penguinleo Posted March 26, 2008 Report Share Posted March 26, 2008 Thanks for the great advice everyone gave me on military boot camps. It really helped in my last debate and we won. Anyone mind helping me out one last time? :lol: The moot is: This house supports cigarettes being displayed for sale. We are AFFIRMING this. Any ideas? Why should cigarettes be displayed in shops, supermarkets, etc. rather than be hidden away somewhere? It is quite hard to affirm this, so any ideas will be much appreciated! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David R Posted March 26, 2008 Report Share Posted March 26, 2008 Well they're not illegal are they? Why shouldn't they be displayed? People should be able to make up their minds based on fact and the propaganda the government force upon us, retailers shouldn't have to hide them away. Retailers are allowed to display and promote alcohol and I'd say that causes just as much harm (if not more) than smoking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted March 26, 2008 Report Share Posted March 26, 2008 The best reason I can think of has it's roots in the Darwinian Theory of Evolution. According to this theory humans have got to number one place on the planet by thousands of years of survival of the fittest. ( And smartest ). But now everything is getting thrown out of balance by the social welfare system. We now have a situation where people who take stupid risks, and spend too much time in bedroom pursuits instead of getting a job, are getting paid to breed. Hence, we have REVERSE evolution. Therefore, there has to be something to even the odds. Smoking is perfect. Everybody knows it will eventually kill and you therefore have to be an idiot to do it. So, let cigerettes be advertised, and let natural selection take place. Think that argument would work? :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livingart Posted March 26, 2008 Report Share Posted March 26, 2008 if you are going to take away cigarettes on display because they harm us, then you need to take away advertising for anything else that has the potential to cause us harm fatty foods, alcohol, soft drinks, fast cars, potato chips etc. bit lame but add to the others Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanmin4304 Posted March 26, 2008 Report Share Posted March 26, 2008 I think they should be banned all together. It would encourage smokers to take up gardening. Look how fit the dope smokers get running up the river beds with a bucket of water. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrie Posted March 26, 2008 Report Share Posted March 26, 2008 if they are not illegal then retailers should be able to stock them and display them This from an exsmoker that cant stand being in the same room as smokers that are smoking :oops: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanmin4304 Posted March 26, 2008 Report Share Posted March 26, 2008 It took me 40 years to wake up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David R Posted March 26, 2008 Report Share Posted March 26, 2008 if you are going to take away cigarettes on display because they harm us, then you need to take away advertising for anything else that has the potential to cause us harm fatty foods, alcohol, soft drinks, fast cars, potato chips etc. bit lame but add to the others Its not lame, its the main point!! The government is being very selective with its social engineering. There is a large group of people with an anti-smoking sentiment, so the government trys to make it look like they're trying to stop people by not having cigarettes on display, graphic pictures on the box, strict limits on advertising, higher prices/more tax etc. Really, they don't want anyone to give up smoking because the amount of revenue it brings in is HUGE! Now compare this with alcohol. The anti-alcohol brigade is a very small minority, and the majority of kiwi's have some sort of drinking culture, from a single beer after work on Friday to those who's lives revolve around getting plastered several times a week. Aside from the anti-drink driving campaign, the government does very little to discourage this, there are a few ad's on tv, but in comparison to smoking/cigarettes there is few restrictions on how you are allowed to sell and promote alcohol. Which is worse is a whole other debate, but really, why should one 'social evil' be so heavily restricted when the other is free to do as it pleases? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livingart Posted March 26, 2008 Report Share Posted March 26, 2008 In australia they are talking of putting pictures of damaged livers on bottles of alcohol, big outcry from the wine brigade complaining that it would not be nice to have the picture at the dinner table or while eating a meal at a restaurant Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanmin4304 Posted March 26, 2008 Report Share Posted March 26, 2008 It is a matter of what is socially acceptable. I wasn't that many years ago that much of the population was in to opium in various forms. Soldiers had fags in their ration packs in ww2. At the moment booze is still fashionable but fags are not. The govt is in to private enterprise so they say, but the country would go broke if they banned booze and smokes and people made their own, and the prisons would be empty if they legalised pot. Don't vote, it only encourages them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tHEcONCH Posted March 26, 2008 Report Share Posted March 26, 2008 You could argue that Smoking is good for society in general, because all the sick / stupid people and tax revenue generated sustain an industry, which is good for our economy. Without a bunch of cancerous smokers to treat, what would all the doctors and nurses do - hip replacements? Treat childhood cancer? