Afrikan Posted July 10, 2008 Report Share Posted July 10, 2008 Quarantine is a good idea, I agree, I have found rather a few fish that have come in from importation needing a good dose of treatments, especially a fair few of the africans that have come in off and on... in recent times. And the Gold Saum that we recently got, boy did they need treatment Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kd123 Posted July 10, 2008 Report Share Posted July 10, 2008 I have read an article (late last year and dont have the link sorry) which was putting forward the theory mentioned by Spidersweb above. I know people at the lfs here in Chch had also heard of it but weren't publically advocating it.... The article made the point that it was important to have the bag open if it was to be floated.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whetu Posted July 10, 2008 Report Share Posted July 10, 2008 Q-tank is definitely the way to go. Then you can set it up as close as possible to the shop's tanks (you can call and ask them their pH, temp, etc in advance) and make any changes very slowly. I wouldn't personally use the drip-line method in winter - one of the reasons I float the bag (in the Q-tank) is to make sure any temp changes are done slowly. An unheated bucket sitting on the floor is going to be much colder than the tank, so when you move the fish they will still suffer a thermal shock. When floating the bags, I undo the knot and roll down the edge of the bag, then use a clothes peg or two, to peg the rolled edge of the bag onto the side of the tank. This makes sure the bag can't accidentally discharge the shop water into my tank. I then scoop water into the bag at intervals, gradually increasing the proportion of tank water to shop water. After a while (depending on how delicate the fish is, and how patient I am) I net the fish out of the bag and put the bag water down the drain. After an appropriate time in quarantine, I then net the fish out again and put them in my main tank. As for toxins in the shop bags - complete and utter nonsense! And why on earth would having both sides of the bags touching the water make even the tiniest bit of difference?! Sounds like the person who said this is not particularly bright and thinks everyone else is just as dim as them. What a ridiculous thing to say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whetu Posted July 10, 2008 Report Share Posted July 10, 2008 .... The article made the point that it was important to have the bag open if it was to be floated.... I agree. And also to not have too many fish in a single bag, especially if they are a delicate type. For example if you're buying maybe 10 rummy nose tetras, you should ask the shop to put five in each bag rather than putting them all in together. This will slow the build-up of toxins in the bag. In my opinion a reputable LFS would do this anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VinsonMassif Posted July 10, 2008 Report Share Posted July 10, 2008 I wouldn't personally use the drip-line method in winter - one of the reasons I float the bag (in the Q-tank) is to make sure any temp changes are done slowly. An unheated bucket sitting on the floor is going to be much colder than the tank, so when you move the fish they will still suffer a thermal shock. Bollocks. Unless you live in a freezer. If your room is really that cold just put a heater in the bucket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deno Posted July 10, 2008 Report Share Posted July 10, 2008 I have seen a staff member, take fish from 2 seperate tanks and put them in the same plastic bag, which surprised me. When we got to the counter, he was taken aside by a senior staffer who realised what he'd done and told them off basically, but I overheard. But then they let it slide anyway. I said "no thanks, i don't want the fish now". No oxygen or stresszyme was added to the bag either, even they knew I had an hours travelling to get the fish home. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David R Posted July 10, 2008 Report Share Posted July 10, 2008 An hours travelling isn't long enough to require oxygen. I've frequently taken fish from auckland to whangarei and from hamilton to whangarei on 2-3 hour trips without oxygen. Some shops have their tanks all connected on one central system, so the water in one tank will be the same as the next. I take it this shop didn't? