Sheepsnana Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 I was attempting to remove the bubbles from my canister filter by flushing it. So I started to fill the 300L tank (with the slate back), got the CF1000 pumping, emptying out into a small 50L tank, and had a syphon taking that out a window into the garden... Turns out, the flow into the 300L was EXTREMELY faster than the flow through the CF1000, and the tank overfilled into the lounge :slfg: the wife wasn't happy :an!gry but thankfully she wasn't near her jandals. So I turned the tap off, and removed the hose, and then the next big shock hit me. BUGS. There were about 20 earwigs in the slates, 4 beetles, and a small colony of ants living in the slate. The water had driven them out of the slate, and into the lounge. Thankfully my neighbour could pop round to help me lift the tank outside, once it had drained. The stand is now drying in the garage, and the driftwood is outside, but still soaking in the tank, on the BBQ table. what a nightmare. ANYWAY... The reason for this post, other than to give you all a good laugh, is to ask. How can my CF1000 (and my CF1200 also now, although I am unsure as to why both decided to play up at the same time) have begun filling with air, from no apparent source. They are closed, and running, but there is air trapped inside. I tried to flush it out, even went through a 300L tank, and still there is more and more air inside. Surely if there was a leak in the Canister Filter, then water would be coming out? There is no air coming in from the intake, although when the filters stall the air comes up the intake, until it rights itself. there are plenty of bubbles coming through the outtake (which makes it quite noisy) but I can never get them all out of the filter. I'm all ears. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueether Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 Could be degasing, but sounds like too much air for that. Are all the connections tight? The push together ones on the U bends, the short collar ones, the screw and the hose joiner on the canister... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheepsnana Posted March 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 Everything seems tight. I don't see any air coming in through the intake, and when I release the priming plug water comes gushing out before any air does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryanjury Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 Lube all the o rings with some silicone grease or vas and see what happens.. This includes the O rings on the tap connections etc, they can have a small leak which lets air in but doesn't let water out (as confusing as it sounds). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheepsnana Posted March 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 Lube all the o rings with some silicone grease or vas and see what happens.. This includes the O rings on the tap connections etc, they can have a small leak which lets air in but doesn't let water out (as confusing as it sounds). Makes sense actually, if the air is constantly flowing inward, the water can't escape outward. pressure wouldn't be affected due to water and air going out the outtake. I'll see what I can find. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueether Posted March 2, 2012 Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 you will find that most canister filters run under a vacuum. ie they suck the water out of the filter, not push it through the filter (not sure about the expensive ones, but all the cheep ones I've seen do) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheepsnana Posted March 2, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 I understand that it's a syphoning effect, which some people call a vacuum/pull but I call it a push when its coming out of the outtake. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrienne Posted March 2, 2012 Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 Is the cap which sits in the middle on the top of the cf pushed down and screwed around tight. IME they can start to leak allowing air in and a small amount of water out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karina Posted March 2, 2012 Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 I recently set up a CF1200 and the tip I was given was to full the canister first. Put the lid on with the cap off. Cap on. Then my husband sucked on the outlet pipe I turned the taps to let the water through to the inlet pipe then turned the taps on to the outlet. And all good. First external canister I have set up and got going. Same day I did an Eheim. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrienne Posted March 2, 2012 Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 I recently set up a CF1200 and the tip I was given was to full the canister first. Put the lid on with the cap off. Cap on. Then my husband sucked on the outlet pipe I turned the taps to let the water through to the inlet pipe then turned the taps on to the outlet. And all good. First external canister I have set up and got going. Same day I did an Eheim. Thats the proper way to do it. With some of my now older CF1200 the cap does not seat as well and takes a bit more manouvering to stop air getting in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheepsnana Posted March 3, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 3, 2012 This is how I set up my original CF1200. Plug in the intake and suck on the outtake, filling the filter with tank water. It worked the first time. I have since cleaned it, which may have caused an issue somewhere along the line... Yes, the cap is on and screwed tight. No water coming out of it. I have checked this a couple of times to see if it would let air out, but only water comes out, so I screw it back in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrienne Posted March 3, 2012 Report Share Posted March 3, 2012 Have you taken the hoses off the taps and put them back on again. I know you have said everything is screwed tight but maybe one of the hoses has worked its way up and has left a small gap which is not big enough to be seen by the naked eye but is big enough to allow air in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purplecatfish Posted March 3, 2012 Report Share Posted March 3, 2012 Lube all the o rings with some silicone grease or vas and see what happens.. Never lubricate silicon seals with vaseline. Because vaseline is petroleum based it will slowly break down the silicone rubber and the seal will leak. