oeminx Posted August 24, 2009 Report Share Posted August 24, 2009 My suspicion is the it is a parasitic worm of some sorts but not sure after that i don't know. It looks like a worm in a translucent bubble with some raised scales around the edge. So Any idea of what it is and how to treat?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo Posted August 24, 2009 Report Share Posted August 24, 2009 what other symptoms, is the fish swimming rapidly or slowly. Is it eating etc. Hard to tell if its a worm like anchor worms or a bacteria. I have never seen anything like that but I would probably start by isolating him and trying Tonic or Salt just to see. Next guess would be PP at 1 - 1.5ppm or Formalin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twinkles Posted August 24, 2009 Report Share Posted August 24, 2009 can't help but i have to say those are brilliant photos, best i could do would be a blue and red blur lol. That worm is downright creepy and gross Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firenzenz Posted August 24, 2009 Report Share Posted August 24, 2009 Hi Cant tell you what is is either. I showed this thread to friends last night who had the same problem. They bought fifty cardinals for their discus show tank. Luckily they have a quarantine policy as they eventually had to euthansie the lot because of the same problem. The bubble eventually bursts and a pussy white filament exudes and trails. The tails almost rotted completely away. Over 2-3 weeks they tried prazi, furan2, methyline blue and prescribed meds, (antibiotics) from a Vet and nothing worked. They spent hundreds trying to solve the problem. My understanding is that these cardinals were imported by a particular importer as local stocks couldn't supply demand. Sorry cant help more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryanjury Posted August 24, 2009 Report Share Posted August 24, 2009 This does look bizare, I would probably try PP as it would clean whatever it is off hopefully.. It would be gutting to buy these (especially 50 of them!) if they were indeed a bad batch and carrying something nasty and all die Good luck I hope you have them separated? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo Posted August 24, 2009 Report Share Posted August 24, 2009 I think by looking at it the hardest problem is getting meds to it. It looks like its protected by either the skin of the fish or a coating of some sort. Perhaps, for the sake of 1 fish, kull it and try to remove whatever it is. You will soon tell if it is a worm or just puss. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oeminx Posted August 24, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 24, 2009 Thanks for the help guys, I have one other that has 1 worm on its tail so I would like to find a way of treating it encase i have any more cases pop up Other symptoms of the fish are just a tendency to hide a bit more. they still eat fine and swim normally. Also PP? :oops: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanmin4304 Posted August 24, 2009 Report Share Posted August 24, 2009 PP = potasium permangenate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oeminx Posted August 24, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 24, 2009 should have guessed that one :oops: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxjxa Posted August 25, 2009 Report Share Posted August 25, 2009 I've had this before! Although my bubbles were rounder and the worm more curled up. I also found that it did not affect the fish's behavior much, but after time it looked like the worm had "bitten too deep" and the bubble filled with blood. Still didn't affect the fishie. I couldn't treat it with anything either, or even identify it! Eventually it spread from one fish to a second so I culled the infected. Using tweezers the bubble is easily popped and the worm can be removed, but good luck attempting that without killing the fish. Once the infected fish were removed, it didn't appear in my tank again, so I'd recommend getting rid of your wee guy. Or at least keeping him in a separate tank. Sorry I couldn't be more help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southerrrngirrl Posted August 25, 2009 Report Share Posted August 25, 2009 I have a feeling I've seen it too, no idea what it is sorry but it was at the local LFS, think it was on a tetra and it seemed to be the only one affected. I'm finding this gross but interesting. Would the removal of the parasite, say by just pulling it out be enough to kill the fish? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bronze-dragon Posted August 25, 2009 Report Share Posted August 25, 2009 Would the removal of the parasite, say by just pulling it out be enough to kill the fish? how would you get a cardinal to stay still (with out it being dead) long enough to do that? sounds like it has actually become part of the fish tho, you would prolly rip and expose the fishes internal organs either while trying to remove the parasite, or by the parasite no longer being there to hold the host body together. