Sophia Posted September 14, 2012 Report Share Posted September 14, 2012 15 watts is low intensity. It was always on for about 6 hours and I had little or no algae for a long time and then the brown stuff started. I moved it to 3 hours recently as Jennifer suggested cutting it down to upset the algae but that didn't work so I did the 3 day blackout. Today the leaves are greener again but the big clean off and water change will happen on Saturday or Sunday. Jennifer, I'm a bit wary to try flourish every day, that is what I used to do in my first tank and I got staghorn algae that wouldn't go away. Though... the lights were on for longer and there was direct sunlight on the glass for part of the day. :roey: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennifer Posted September 16, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 16, 2012 Jennifer, I'm a bit wary to try flourish every day, that is what I used to do in my first tank and I got staghorn algae that wouldn't go away. Though... the lights were on for longer and there was direct sunlight on the glass for part of the day. :roey: I think more of the problem is related to the excess light as you suggest, not the Flourish. I have two tanks that I run this way and the plants grow so well that I have to prune about once a month. You just have to be consistent with dosing and have enough plants so that they will take off and use up the nutrients you are putting in there. You also need to have a low light tank or the Flourish Comprehensive won't be enough. It is actually very easy. I think you will be delighted with the results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sophia Posted September 16, 2012 Report Share Posted September 16, 2012 ok I'll think about it..... :cofn: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sophia Posted September 16, 2012 Report Share Posted September 16, 2012 ok I'll think about it..... :cofn: are those tanks of yours near a light source, do they get any daylight? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennifer Posted September 16, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 16, 2012 Neither get direct sun but both are in a room that gets direct sunlight for a few hours a day. They both are low light intensity and have a 7 hour photoperiod. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sup42 Posted September 24, 2012 Report Share Posted September 24, 2012 A month after switching to LEDs Seachem Iron , FLourish , Excel , Comprehensive , pressurised CO2 I have every Algae and Cyno Bacteria known to man kind in my high tech tank. Did a Three day and twelve hours blackout , the only Algae that died out was the GSA. Removed all affected plants and soaked them in high contration bath of Excel. Cut off all affected leaves ( there are some minor spots here and there too hard to get too the lot ). 70 % Water change after scrubbing the walls with a plastic card. Removed a piece of driftwood completely. Tank looks like a pale bare waste land. Cut back on Photoperiod to six hours Not sure when to re fert the tank as I'm a bit lost on where to go next. I was following the regime on here before the Algae explosion , now my photo periods cut I'm not sure about dosing....spose i could just follow Seachems rates. The Iron is a real cop out , there is no recommended frequency on Seachems product , I suspect the Algae was a combo after Iron boosting was started. Probably should have let the Flourite do its t hing and waited for the swords / red plants to show shortage ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zev Posted September 25, 2012 Report Share Posted September 25, 2012 Know how you feel, I have a small tank with too much light, slow growing plants and get algae by the bucketload if I forget to dose Excel for a day or try and supplement to stop the leaves going yellow with Comprehensive or Iron - cannot triple dose Excel to knock the whispy green algae off as the tank has a population of corys in there that think it is heaven and have started to lay eggs all the time :nilly: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennifer Posted September 25, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 25, 2012 If you have lots of light (either photoperiod length or intensity) and have plenty of carbon (either Excel or CO2) the plants will be growing so fast that you will need a LOT of fertilisers to keep up. Therein lies the problem, if you don't have very exacting dosing regimes and reliable test methods, you will not easily know which of your nutrients is limiting growth (and allowing the algae to take over by using all of the other available nutrients). This is why we tend to overdose on all the nutrients to help ensure none are limiting. The amount you add depends on how much light you have (assuming you have a constant supply of carbon during the photoperiods). For a while, I had a really high tech tank running and was adding about 1tsp of dry potassium nitrate each day! Not to mention all the other ferts... For your setup, it sounds like you don't have much biomass left so nutrient/carbon/light