Varying readings of Nitrate and fish dying

[sandaz]

You might want to check the nitrates of the water out of your tap, as you will be unable to get the tank nitrates lower then that (few exemptions).

Just checked the nitrates of the tap water. It's zero. Had somewhat pinned my hopes on this! :-?

[snookie]

what furnishings do you have in your tank , what brand of heater are you using ?

[sandaz]

what furnishings do you have in your tank , what brand of heater are you using ?

I have plants and drift wood. And one divers mask ornament that have anubas growing all over it.

Heater is Yinsheng brand.

[snookie]

could the divers mask be leaching anything , gasping danio could be to warm water

isolating fish in smaller /breeding tank can cause more stress

[sandaz]

could the divers mask be leaching anything , gasping danio could be to warm water

Divers mask is a plastic ornament you get from the pet shop. Is that possible?

isolating fish in smaller /breeding tank can cause more stress

Probably, but in my desperation I try everything. Keeping them where they were didn't help either. The fish currently in quarentine is in the big tank but in one of those breeding boxes

[nudge]

Specs say 1000l but that is usually an empty filter with no media. Once you fill the canister up with media you can generally look at just over half that so you are probably looking at more like 6-700l an hr which would mean your tank turnover is more likely just over 2xp/hr. Which is pretty low, you want to double that at least. I would try running both filters as long as its not gonna cause to much flow. That should help to keep the nitrates down.

[sandaz]

Specs say 1000l but that is usually an empty filter with no media. Once you fill the canister up with media you can generally look at just over half that so you are probably looking at more like 6-700l an hr which would mean your tank turnover is more likely just over 2xp/hr. Which is pretty low, you want to double that at least. I would try running both filters as long as its not gonna cause to much flow. That should help to keep the nitrates down.

Thanks for advice. Just trying to understand why pumping more water per hour would help keep nitrates down?

And so is the recommended turnover 3-4 times per hour?

[nudge]

Its about keeping the tank clean of waste and food. If left in the tank they will cause your nitrates to rise. If removed from the tank by your filter and if your filter is big enough to cope with the bio load that will help to control nitrate. Thats a pretty basic breakdown.

But, like i and others have said, nitrates won't be the problem as they are well within acceptable limits.

[blueether]

Just a little clarification is needed here:

Nitrate is the end product of fish waste in the aquarium, it doesn't matter how 'big' the filter is there will still be the same amount of end product in the (partial) N2 cycle in an aquarium.

There are three ways to lower this end product:

1/ Remove it with a partial water change (what most people do)

2/ Bind it into plant growth

3/ Complete the N2 cycle with anaerobic bacteria (tricky to do in a standard freshwater aquarium)

[sandaz]

Its about keeping the tank clean of waste and food. If left in the tank they will cause your nitrates to rise. If removed from the tank by your filter and if your filter is big enough to cope with the bio load that will help to control nitrate. Thats a pretty basic breakdown.

But, like i and others have said, nitrates won't be the problem as they are well within acceptable limits.

It's not that I disagree re nitrates. Just doing everything I can to get it down and keep it down as it's the only thing inside my control at the moment :-)

[camtang]

If this was me, I would of closed the tank down, cleaned everything/ got new gear and started again. I am sure you are trying to avoid this however.

[sandaz]

Just a little clarification is needed here:

There are three ways to lower this end product:

1/ Remove it with a partial water change (what most people do)

2/ Bind it into plant growth

3/ Complete the N2 cycle with anaerobic bacteria (tricky to do in a standard freshwater aquarium)

Are there specific plants that are better than others for option 2? I've also heard that some plants are better at keeping helping to keep BBA at bay (I know it's not the plant but the nutrients etc)

[sandaz]

If this was me, I would of closed the tank down, cleaned everything/ got new gear and started again. I am sure you are trying to avoid this however.

If I can absolutely. Hopefully it never gets to this.

[F15hguy]

Havent read the whole thread yet so sorry if it has already been sugested

but have you tested your Salinity levels???, if you are dosing every week it will slowly build up.

also a good way to lower nitrogen waste in a fish only tank is to add some Duckweed (it can become a pain in some tanks, but normally stays ok if there are some vege fish in there.)

[sandaz]

Havent read the whole thread yet so sorry if it has already been sugested

but have you tested your Salinity levels???, if you are dosing every week it will slowly build up.

also a good way to lower nitrogen waste in a fish only tank is to add some Duckweed (it can become a pain in some tanks, but normally stays ok if there are some vege fish in there.)

You've got me thinking. Nitrates were up above 20 originally. And every time I've lost a fish it's been after a water change (within a couple of days anyway). At each water change I add a tablespoon of tonic salt for every 10% water I'm changing.

With this in mind I've read up on the types of fish that's been dying and from what I can see none of them like salts.

Now the pictus have been in a tank with salt for over a year, but what if the higher levels of nitrate weakened them and then they were unable to deal with salt in water as well so died.

What's the chance my problem is actually the salt I'm adding being incompatible with some of fish I bought? Apart from pictus all the fish fish that have died was added since I bought the tank. All the rest is still alive.

