Rabbit Posted November 12, 2010 Report Share Posted November 12, 2010 or who will pay for it? +1? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David R Posted November 12, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2010 Depends whats on there? I'd be happy to put up some cash, depending on how interested I am in the species being worked on... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrie Posted November 12, 2010 Report Share Posted November 12, 2010 Im sure that if its through the FNZAS, they would be looking at funding some of it Im not on the fish committee so Im guessing but it would make sense Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennifer Posted November 12, 2010 Report Share Posted November 12, 2010 We are discussing all of these things tomorrow at the executive meeting and will report back to the club delegates and the fish committee. I know I have approached a number of you about getting on board, now the ball is in your court whether or not you want to join the FNZAS. If you have recently become a member, send me a message if you would like to help the fish committee work on these issues. There is some great knowledge and enthusiasm out there and with a little leadership to guide the cause, our combined energy will no doubt have quite an impact. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbit Posted November 12, 2010 Report Share Posted November 12, 2010 Depends whats on there? I'd be happy to put up some cash, depending on how interested I am in the species being worked on... I would be happy to work with Fnzas and put some cash in given we where towards the same cause. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reef Posted November 12, 2010 Report Share Posted November 12, 2010 I have done enough work on adding fish to the allowable list, However I can help coordinate it as i know what to do and have the correct contacts in MAF and ERMA. MAF have agreed to the flow chart i posted and i am working with ERMA currently to see what is the best way to go forward. ERMA can approve a application in 10 days. however has to meet the following Rapid assessment for release: If the biological characteristics are appropriate and there is sufficient information, we may be able to do a rapid assessment of the risks. But to do so, the fish species: · must not be able to establish a self-sustaining population in the field (taking into account ease of eradication); · must not be capable of displacing any native species within its natural habitat; or · must not be able to breed with any native species. In addition, the fish species must be able to pass the minimum standards set out in our legislation which requires the decision maker to decline an application if the new organism is likely to- (a) cause any significant displacement of any native species within its natural habitat; or (b) cause any significant deterioration of natural habitats; or © cause any significant adverse effects on human health and safety; or (d) cause any significant adverse effect to New Zealand's inherent genetic diversity; or (e) cause disease, be parasitic, or become a vector for human, animal, or plant disease, unless the purpose of that importation or release is to import or release an organism to cause disease, be a parasite, or a vector for disease. BUT this really gets me Consultation: Release applications will normally involve some level of Maori Consultation. NOW as above rapid assessment The information is not that hard to find, so we just need people who can put effort into finding the info and collate all the data. Most of the questions above will not apply as the fish will be dead in cold water. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenix44 Posted November 12, 2010 Report Share Posted November 12, 2010 Great :roll: what a load of you know what. I would like to see more cories and hypans here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reef Posted November 12, 2010 Report Share Posted November 12, 2010 cories Most likely a no go as they are rated as high risk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenix44 Posted November 12, 2010 Report Share Posted November 12, 2010 Yeah I figured that. Ah well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbit Posted November 12, 2010 Report Share Posted November 12, 2010 Release applications will normally involve some level of Maori Consultation. How much will that cost? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livingart Posted November 12, 2010 Report Share Posted November 12, 2010 How much will that cost? not much for sure Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David R Posted November 12, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2010 Two swappas of Double Brown?? Reef how much "consultation" does there have to be and with how many Maori of what stature? I have a couple of people at work who may be able to be of assistance... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanmin4304 Posted November 12, 2010 Report Share Posted November 12, 2010 There are a number of fish that Maf look at sideways now because they can survive and possibly breed in our natural environment (particularly in the North) Think of the discussions on this site about fish that should be tropical that are sold as cold water fish in the shops and the number of fish that can be kept outside unheated in the summer. In my view it would actually be quite difficult to prove all the things listed in the requirements by reef. This would particularly apply to livebearers, catfish and barbs amongst the many, and may yet be banned by Maf rather than added to. There is a member here who has recently submitted a PhD on some of the diseases carried by some reptiles in NZ. What do we know about these fish on your wish lists and who do we have that can make a convincing scientific arguement agains the "experts" at or available to Maf? