wasp

Uncontrollable variables? Hmmm... Wonder what they are?

OK, Good thinking. It is not what I thought you were going to say. Very interesting idea. Not heard it before, I'll have to look into it. Please take TWO LARGE BROWNY POINTS

Nasty bi products? - We have already discussed your "rust" claim. Habib just said it! Well it is not rocket science, and he IS a chemist. The processes are different? Please explain.

Not being cheeky or anything, but you said I was wrong about the "rust" as you call it. And I quote - It's just that I was getting a little tired of being told I was wrong about things when you never had any evidence. I therefore asked you to explain why you said that and you could not. However rather than go on about it I let it go, it was a chemist who later chipped in with the evidence to show you were wrong. So now you're saying that paper has no relevence to Zeovit. You are wrong. Let's see your reasons. By the way, I'm pretty sure I already know the reason you will give, and if it is what I think you are going to say, it is wrong, and I will explain why.

Edit - wrong thread.

What is it that works? well it IS bacteria. However I'll have to give Layton a brownie point, it is looking increasingly likely that his suspicions have been correct, that the zeobac is a bacteria enhancer, rather than actual bacteria. That is not conclusively shown yet though, the only bottle tested so far has already been in use 3 months, they need to test a new bottle. Course, Layton has to give me the brownie point back, because I was correct about the "rust" :lol: Why am I sure it is bacteria? I'll refer you back to this " http://pubwww.srce.hr/ftbrfd/41-157.pdf Summary The objective of this study was to achieve better efficiency of phosphorus removal in an enhanced biological phosphorus removal process by upgrading the system with different amounts of natural zeolite addition. The system performance for synthetic wastewater containing different carbon sources applied at different initial concentrations of phosphorus, as well as for municipal wastewater, was investigated. Natural zeolite addition in the aerobic phase of the anaerobic/aerobic bioaugmented activated sludge system contributed to a significant improvement of phosphorus removal in systems with synthetic wastewater and fresh municipal wastewater. Improvement of phosphorus removal with regard to the control reactors was higher with the addition of 15 than with 5 g/L of natural zeolite. In reactors with natural zeolite addition with regard to the control reactors significantly decreased chemical oxygen demand, ammonium and nitrate, while higher increment and better-activated sludge settling were achieved, without changes in the pH-values of the medium. It was shown that the natural zeolite particles are suitable support material for the phosphate-accumulating bacteria Acinetobacter calcoaceticus (DSM 1532), which were adsorbed on the particle surface, resulting in increased biological activity of the system. The process of phosphorus removal in a system with bioaugmented activated sludge and natural zeolite addition consisted of: metabolic activity of activated sludge, phosphorus uptake by phosphate-accumulating bacteria adsorbed on the natural zeolite particles and suspended in solution, and phosphorus adsorption on the natural zeolite particles. " So have we been mislead about how zeovit works? well at this point I just don't know. But will I stop using the system? Well NO. It is the best thing that has happened to my tank. Also I keep hearing that the zeovit results are the effect of better husbandry that zeovit recommend. Actually when I went zeovit, I changed nothing else, other than lowering the alkalinity.

:lol: :lol: :lol:

This link http://funpic.hu/swf/numanuma.html was posted recently on another board by a guy calling himself Zeohead. He is saying how much he appreciates the product, you can see his tank in the background. You will have to turn the sound UP Those with dial up might have to wait maybe 5 minutes for it to load, but it's worth it - Trust Me.

if they are in conditions they don't like, such as insufficient light, they may let go, hoping to find a better spot.

Can be pretty difficult. One more successful, but time consuming method I've tried is to use a needle and thread, stick it right through the mushroom and sew it on to the rock. Some of them will still gradually work loose though. Another way is to drill a number of holes into the rock about 15 mls deep, chop the mushroom into several pieces and drop a piece in each hole. Provided there is not enough current to wash them out, they will eventually attach and grow out the hole. Good Luck!

I once had a Muriwai biotope, and it did look good, had a heap of stuff but the most colourful was those beautiful anemones from the rock pools over there. But it did suffer from high temp, eventually I released everything and made the tank a tropical. There is a pool at milford beach that still has some of those anemones that I "planted" there. Been there a few years now, but not really prospering, like they do at Muriwai.

