supasi Posted January 2, 2009 Report Share Posted January 2, 2009 Went snooping in a small stream today in Wanganui. Never seen it before, but are keen to go back. The creek/stream is only a few inches deep. In it were lots of little fish. looked a bit like bullies, but schooled together. Do bullies scholl in streams? If not, what will they prob be? Will go back at some stage and try catch them. Maybe try at night. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smidey Posted January 2, 2009 Report Share Posted January 2, 2009 white bait school don't they? Could also be mullet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supasi Posted January 2, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 2, 2009 Two far away from sea to be mullet. the stream goes into a lake from across farmland. Thought maybe whitebait, but just didnt look right. they were bigger with more of a gray colour. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smidey Posted January 2, 2009 Report Share Posted January 2, 2009 Two far away from sea to be mullet. the stream goes into a lake from across farmland. Thought maybe whitebait, but just didnt look right. they were bigger with more of a gray colour. you'd be suprised how far animals will travel. my friends waterfall in the tangihua ranges half way between whangarei & dargaville had a seal in it, DOC thought i would have traveled 50km along stream, creaks & drains to get there. bigger with more grey sounds like mullet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stella Posted January 2, 2009 Report Share Posted January 2, 2009 Weird..... Inanga can be small for a while, but they really don't look like bullies. By looking like bullies you mean what exactly? How did they behave (schooling tightly, loosely etc?) HaNs says he has seen bullies schooling in Lake Taupo. I don't exactly disbelieve him..... but I have never heard of it elsewhere and am not sure how they would do it (as in they usually sit on the ground and move in very short spurts). What about smelt? But they look exactly like inanga from above... Actually gambusia might be possible.... I have heard there are some around Wanganui (KILLKILLKILL!) and with the fat fronts they could look bully-esque and are small.... Intriguing, keep us informed! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supasi Posted January 2, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 2, 2009 Hope to go back with some nets soon. Will take some pics Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enzoom1 Posted January 2, 2009 Report Share Posted January 2, 2009 HaNs says he has seen bullies schooling in Lake Taupo. I don't exactly disbelieve him..... but I have never heard of it elsewhere and am not sure how they would do it (as in they usually sit on the ground and move in very short spurts). I've said this before in a past post, but at the edge of Lake Rotoito (which is next to lake taupo) there was a school of bullies. They were schooling loosely and there had to be atleast 70-100 of small to large sized ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanmin4304 Posted January 2, 2009 Report Share Posted January 2, 2009 trout---I caught about a dozen years ago but they didn't like being in my pond and hardly grew at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stella Posted January 3, 2009 Report Share Posted January 3, 2009 Enzoom1, I am really interested in these schooling bullies. How do they do it? Could you give a good description please? I mean, bullies don't normally swim about higher up in the water (with the possible exception of dominant ones). They usually sit on the bottom and move about in very short spurts. I could definitely imagine in a lake the bullies swimming off a short distance when scared by a diver could look like schooling. I am not trying to sound totally dubious, I just don't understand how they would do it. (edit for spelling...) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stella Posted January 3, 2009 Report Share Posted January 3, 2009 Tiny trout look pretty thin from above, not much like bullies. Did yours school, Alan? From what I have seen of tiny trout they skitter about in the shallows, settling to face upstream, but any appearance of 'schooling' would be from all wanting to be in the same microhabitat. Hope you are able to get out to the stream again soon, Supasi! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanmin4304 Posted January 3, 2009 Report Share Posted January 3, 2009 They were landlocked in a pond beside the Wiamakariri and I thought they were not bullies by the way they were shoaling and managed to scare them into a plastic bag. After two years in a goldfish pond by themselves they doubled in size and got released back to the waimakariri. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spoon Posted January 3, 2009 Report Share Posted January 3, 2009 i was gunna ask about the same thing ive caught them in my creek but nt really obsevred them i went to the ashley river gorge the other day and seen thousands of them along the bank it the shallow water(also very warm ) biggest i seen was 2.5cm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enzoom1 Posted January 3, 2009 Report Share Posted January 3, 2009 Enzoom1, I am really interested in these schooling bullies. How do they do it? Could you give a good description please? I mean, bullies don't normally swim about higher up in the water (with the possible exception of dominant ones). They usually sit on the bottom and move about in very short spurts. I could definitely imagine in a lake the bullies swimming off a short distance when scared by a diver could look like schooling. I am not trying to sound totally dubious, I just don't understand how they would do it. (edit for spelling...) There was one or two that "floated" near the surface of the water but they dart away when your hand goes near. They were like you said loosely school, they were spread over and area of about 1m squared. And yes they were definately bullies but I'm sorry to say i cant remember exactly what they looked like. :-? