RnB

funny, when you sell things you use Trademe... to get the best price What I find interesting, is that the trademe price for corals is very close to the wholesalers price, and they are normally only frags.... not whole corals. I LOVE trademe model. but have noticed a few things.... Some things (say sunbeds) just sell 2nd hand way below new cost, sellers just HAVE to meet the market.... but as most people on trademe do not have access to wholesale coral prices, coral frags sell for a big chunk of retail And as wasp suggests, still prob don't fully cover all his time/costs etc..... what does this imply to me... There is a huge untapped market on trademe to sell corals/fish. I do not think this would damage the hobby any more then the guys already selling new tanks on trademe limits tanks sales at pet shops. Petplanet - how you feel about the trademe fish tank vendors?

Goldfish Pagoda is buying marine stock at probably about the same or a little higher then "other" pet shops in Auckland. Each of the wholesalers has personal choice to supply them or not. Each of us has personal choice to support them or not. If Goldfish Pagoda is making 20-40% for doing nothing... it will catch on, and all those smaller pet shops around town will want a piece of the game..... It looks to me to be a fundamental change. It is certainly sustainable for Goldfish Pagoda, nothing to lose except easy cash. can/will nick/steve be able to maintain their enthusism at these price levels... why not, selling to pagoda just another client to them! If anything the question is, will the bigger stock carrying pet shops try to muslce the wholesaler with exclusive contracts? they have personal choice which wholesalers they deal with...

maybe the fish was damaged during capture/transport to your tank... this caused bacterial infection, weakened fish so began to show whitespot. Fact of life, fish die in this hobby, don't beat yourself up to bad.

This is great marketing for Goldfish Pagoda! Going to go out and have a look this Saturday.

please layton - let this one go...............

Are you allowed to refer customers to any of the Auckland clubs? I was having a chat to Calvin about this..... seems a bit like a sailmaker not being allowed to refer a sailer to a yacht club... just in case they find out from other members about another sail maker :roll: yep seems to be confirmed we all all doing it... seems to be something we can't TALK ABOUT OPENLY THOUGH!' It always seems darkest, just before it turns pitch black. I think we are at a turning point, cannot expect those who have power to easily or comfortably release it. So far myself and Pies predicted competition would lower prices... it has. Layton, and others suggested really low prices would "hurt" the hobby..... and cause shops to stop selling marines.... Lets wait and see huh..... interesting to see how many posts have "disapeared" today..... I expect bannings as a result. That or the posts should logically be returned.......

sort of like trying homopathic remedies while also using normal cancer curing drugs........ why not, what have you got to lose! ok i see your point... i also see other peoples point that adding garlic, may, cause some harm... also unproven. A truely scientific study would link the garlic to a phase in the parisites lifecycle and how it blocks/kills the parisite at this point. lets face it, none of the reef tank additives I have seen come with any links to scientific studies or independant analysis.... they seem to be virtual homopathic remedies... not to be confused with snake oil.... which clearly must derieve from snakes. thinking more about it..... Kalk - cheap industrial source, epson salts stuf for mag, iodine from pharnmacy, that pool stuff and baking soda.... all the "proven" additives with clear scientific testing and chemical reactions seem to be cheap and cheerful, its just the unproven ones that cost heaps! why not start bottling Wasp's no more Ich.... may be more profitable then fragging..... and proof does not commercially seem to be necessary.

Wasp when i first saw WS i rushed out in WGTN that week and brought a bag of garlic... all week i worried that i would return to AKL to a tank of dead fish.... when i got back they all looked great... no WS, tiny dusting a week or so later.... i still have the garlic in cupboard and no WS what does my experience prove.......... "You can do nothing, and in some cases the White Spot will become dormant." I know i did nothing, i wasn't even there! by itself this same "result" has been seen by other NZ reef keepers. I hypothosise therefore that adding garlic experients must be conducted with do nothing control experiemnts before a scientific co-relation should be concluded.

chimera, thats the guts of a post above. We pull from a diverse community that likes time to plan etc. especially so they cam come up from central north island.......... Regular meetings, with dates posted well in advance.