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheepsnana Posted March 3, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 3, 2012 Never lubricate silicon seals with vaseline. Because vaseline is petroleum based it will slowly break down the silicone rubber and the seal will leak. Yes, well known that silcone grease or saliva are better. Petroleum Jelly will cause the rubber to crack. FYI... "If electricity comes from electrons, does that mean that morality comes from morons?" Electricity <-> Electrons. Morality <-> Morals. Morons would be moronic, like electrons are electric. Back on topic, yes I have taken the taps off to double check that there are no loose seals. CF1200 is still playing up, I had cleared ALL of the bubbles out after my last check on it, even inverted it to be sure. The bubbles are back now (making loud noise, hard to sleep, notice the time stamp). :yaw2: CF1000 is unplugged until I can get my new tank set up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caryl Posted March 3, 2012 Report Share Posted March 3, 2012 I have heard people say you should never use Vaseline on the O rings but I have done so for years and never had one crack/perish/break yet. I suspect it may have been true of earlier products but the modern rings are made of different stuff perhaps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ira Posted March 4, 2012 Report Share Posted March 4, 2012 I have heard people say you should never use Vaseline on the O rings but I have done so for years and never had one crack/perish/break yet. I suspect it may have been true of earlier products but the modern rings are made of different stuff perhaps. Yup, silicone is only one of many different materials they're made of. I'm not sure how or even if there is a way to easily tell the difference between them. From some googling seems silicone is mostly used for colored o-rings, not for black. But that's not at all reliable way to tell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheepsnana Posted March 4, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 4, 2012 I found out what I had done wrong.... it was all my fault... No it wasn't a seal, or a leak, or an o-ring. The taps were on correctly. No air was being sucked in the intake. My problem was, there wasn't enough flow coming in the intake. :facepalm: I had changed from a filter sock to some pantyhose (being darker, I thought it would look better than the white filter sock). This was restricting the flow coming into the filter. So instead of "air" as such being sucked in, it was just empty pockets in the filter where the water was moving out faster than it was coming in. My bad. Oh, to those who may encounter this issue themselves later, I found out about it while I was doing a water change. The flow out of my spraybar was extremely low (normally I don't see the flow as the spraybar is submersed). So I got out my CF1200 operation manual and cleaned the intake, outtake, and impeller. To get tank water to clean the impeller, I used the hose from the intake into a bucket. when I noticed that the flow from the intake was a mere drip, I realized that was my problem. Removed the pantyhose, and the spraybar went nuts. There is currently no air in the filter, and hasn't been for the last 2 hours. :facepalm: All because of aesthetics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueether Posted March 4, 2012 Report Share Posted March 4, 2012 Did you have this there because there are fry in the tank? A sponge from a airlift filter could work? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheepsnana Posted March 4, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 4, 2012 It didn't stop the bristlenose fry getting into the filter. They swam up through the tiny holes on the spraybar, right into the canister. I didn't think it was possible til I watched them do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueether Posted March 4, 2012 Report Share Posted March 4, 2012 It didn't stop the bristlenose fry getting into the filter. They swam up through the tiny holes on the spraybar, right into the canister. I didn't think it was possible til I watched them do it. Was that with the reduced flow though? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheepsnana Posted March 4, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 4, 2012 No, after. they are very strong swimmers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ira Posted March 4, 2012 Report Share Posted March 4, 2012 It didn't stop the bristlenose fry getting into the filter. They swam up through the tiny holes on the spraybar, right into the canister. I didn't think it was possible til I watched them do it. And they managed to get past the impeller without getting chunked? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheepsnana Posted March 4, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 4, 2012 Yes, there are two brown bristlenose in the CF, and one golden. The two brown ones are still swimming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snookie Posted March 6, 2012 Report Share Posted March 6, 2012 try running with no media. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueether Posted March 6, 2012 Report Share Posted March 6, 2012 that would defeat the purpose of the filter would it not? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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