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HaNs Posted January 3, 2009 Report Share Posted January 3, 2009 Iv been seeing heaps of smelt schooling as of late, 200-300+ in a school. They school nothing like the bullies did/do. Bullies do short sharp movements and they dont do it all that often, i didnt even notice them schooling untill i took time to watch them, when iv seen them do it the population has been huge in the area(like over populated). Some of them seem to be even social sharing hiding spots(some odd spots) A school of 30+ smelt in a tank would be untimate. Hope that makes sense, my brain is failing today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stella Posted January 4, 2009 Report Share Posted January 4, 2009 HaNs, 30+ smelt in a tank WOULD be awesome! I have never actually kept smelt. Never had the space or organisation to do it. You need to be really organised as they do not cope with stress one bit. Apparently they transport ok if really chilled out (literally) Caught them only once, really really pretty shiny fish. I find (in the aquarium) when there are no clearly dominant bullies, they will play this little game of taking each other's spots. Fish One takes the spot of Fish Two, who takes the spot of Fish Three, all as if choreographed! Try that in a tank with a bit of hierachy and someone gets their arse kicked.... A study was done on submerged waterplants in certain lakes and they constructed a platform that was anchored to the ground and suspended midwater. It was full of pots of plants. The bullies took over, pulled out the plants, excavated the soil and started breeding in it like high-density bully spawning apartments! Bullies rock. If you want to see fascinating interactions, 'safe' territorialism and spawning behaviours, get bullies Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snorkelboy Posted January 4, 2009 Report Share Posted January 4, 2009 Bullies do school. I have seen it with my own eyes. Just a couple of days ago while scuba diving in Lake Rotoma, Rotorua. They form a loose grouping in their hundreds, more likely thousands, at about 15-20 meters. Next time I,m down there I'll take a photo to prove it. :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stella Posted January 4, 2009 Report Share Posted January 4, 2009 That would be wonderful! Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snorkelboy Posted January 4, 2009 Report Share Posted January 4, 2009 Thinking about it, I reckon it is a response to the enviroment that they are living in. In a large enviroment like a lake, they gather in vast numbers in an area where they are comfortable, mabee this is temperature related or could even be food or shelter related. But gather they do, not in tightly packed schools moving as one, like some fish do, more like a loose association consisting of possibly billions of individuals. I hope that makes sense! Last time I was diving there I was ascending from 30meters (where it is a really cold 12*C), getting to around 17meters the water temp got noticeablly warmer and a dense band of weed was growing. It was here that the bullies were extremely abundant. The trout in this lake feed almost exclusively on the bullies. Many are infected with whitespot, the bullies that is.... However, weirdly, I have never seen a trout with white-spot? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stella Posted January 6, 2009 Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 Yeah, that sounds like what I was imagining. McDowall's big book (they all have virtually the same name) has an interesting section on parasites. Apparently in summer when temps get high it is possible for (usually lake) bullies to get such bad whitespot there are mass deaths! I have caught bullies in the wild with a few, but it is much less likely to cause death (large waterbody, usually lots of current, less prolonged stress... aside from all the predators....) I wonder if it is harder for the freeswimming whitespot to get a hold of a big trout? Thick scales etc. Might be on gills instead. Almost all of the parasites in the wild here are native ones (or are all around the world, like whitespot). Most have a multi-host lifecycle, first in an invertebrate, then in the fish that eats the invertebrate, then sometimes in the bird that eats the fish. Something in trout seems to arrest their development. It is possible trout are actually benefiting the natives: acting as a 'sink' for parasites. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turtlemantaken Posted January 6, 2009 Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 My guess is young Perch, yet to shape or colour, there are hundreds round at the moment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supasi Posted January 6, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 My guess is young Perch, yet to shape or colour, there are hundreds round at the moment. I have not yet made it back to the stream, But youg perch could very well be it. The stream runs into a local lake that has lots of perch in it.(ive caught them with a rod) I never thought of perch, silly me :oops: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MalcolmX Posted May 21, 2009 Report Share Posted May 21, 2009 i remember seeing large schools(1000s) of small perch in tomahawk lagoon years ago, they reminded me of bullies but more mobile - not as jumpy allong the bottom. what about mosquito fish, do they school? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livingart Posted May 21, 2009 Report Share Posted May 21, 2009 yes Dambusia school Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olly Posted May 21, 2009 Report Share Posted May 21, 2009 I have seen bullies school in the Makeretu River in Wairoa. Each fish shoots forward to the front of the school and stops on the bottom until the rest of the school has passed over it, then shoots forward again. It looks really cool when there are hundreds of them, and it is almost impossible to keep your eye on one individual. The school seems to roll along the bottom, I've never seen any other fish do it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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