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caryl Posted March 26, 2008 Report Share Posted March 26, 2008 They could treat the alcoholics and obese Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doch Posted March 27, 2008 Report Share Posted March 27, 2008 what about all the petrol we use and diesel and what it does to us and our planet why not stop that we all suck up them fumes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David R Posted March 27, 2008 Report Share Posted March 27, 2008 what about all the petrol we use and diesel and what it does to us and our planet why not stop that we all suck up them fumes Grr don't get me started on that!! All this hype and hysteria about noisy exhausts, but the government is too scared to introduce compulsory catylict converters and emissions tests as part of a WOF despite more people dieing from repository diseases from bad air than the entire road toll!! :evil: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanmin4304 Posted March 27, 2008 Report Share Posted March 27, 2008 It is my main wish that I not die from repository disease (sorry couldn't resist) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livingart Posted March 27, 2008 Report Share Posted March 27, 2008 It is my main wish that I not die from repository disease (sorry couldn't resist) you can only take so many supp.... sorry repository's Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keri Anne Posted March 27, 2008 Report Share Posted March 27, 2008 I used to love debates. You don't have to agree with a point to rationalise it. All of the following is simply "of the cuff" but hope it helps. As for point 2, seriously, research nut allergies. _________________ Point 1: Democracy V’s Socialism. (Don’t forget to use the term “Nanny Stateâ€.) At the end of the day it is about democracy and freedom. It all boils down to the rights of the individual to make an independent & informed choice, the right of the retailer to display their product, and the right of the manufacturer to advertise the product they make. Point 2: Why target smokes? (Redirection.) There are far more dangerous things out there than cigarettes. Take peanut butter for example! Peanut butter, peanuts and nuts in general are a major health hazard to many, many people. They can kill people. Not only that but they kill fast… sometimes faster than an ambulance can get there. Yet so many of our day to day products are laced with these deadly ingredients, they are openly advertised and displayed EVERYWHERE. This is not only blatant negligence but plain disrespectful for the many, many people to whom nuts are poison!! Point 3: Taxation. (Yes, we’re getting political again.) Smokers support this nation! Smokers are so highly and ridiculously taxed… and then they pay GST on top of that! The revenue collected off of smokers is invested into Health, Education, and yes… even big black boats! (Americas cup has been a hot topic lately.) How do you think we’re going to pay for the Rugby world cup without smokers? _________________ Cheers, Keri Anne. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David R Posted March 27, 2008 Report Share Posted March 27, 2008 It is my main wish that I not die from repository disease (sorry couldn't resist) :lol: Stupid Firefox spell checker, I guess that email that says it doesn't matter which order the middle letters are in as long as the first and last letters are correct you can still read the words is true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caper Posted March 27, 2008 Report Share Posted March 27, 2008 I have to go so can't read everything will when I have more time. But, they recently enforced it here that stores are NOT allowed to have cigarettes in sight. How pathetic in my opinion, people still know they are there! More later. Caper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tHEcONCH Posted March 27, 2008 Report Share Posted March 27, 2008 :lol: Stupid Firefox spell checker, I guess that email that says it doesn't matter which order the middle letters are in as long as the first and last letters are correct you can still read the words is true. :lol: What a way to go! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
penguinleo Posted March 28, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 28, 2008 Thank you for all your comments and ideas! Found a lot of them very helpful. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keri Anne Posted March 28, 2008 Report Share Posted March 28, 2008 I have to go so can't read everything will when I have more time. But, they recently enforced it here that stores are NOT allowed to have cigarettes in sight. How pathetic in my opinion, people still know they are there! More later. Caper They enforced that here last year Caper.... thus the debate topic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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