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbit Posted November 12, 2010 Report Share Posted November 12, 2010 There are a number of fish that Maf look at sideways now because they can survive and possibly breed in our natural environment (particularly in the North) Think of the discussions on this site about fish that should be tropical that are sold as cold water fish in the shops and the number of fish that can be kept outside unheated in the summer. In my view it would actually be quite difficult to prove all the things listed in the requirements by reef. This would particularly apply to livebearers, catfish and barbs amongst the many, and may yet be banned by Maf rather than added to. There is a member here who has recently submitted a PhD on some of the diseases carried by some reptiles in NZ. What do we know about these fish on your wish lists and who do we have that can make a convincing scientific arguement agains the "experts" at or available to Maf? The fact that the majority are "bred" stock not wild voids most of that. The problem is not just that of water temperature but quality ph, kh, tds etc and all of these would have to be within the temperature requirements only found up north restricting all possibility to a very minute area. Maf is yet to state what makes information "Viable" or correct. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanmin4304 Posted November 12, 2010 Report Share Posted November 12, 2010 I don't think bred stock or wild caught stock would be any different in terms of the criteria to be met. A very small geographical area where they can survive means they can survive and breed in the wild in NZ (ie mollies). Maf will not tell you what viable means. It will either be defined in the relevent legislation or be the oxford dictionary meaning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ymir Posted November 12, 2010 Report Share Posted November 12, 2010 I am happy to volunteer money and time to work on any of the dwarf african cichlids Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanmin4304 Posted November 12, 2010 Report Share Posted November 12, 2010 I am not trying to rubbish the proposal, only to point out that there will be considerable criteria to be met. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oscnz Posted November 12, 2010 Report Share Posted November 12, 2010 I would be happy to help out to if we could get more of a range of fish in NZ Someone just point me in the right direction Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrie Posted November 12, 2010 Report Share Posted November 12, 2010 The organisation/direction is probably the main reason to join a club. At the conference/AGM in June each year, these things are set up. With the people putting their hands up now, Im sure that the exec abd sub committee will be excited and looking forward to working with people as keen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jc254 Posted November 13, 2010 Report Share Posted November 13, 2010 Id like to work with certain marine fish? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice222 Posted November 13, 2010 Report Share Posted November 13, 2010 By the way, I always hear of this 'allowable fish list' is there actually a complied list? If so where can I find it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbit Posted November 13, 2010 Report Share Posted November 13, 2010 http://www.biosecurity.govt.nz/imports/animals/standards/fisornic.all.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice222 Posted November 13, 2010 Report Share Posted November 13, 2010 http://www.biosecurity.govt.nz/imports/animals/standards/fisornic.all.htm Ah thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reef Posted November 15, 2010 Report Share Posted November 15, 2010 I am not trying to rubbish the proposal, only to point out that there will be considerable criteria to be met. You are not wrong. ERMA is trying to discourage anyone adding more fish species. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ymir Posted November 16, 2010 Report Share Posted November 16, 2010 You are not wrong. ERMA is trying to discourage anyone adding more fish species. I understand this and in some cases it is for good reason. However, if the rules are followed and the species met the requirements then the fish should be added to the list. Not all species will get on the list just because we want them to be. The two major factors that should be looked at before time and money is spent on a fish species is: to actually talk to the suppliers to or in NZ, to see what is available on the open market and the retail cost of it once it is here. These should be the deciding factors on what species are looked at. If people wish to pursue less likely or expensive fish that is their choice. Personally I am looking to this as a challenge: Can some of the desired fish actually get on the list. "Better to try and fail, than never try at all." As mentioned before, I am happy to do the donkey work for any dwarf African cichlid species and if it happens to be a species I would like to see in the country I will even throw some money into the pot for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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