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpidersWeb Posted July 10, 2008 Report Share Posted July 10, 2008 If the fish are going in to the same tank, then using the same bag is perfectly fine. You can also say 'NO NO NO different bag please' when they're serving you (I do this if I think the bag is overloaded or I want them in seperate tanks when I get home). When sending, or giving away or selling fish I don't put stress zyme in either, and neither does our local store. Animates often does but not always. I'd rather avoid having another chemical in my tank to be honest. They should've blown up the bag with air, and sealed it off so that it was a bit like a baloon. If it was floppy then thats unacceptable, but they shouldn't be adding any oxygen type product to the bag. An hour trip is fine, fish are usually sent by overnight courier in those bags. I do get a bit paranoid when doing 8 hour trips, but so far I haven't had a loss from long delivery in a bag. Have had losses with buckets though :oops: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whetu Posted July 10, 2008 Report Share Posted July 10, 2008 Bollocks. Unless you live in a freezer. If your room is really that cold just put a heater in the bucket. :lol: Well VM, maybe I do live in a freezer! I live in an old house with no insulation and a wooden floor, so maybe my situation is different to most people's but I know I can't walk around the house in bare feet or I'd get frostbite on my toes! As for a heater in a plastic bucket, I think that is a good idea as long as the heater is kept well away from the sides. Remember the heater-metre rule! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
new zealand discus man Posted July 11, 2008 Report Share Posted July 11, 2008 Best in a long time ..The only thing that will kill over night if not sooner is rapid water change..PH going lower is Death..Very quickly..Temp going down the same..Higher major change the same..Letalone nitrates etc.. Drowned ..Well... All fish have to be conditioned over at least an hour or expect the worst.. Cheers Phill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim r Posted July 12, 2008 Report Share Posted July 12, 2008 Not only is it possible for fish to drown but they can also sufficate like the discus fish I bought last year from an importer in Auckland who has made comment on this subject and put 40mm fish in bags 50mm wide by 300mm high 2/3rds filled with water and (no fault of his were misdirected to HAWKES BAY). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanmin4304 Posted July 12, 2008 Report Share Posted July 12, 2008 I have just received a dozen tadpoles that are soon to morph and were sent in a 2 litre container with a small amount of water at about 2.30pm Tuesday. They were to be sent by overnight courier but mistakenly ended up in normal post. They have therefore been sent from Auckland by truck and delivered on the posties pushbike. Arrived Friday afternoon and to my complete surprise are all OK. Imported fish are expected to be in transit for up to 36 hours and I have seen successful imports that have been in transit for a lot longer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caryl Posted July 12, 2008 Report Share Posted July 12, 2008 I had a labyrinth fish I am sure drowned after getting trapped in some plants. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
new zealand discus man Posted July 12, 2008 Report Share Posted July 12, 2008 Hi With out pure oxygen in bag the fish are likely to just run out of breathing stuff.. Cant see how fish can drown but some fish can die because of to much oxygen..ie fighters...... Couriers often mix up so thats why in imported the 40 Hour heat pads..Many are now using them and i send a photo of how to set up in box..They to are another reason that fish die..If no oxygen in box heat pads stop working.. Cheers Phill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caper Posted July 13, 2008 Report Share Posted July 13, 2008 Anytime I've purchased fish I open the bag and put it to float (making sure what water can't out). After 15 minutes I start adding some tank water to the bag and then more every 5 minutes for another 15 minutes. Occasionally I have stretched it out a bit more I think. But have always netted the fish out. I remember the time I went to a pet shop that did sell fish (they're closed now), anyway, the woman went to put the bag IN the tank to get the fish. I had to ask her NOT to do that and I held the bag while she poured water in and caught the fish. For those that use the bucket/drip method, is there any particular reason that you do it that way? Caper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
new zealand discus man Posted July 13, 2008 Report Share Posted July 13, 2008 Hi I tell all my clients to open bag and float..The over the next 30 to 40 minutes to add tank water about 50mls at a time..But the time the bag is full then just let swim out in there own time..The bucket way is doing the same thing but more auto..Most buyers have several bags to deal with so then bucket way is not to practical... If a serious fish keeper you should have a digital PH Meter...If so they can be added much quicker as is PH shock is what kills fish over night.. I have found that going up minor amounts in PH never has caused and worrys but a PH drop of one PH can be fatal to many fish..Temp up or down one degree C is normally of but no more then back to the start of note and go through full conditioning.. Another TRAP.....Liguid PH testers usually have a fixed range like.. 6.8 to 7.4 is very common... 