Sounds a bit like a conspiracy theory :-)

[sandaz]

Discus have dissapeared. Did 50% water change and cleaned everything out but he is nowhere to be seen. And found another rummy nose dead.

Danio seems to have lost all it's "skin" across his back, and neon tetra has fins nipped, a white spot on him and fins seems to be very white at the end. Found another guppy that had its entire tail missing.

Another glass cat with white spots (but doesn't look like ick) like the other picture posted.

Think it's either the dwarf gourami, t-bar cichlid or red tail shark doing the damage.

Sad state of affairs really...so have dosed with Tonic to see if anything fungul to get rid of. I don't know what else to do.

[Godly3vil]

It will be either the rtbs or t-bar, not sure about t-bars but I can vouch for rtbs being aggressive towards anything they take a disliking too.

[Zuri_08]

You've got me thinking. Nitrates were up above 20 originally. And every time I've lost a fish it's been after a water change (within a couple of days anyway). At each water change I add a tablespoon of tonic salt for every 10% water I'm changing.

With this in mind I've read up on the types of fish that's been dying and from what I can see none of them like salts.

Now the pictus have been in a tank with salt for over a year, but what if the higher levels of nitrate weakened them and then they were unable to deal with salt in water as well so died.

What's the chance my problem is actually the salt I'm adding being incompatible with some of fish I bought? Apart from pictus all the fish fish that have died was added since I bought the tank. All the rest is still alive.

Sounds a bit like a conspiracy theory :-)

Hello I've been keeping tropical fish for about 7 months now - all is going well and I've NEVER added salt. I've never heard of adding salt to the water - a tablespoon of salt per 10% water change just seems enormous to me. What would happen if you did a big water change and didn't add any salt?

[Caryl]

Small doses of salt are often used as a "tonic". It is not something I do myself but many others do, routinely.

[F15hguy]

Just like to point out that keeping a Gold Algae eater with Discus is just asking for expensive trouble. tbh I wouldn't be surprised if he's had a nibble on the Danio (they take the top layer of skin off)

also have you given the sand a good stir round?, I find that Black silica can really trap stuff if not stirred regularly.

also do some fresh water changes (no salt, try for 30% every 3 days for a fortnight and see what happens.)

Think it's either the dwarf gourami, t-bar cichlid or red tail shark doing the damage

all 3 of those could be the culprit as well, RT shark and T-Bar would be my best guesses, both are really too agressive for a community tank.

[sandaz]

Just like to point out that keeping a Gold Algae eater with Discus is just asking for expensive trouble. tbh I wouldn't be surprised if he's had a nibble on the Danio (they take the top layer of skin off)

I know plecos are a problem with discus, is it the same for golden algae eater? The red tail shard seems to give them a chase around from time to time but the two of them don;t seem to mind each other.

also have you given the sand a good stir round?, I find that Black silica can really trap stuff if not stirred regularly.

also do some fresh water changes (no salt, try for 30% every 3 days for a fortnight and see what happens.)

Yes I stir the sand around when I clean it out each week. Have heard that it can have some toxic bubbles if you don't.

Think it's either the dwarf gourami, t-bar cichlid or red tail shark doing the damage

all 3 of those could be the culprit as well, RT shark and T-Bar would be my best guesses, both are really too agressive for a community tank.

I've been watching them and I think the t-bar is probably more of the culprit. Will probably sell him and see how I go after that. I have 2, should I get rid of both or only the more dominant one?

[sandaz]

Just a quick update:

Am on day 6 of the treatment with Wunder tonic, the wound on the tetra seems to look a little bit better, but other than that no change.

I continue to lose a fish every day or two at the moment, rummy noses and neon tetras mainly, but guppy this morning. Noticed his fins had been nipped last night (since the avo) so wondering if he died of shock or something as he just drifted along the top last time I saw him alive.

I have not taken water readings since starting the treatment as I don't know if it will affect the readings, but last one I took nitrate was sitting at 5ppm. Have added no salt for the last 2 water changes.

In the mean time the molly has had ~30 babies that are now happily swimming in the maternity ward.

[sandaz]

The carnage continues.

Lost 5 fish over the weekend and my second discus today. The glass cats had turned opaque and from what I can find on Google that points towards bacterial infections.

Still at a loss as to what is causing this.

Have started a treatment of Praziquantel today. Maybe it will make a difference, maybe not. Worth a try.

Water test shows nitrates have stabilised at 5ppm. Ammonia and Nitrite still zero.

[NoFishing]

Could there be something wrong with your food? Some unusual type of plant in yout tank? Are your fish being slowly poisoned? Sounds like you have tried just about everything else so just clutching at straws now.

Hope you find the cause soon. Can't be much fun at the moment for you.

[sandaz]

Could there be something wrong with your food? Some unusual type of plant in yout tank? Are your fish being slowly poisoned? Sounds like you have tried just about everything else so just clutching at straws now.

Hope you find the cause soon. Can't be much fun at the moment for you.

Thanks

I've been wondering whether maybe my Prime is not working properly. Checked tonight and there is no expiry date on it. How long does the stuff last as I got handed it when I bought the tank.?