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oeminx Posted August 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 25, 2009 Well I have heard of people knocking fish out with clove oil to work on them. So I might give that a try and remove the worms under anaesthesia and if it looks like the removal of the worms has done to much damage I can then cull it without ever removing it from its sleep. Foxjxa that sounds just like what is happening here but no blood bubble yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southerrrngirrl Posted August 25, 2009 Report Share Posted August 25, 2009 Yeah under anasthetic is what I was thinking. Good luck with that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oeminx Posted August 27, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 27, 2009 Well yesterday I got some clove oil and I have just finish putting them under. It works very well they went under in 2 1/2 mins and at a rate ~50mg/L and have recovered in 7-10 mins As for removing the worms I got the two big ones in the photo, they were very easy to remove like Foxjxa said. there was one other worm on the fish in the photo on his other side which when I tried to remove it I squeezed it a bit to hard and split the worm and I missed removing a piece of it but I wont put him back under for a day or 2. On the other 2 Cardinals the worms are a lot smaller and on the anal fin and the tail with no bubble and I could not seem to get a pair of tweezers on them to remove them. So ill have to wait to see if I can get them once they are bigger OR and I don't know how plausible this is Is it possible to cut out the small section of the fin??? :-? I have seen pretty torn up fins regrow on killies but I have no idea on how it will effect the fish if cut. I don't really want to go cutting fins but if it is going to save its life I will. Any one any ideas??? Am I being an idiot even thinking of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caryl Posted August 27, 2009 Report Share Posted August 27, 2009 I think you could cut away bits of fin as long as you did not get too close to the actual body. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stella Posted August 27, 2009 Report Share Posted August 27, 2009 interesting surgery! Yes, you can cut fins. Just make sure you have very sharp small scissors (eg nail scissors) and clean them up first. A large fish has fins that are quite tough to cut through. You (and the fish) can feel every fin ray! But yours look little so it shouldn't be too hard. The important bit for fin regrowth is not to affect the line where the fin joins the body. As long as there is a little bit of fin left it will grow back fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenix44 Posted August 27, 2009 Report Share Posted August 27, 2009 you can cut fins, and they will regrow. just keep the water in good nick as they are more prone to diseases at that stage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oeminx Posted August 27, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 27, 2009 Instead of scissors I was thinking about getting a sterile scalpel. Also I would only have to take out 2 fin rays is it better to take out just the 2 or cut the whole fin off? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenix44 Posted August 27, 2009 Report Share Posted August 27, 2009 yes. i presumed you would use a scalpel and not scissors. i recommend a meth blue-H2O dip straight after. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxjxa Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 Ew But otherwise it's good to hear that you're making progress!! I'd imagine the fishies will be very vulnerable to disease and infection after all these operations, good luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oeminx Posted August 29, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 Well I removed the pieces of the fins which had the worms on them today all went smoothly, gave them a meth-blue bath after surgery and they are all looking good. . I'll will be keeping a close eye on them for a while yet be for the can join the rest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbunting Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 POP IT WITH A NEEDLE AND REMOVE IT WITH TWESSERS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sophia Posted December 20, 2009 Report Share Posted December 20, 2009 hey, what was the outcome of this in the end - did the fish live - did anyone else get the worms? Last week I had a cardinal tetra that had something very similar, it looked like a tiny white leech stuck to the back near the tail and I couldn't find anything on google that looked like it. Ended up euthanising the fish and pulling the thing off for a look but still no further enlightened - it wasn't an anchor or camallanus worm, nothing usual. I was hoping that was the end of it but today I have discovered another of the cardinals has something wrong with it's gill - it looks like something is protruding slightly from there and he/she yawns occasionally but is otherwise fine. LFS has sold me some formalin that I intend to treat the whole tank with - if there are parasites in the tank I don't just want to bath one or 2. Am a bit stuck really. I want to kill the bugs but I don't want to hurt the fish or cull any more of them! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oeminx Posted December 20, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 20, 2009 I had 4 infected in total, 2 I saved and are still health and happy in the main school again. 2 I culled after the both got a worm behind there eyes. are you worms in a little clear bubble? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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