Layton - I think I have found the answer to your questioning about UV & ozone in relation to zeovit. The bit quoted from JB NY is in reference to another party attempting to speculate zeovit leaches something harmful. Here is a cut and paste from Reef Central:- Pardon the RC regurge "quote: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Originally posted by JB NY He thinks it is Iron and Aluminum, didn't we already agree to this like ten pages ago? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Joe, As far as I know he has speculated many things. Even if it is iron or aluminum are there any studies which show that one or both of them can give the results one is seeing? FWIW I also don't see the link to not using UV or ozone. Just in case: If he comes out speculating that organics bound to them will release the metals in toxic amounts when UV or ozone or both are used then I'll prove that it was another speculation". __________________ This post is by Habib, (Mr. Salifert) And again by Habib :- "Is there a concern for leaching, Some have speculated that the Zeovit zeolite is leaching things into the water causing the effects. IMO there are plenty of experiments showing this NOT to be the case. I think those speculations can be ruled out". __________________

Well - is it a glorified carbon, and does it reduce phosphate?

Hey, this is getting circuitus. Let's talk Purigen!

What? Yeah the problems I heard about were on Reef Central. So?

. ? You've lost me.

Dunno. Let's fight about Purigen! :lol: :lol: :lol:

Problems? I cannot think of any problems with coral health in my tank (Humble as it may be) In the zeovit tanks I've seen, 4 total, didn't see any problems. I've heard about problems, and in every case I can think of it is beginners who overdosed. What about all the non zeovit tanks with problems?

I was talking to Cracker.

Hmmm... Well maybe this zeolite thing is more complex than we thought? Talking coral losses and other supposed zeovit related problems, if you overdose kalk you'll get problems. So is the problem in the kalk, or in the overdosing? I've taken things quietly, not overdosed, and have lost nothing other than one frag due to a powerhead accident. Admittedly I don't exactly have a huge number of corals, but what I do have is nice and healthy.

Hmmm... Well perhaps you're onto something, but really I wouldn't know. However I would have thought that too much Al2S3 floating around would have a negative effect on corals. Hows that anemone? still on the mend?

Here is another one of those "I dissagree you're wrong" statements with no explanation or evidence. Please explain how it is that iron ions cannot end up as rust?

How do you think iron ions will end up? It begins with R and I tilt the balance - no trouble

Sorry but I cannot be bothered running through that again. Much of what you need to know about the benefits of iron can be found in these 2 studies http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/aug2002/chem.htm and http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/oct2002/chem.htm Really you do get everything I say confused/ twisted/ screwed up. What I said was the tank can run on the ordinary bacteria that are there, but with zeovit we dose a culure of the best bacteria to keep the balance tilted in the best direction. To put it plainly, I did not agree that dosing bacteria to a tank will not be beneficial.

No need to test those. It is already published that zeovit rock will leach iron in quantities likely beneficial to a aquarium. Hydrogen Sulphide is a non issue, it is possible it may not or may be produced in tiny quantities, proportionately of little / no consequence against the amount that will likely be getting produced in the anearobic zones of any properly functioning reef tank. Also I am interested in the zeovit rock in particular, not zeolite in general of which there are many types, for different purposes. Also, just incase there is still anybody who thinks zeolite is not useful for phosphate removal, here is some info:- http://pubwww.srce.hr/ftbrfd/41-157.pdf Summary The objective of this study was to achieve better efficiency of phosphorus removal in an enhanced biological phosphorus removal process by upgrading the system with different amounts of natural zeolite addition. The system performance for synthetic wastewater containing different carbon sources applied at different initial concentrations of phosphorus, as well as for municipal wastewater, was investigated. Natural zeolite addition in the aerobic phase of the anaerobic/aerobic bioaugmented activated sludge system contributed to a significant improvement of phosphorus removal in systems with synthetic wastewater and fresh municipal wastewater. Improvement of phosphorus removal with regard to the control reactors was higher with the addition of 15 than with 5 g/L of natural zeolite. In reactors with natural zeolite addition with regard to the control reactors significantly decreased chemical oxygen demand, ammonium and nitrate, while higher increment and better-activated sludge settling were achieved, without changes in the pH-values of the medium. It was shown that the natural zeolite particles are suitable support material for the phosphate-accumulating bacteria Acinetobacter calcoaceticus (DSM 1532), which were adsorbed on the particle surface, resulting in increased biological activity of the system. The process of phosphorus removal in a system with bioaugmented activated sludge and natural zeolite addition consisted of: metabolic activity of activated sludge, phosphorus uptake by phosphate-accumulating bacteria adsorbed on the natural zeolite particles and suspended in solution, and phosphorus adsorption on the natural zeolite particles. Key words: Acinetobacter calcoaceticus, activated sludge, bioaugmentation, natural zeolite, phosphorus removal, wastewater Maybe is Acinetobacter calcoaceticus in zeobak aditions