can no longer breed with their "cousins" (for lack of a better term). Taniwhas are real.Throw in a bit of mythology here. Who HASN'T heard of Dragons? Phoenixes? Unicorns? I doubt this was one kid with an overactive imagination. Too much evidence, but buried deep. (Sound familiar?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
camtang Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 After watching a doco on Malawi's cichlid I was 100% devoted to evolution, before then i was at 95% Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livebearer_breeder Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 Proof defeats Faith. Hear me out here, and try to keep an open mind: When God created all of the Angels, they were aware of him and loved him. Praised and Glorified him. How long until you get sick of that? You don't play a game to win every time, you want a challenge! So... Lucifer gets power hungry, gets kicked out of the fan club, and now every Friday God and Lucifer sit down for a drink and say "So, who do we tempt this weekend?" Free will is God giving us a choice. So what you've just done here is apply human constructs to an entity that by your very own admission (perhaps not yours, but most who believe) we can't even begin to fathom? hmm The argument is that if God revealed himself, then we would know everything that he had left us in the bible, learned from and about, to be true, that we would then have no choice but to believe in him. So that is why he doesn't reveal himself. I think probably a better explanation would be, well God's a bit of a dick, hes been letting incredibly horrible things happen to everything he created since he could, he's probably sitting back just not revealing himself because it more fun that way, while we fight amongst ourselves and commit heinous crimes, sometimes even in his name. Even if God did decide to present himself to us, not every person in the world would suddenly make the decision to follow him, simply because human nature tells us this and a God who created us would surely know this about us? we are an adaptable societal creature, even if he did come and hang out on Wednesdays through Sundays since the beginning, we'd still just be like "sup" and we'd still go on sinning, because that would have been the norm, and again, he would have known this! and plenty of the 7 billion people on this planet would just get on with living their lives regardless, i'm sure a larger portion of the population WOULD in fact devote themselves to him, but you can see how the idea is flawed. "Why you only gotta return when you wanna destroy us God?" End of days, well i don't get it, why worship this guy at all if that's the only time hes going to turn up, cause hes bringing Armegeddon?? well the answer basically is, cause we are telling you hell is real and its a very scary place, even though we kinda know that dying is probably much like being born or in the womb, you don't remember it and once it happens it doesn't matter anymore cause you haven't existed in that form yet. So now we have to ask ourselves, what tactics are being used here....? But hang on a second... Jesus was the son of this guy and at the same time a human and at the same time also directly part of God and he would never have approved of any of this! its all so confusing and bit fanciful, my favorite part is that we equate ourselves to him, we were made in Gods image, we are of God, we are Godlike. I want there to a be a God sooo bad! but i just don't think hes a religious one and certainly not a westernized religious one. BUT!!!!! just like all human beings should be aloud to marry, they also deserve the right to have faith in anything they so choose! and i think it is important to at least believe in something, atheism often is very unhelpful and in truth people like Richard Dawkins, who may be intelligent and well spoken, come across as dickish and offensive, he really does not promote some of the most incredible ideas of life in a good light. I am not apposed to people who want to believe in Jesus, because if he was real, he was a man of equality and love and just an all around upstanding citizen and those are qualities i approve of and are helpful in societal structures, and i am certainly not pretending like I've got it all figured out, cause i don't! but when we move into religious establishment and misinformed ideologies not only can the mood change but we can develop some very dangerous fixations. Everything has to be taken with a grain of salt these days and i think generally people are getting pretty good at that, its not hard to offend anyone at any time, especially when it comes to their belief systems, what needs to be promoted is equality across the board, your reality is just as worthy as mine in any kind of measurable status, you deserve the chance to live it how you like without any prejudice from any group, whether it be Anagnostics, Atheists, Scientologists, Christians or anyone, but it starts with looking at things logically and with our sensibilities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livebearer_breeder Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 and now i just feel like a sexist for how many "hes" and "hims" i have in that post. :slfg: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanmin4304 Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 The ten comandments are simple rules that allow any society to function and are pretty much the rules in any society that functions reasonably--they are nothing magic. The biggest problem I have is that fundamentalist christians, muslims and others are getting more and more extreme and less tolerant of other human beings and their beliefs. Virtually all the wars and genecide in the last few centuries have been over religion and intolerence of other peoples beliefs. I find it amusing how many people laugh at some peoples belief in tanawhas (which might hold up construction of a moterway etc) but they believe in saints, angels, gods and devils and cannot see the similarities. Each to their own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamC Posted October 25, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 The interesting thing is how many religions that preceeded christianity had similar stories to tell. Miraculous births, 12 deciples, miracles, death and reserection after 3 days, 3 wise men following a star. Judaism did not arise from a void but borrowed from earlier faiths Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanmin4304 Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 They all were influenced by others that were around at the time or came before. Cultures that mix tend to blend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F15hguy Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 I just find it funny god has a personality change between the testaments.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ira Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 I just find it funny god has a personality change between the testaments.... You know what happened between them, right? He got laid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Li@m Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 :sml1: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livebearer_breeder Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 Judaism just like Islam and Christianity came from an abrahamic belief system, its pretty much set by Abraham and his descendants and was very structured, it was not just a blend of a bunch of stuff of the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanmin4304 Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 That is the part I find hard to get hold of. Christianity and Islam still hold to a lot of the old beliefs even when their profit spoke out against them. For instance if there is a conflict between and eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth and turning the other cheek it is all about reaching for the eye gauging and tooth pulling equipment. The more devout and fundamental they are the more they go back to jewish teaching---doesn't make sense to me. Islam is pretty similar, there are often 2 views expressed but they become hell bent on going with half of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanmin4304 Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 The scary bit is that about the only church buildings not munted in the quakes were the Jehovahs, seventh days, scientologists and the mosque---there could be a message there from above.I think the two main cathedrals got whacked bad so you have to wonder what they did wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livebearer_breeder Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 EXACTLY!! omg, im so glad someone else understand this. Its so frustrates me how a person can believe in contradictory ideologies and then spit it all out as if its based in some kind of self contained factual identity that they never bothered to explore the aspects of. Personal beliefs are very important to me and it astounds me that more people don;t really have a good hard look at this stuff before they go leaping in bullet-a-gate with a blindfold on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aotealotl Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 a guy which has flat lined and was pulled back to live was asked if he saw god - yes - and how does he look like - SHE IS BLACK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livebearer_breeder Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 When you die and when your born, a large amount of a chemical called DMT is released into your body, only happens on this level at those two points in your life and this is shared across all species on earth with a brain. Its a heavy hallucinogen that has often been described as heavenly, sometimes as very abstract. It doesn't really surprise me then that people come back occasionally saying they've seen god even though i know your making a joke :slfg: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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