6.8 usually shows yellow BUT in fact to PH could be way lower and the fish can handle to a degree for a time..Then start to become sick and die off..So if even after conditioning they are then added to extremely acid water they to are likely to die over night.. Trick with ph testers testing what you think is 6.8..Go to common tap water and should test blue and then take the same amount of tank to tap add together,.,Do test..If still yellow proves very dangerous water..If was 6.8 it should have gone to 7 and show greenish.. Be carefull doing ,,major adjustments Take plenty of time Major adjustment are required before releasing your new fish.. I not to long back purchased fish my self and found the water in fact was just 3.9 Ph..It was three days before i took out of bin and added to new tank...I did not want to increase to rain at 6.5 any quicker as shock may have killed the all... Good Fishing and hope notes help..PS..When buyer follow instructions never has there been any losses..Cheers Phill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caper Posted July 13, 2008 Report Share Posted July 13, 2008 new zealand discuss man wrote: But the time the bag is full then just let swim out in there own time I do like the idea of letting them swim out on there own since I find trying to net them in a bag is causing stress but as you have read most don't allow the tank from stores to go into their own tanks. So, do you think it is okay then???? Caper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
new zealand discus man Posted July 14, 2008 Report Share Posted July 14, 2008 Hi If worried about shop water then you should not be be putting there fish in ether...So if the water is a problem so automatically is the fish...If you know the seller and its up to your faith in them..Always check the gut area for sunkin or dark colour there will mean bactrica or bugs..Worms.. The only time i have sperated is when imported say from Peru the water and fish go in to 40 L bins and conditioning is done over 2 hours with the same quality fresh water thats was already put into tanks,... Then just netted out as the imported water gets clorinated... Cheers Phill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dixon1990 Posted July 14, 2008 Report Share Posted July 14, 2008 I have just received a dozen tadpoles that are soon to morph and were sent in a 2 litre container with a small amount of water at about 2.30pm Tuesday. They were to be sent by overnight courier but mistakenly ended up in normal post. They have therefore been sent from Auckland by truck and delivered on the posties pushbike. Arrived Friday afternoon and to my complete surprise are all OK. Imported fish are expected to be in transit for up to 36 hours and I have seen successful imports that have been in transit for a lot longer. What kind of tadpoles? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caper Posted July 14, 2008 Report Share Posted July 14, 2008 Thanks Phill Trust, hmmm, well we only have one place here that sells fish and it's a department store so if I want fish that's the only place I can go. Just a note on that though, went to the same named department store in Calgary and the tanks there were much more like you'd see in a pet shop!!!! When I do purchase fish I just try my best to pick out what looks like a healthy fish. Caper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
new zealand discus man Posted July 14, 2008 Report Share Posted July 14, 2008 Hi Avoid stock that you see has just arrived as trouble takes a few days to show,,Stress is a strange thing..Healthy fish are often made sick just because moved and resorces go down so if plenty of what your watching give 2 or 3 days to rest then pick......Cheers Phill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caper Posted July 14, 2008 Report Share Posted July 14, 2008 I agree with what you are saying regarding waiting 2 or 3 days. The only problem is that most times if you wait chances are the fish will be gone. It is rare that you can still get what you want after 2 or 3 days (depending on what you are buying of course). I have tried that but often missed out. How I wish one of the major pet stores would come here 8) Caper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
new zealand discus man Posted July 14, 2008 Report Share Posted July 14, 2008 Hi Good fish business for sale... Link Removed My business..Cheers Phill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caper Posted July 14, 2008 Report Share Posted July 14, 2008 Oh, why not come over here and start one up...we're only on the otherside of the world! :lol: :lol: Caper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
new zealand discus man Posted July 14, 2008 Report Share Posted July 14, 2008 Yes . may be get a day off and go fishing to...Phill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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