competition comes in various forms........ no different then my local sailing shop "getting in" that big $3000 winch... and charging $800 margin on the their $2200 purchase.... but oh the value they add! box arrieves , i pick it up...... yeah cool. this practice will only increase as the current two wholesalers try to grow the market. It is IMHO not a bad thing. as more cheaper product is what we all asked for! (well most of us ) I can almost feel the next stage.. as prices continue to fall..... to get back that lucrative margin shops may have to import themselves/which will make them, equal with the wholesalers that sell direct! in fact if the shops start importing their own, wholesalers will either have to do it for the love of it, sell direct openly, specialise, shut up shop..... there will be some irony if this comes to pass..... it is easy to make the argument that the wholesalers need the retailers more then the other way around. could it be that the CHCH market had the most efficient model ? competition is not a bad thing for customers...... or wholesalers.... any which way NO ONE can argue that there has not been a downward movement of retail prices in AKL... and even lower prices "available".

any call on what date would suit everyone?

Sounds like a good advertisment for a quarantine tank! running hypo or light copper.......

Thats funny wasp - I am convinced doing nothing makes it go away! perhaps next time you do nothing and I feed garlic

you really only have three options.... A) do nothing and hope fish is strong enough to overcome the attack, given its recent capture/import this may or may not work. I have moved fish from other peoples tanks to mine only for them to show slight WS signs, so far has cleared every time, tho never looked serious. I suspect all the movement, new territory etc stresses fish big time. IMHO happy healthy fish can tolerate WS in the tank. Never lost a fish to this so far. B) If you had a cycled Q tank you could hypo all your fish... no point if you not going to do this every time you add fish tho. and it may be the final straw for your fish above. C) Borrow someones UV system.... will not cure but can cut down the number of parasites in the water, giving fish more of a chance to gain strength...... lets us know what happens?

got to agree having seen pies setup i think its better then standard glass bracing.... especialy from a lighting perspective...... major +++

only left mine in for 4 weeks.... was on bottom on other rocks..... tided together with cable ties etc.... put straight in tank, no issues.

- yes just a small ammount to test....... but also done a much larger ammount in a 240l rubbish bin..... as i change lots of NSW through main tank, i think the at home route is easier.... mind you, i dived the rock in from my boat, walking it into rockpools by barrow prob easier.....

sure hollywoods sell em

go diving at poor knights some of the most beautiful temperate water nudi's in the world.... personal fav is the purple/green one....

WASP I moved the phosphate remover into more flow. ie all the return now dumps through it. as opposed to some maybe 20% through it. I was using it for 2-3 months before this. Personally I think it was a combination of just time and the larger export of stuff via water changes.... I know opinions vary on using NSW, but my experience is that the price of NSW allows you to be more agressive in your changes. The rock was pretty hairy when i got it, would have taken a while to finish leaching i reckon. I never panicked about the hair, knew it would go away eventually.

If round the bays date thats not so good. After that is easter and everyone will away. possible sunday the 3rd april? Reef - I think its better not to focus on what NZMAS may have been etc. If we focus on building a club that will hold peoples attention going forward then we all win. we could remove the issue of who owns the email list etc by sending out the email address of you/mick/steve regularily to members and asking them to contact you guys if they so wish. That way you will both have simultaneouis access to new members or people who have shown interest. I am not being critical of the past, but personally i am looking for a little more then a bbq and talking with other reefers, i do them already. I would like to learn more from those that understand/experienced the more advanced aspects of the hobby. I for one would love to hear you speak about your marine fish breeding experience. Peter

well I have just emailed Reef for details.... I guess the best way to do this is like any club would. I will attend the Auckland Reef Club meeting and propose that "The Auckland Reef Club and the NZMAS sp? merge, and that the club be incorporated as soon as possible." I suggest everyone who is interested in this matter attend. Reef - do I have your support to try and form one single club for auckland, where you, steve and nick will all be able to attend and sell direct if you wish.....

lets not challenge each other online ......... I am trying to work quietly behind scenes to make sure EVERYONE comes and feels welcome etc on neutral ground....

if steve/nick/alois/pies meet face to face more i think this forum would be a much nicer place! As for layton/wasp.. I am not sure that would help.... no just kidding... feelings get entrenched here, face to face only way to mellow things IMHO. cool smilley chim.

ok a free venue....... I am trying to extract some guidelines here that everyone thinks will work (this may take time now, but will pay divis longer term) Is someones place/home neutral enough for everyone...... I would not want anyone put off attending because of percieved bias, or past personal exchanges with the host :oops: If at all possible I would like to see Steve/Nick/Alois attend all meetings if they wish. This is best for us all, they are very experienced reefers.