requirements will be low until you get some mass in there again. It is much easier to start with low tech and very gradually go up to high tech. Add some floating plants (like Indian Fern) in the mean time to help things stabilise again. If you have new enriched substrate, don't add too much light for a month or so since the substrate will be leeching into the water column. About some of the algae: the blackout will not erase the algae but it will kill it so it is easier to remove. It will also stimulate the plants to grow. Black brush algae is not affected at all by a blackout. Green spot algae is caused by insufficient phosphate. Most other green algae will prosper in any conditions of high light regardless of the nutrient level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sophia Posted September 26, 2012 Report Share Posted September 26, 2012 what do you call a reliable test method Dr Jennifer? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sup42 Posted September 26, 2012 Report Share Posted September 26, 2012 If you have lots of light (either photoperiod length or intensity) and have plenty of carbon (either Excel or CO2) the plants will be growing so fast that you will need a LOT of fertilisers to keep up. Therein lies the problem, if you don't have very exacting dosing regimes and reliable test methods, you will not easily know which of your nutrients is limiting growth (and allowing the algae to take over by using all of the other available nutrients). This is why we tend to overdose on all the nutrients to help ensure none are limiting. The amount you add depends on how much light you have (assuming you have a constant supply of carbon during the photoperiods). For a while, I had a really high tech tank running and was adding about 1tsp of dry potassium nitrate each day! Not to mention all the other ferts... For your setup, it sounds like you don't have much biomass left so nutrient/carbon/light requirements will be low until you get some mass in there again. It is much easier to start with low tech and very gradually go up to high tech. Add some floating plants (like Indian Fern) in the mean time to help things stabilise again. If you have new enriched substrate, don't add too much light for a month or so since the substrate will be leeching into the water column. About some of the algae: the blackout will not erase the algae but it will kill it so it is easier to remove. It will also stimulate the plants to grow. Black brush algae is not affected at all by a blackout. Green spot algae is caused by insufficient phosphate. Most other green algae will prosper in any conditions of high light regardless of the nutrient level. Tanks for the Advice Jenifer. I've read all your posts and worked out it is a learning curve, One of the most important ingredients I think is patience. So I'm running a 6 hour photo period now. First thing i noticed is the return of the algae is slowed if not stopped ( won't know for sure yet , but enough time has passed for regrowth based on the two to three day scrubbing the glass previously ) I agree with the Bio Mass suggestion and you will be pleased to know I put in large Hygro Polysperma as a temporary stem plant additive till my preffered Cambomba Carolina replaces it. Now I feel more confident with doing the ferts. The Phosphate product i was talked into is Aqua Vitro Potassium & Phosphate , I have a phosphate test kit , what level should i aim for ? it is an API one My Nitrates are always around 0.25ppm by weeks end ( I've read this means i don't need to add Nitrogen since the Biomass in th tank is never burning it up to 0.ppm ( even though E.I. recommends higher values ? ) The Iron I WIll inject into the substrate once a week under the Swords and Alternhera Rosifolia ( sorry spelling ) As for leaching, you are probably right even though 100 % Flourite on the Seachem site says leaching is not possible. The Blue green Algae as i understand it might be an indication of low 02 Any way I have a smaller high tech tank on an eight hour photo period which is doing brilliantly. and then there is the direct sunlight ( diffused through a window ) which is also pearling etc with minimal Algae. That's all given me a bit of confidence that i can sought this thing out ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sup42 Posted September 26, 2012 Report Share Posted September 26, 2012 Edit: I can See why people who run high tech tanks eventually convert to Slower more balanced set ups Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennifer Posted September 28, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 28, 2012 It sounds like you are on the right track. Be sure your circulation is good and that you have enough CO2 or the plants won't be able to take up the nutrients. For EI suggested target ranges are: CO2 range 25-35 ppm Nitrate (NO3) range 10-30 ppm Potassium (K+) range 10-30 ppm Phosphate (PO4) range 1.0-2.0 ppm Iron (Fe) 0.2-0.5ppm or higher GH range 17-40 ppm or higher For a 150-230L high light tank: +/- 1/2 tsp Potassium Nitrate (KN03) 3x a week +/- 1/8 tsp Monopotassium Phosphate (KH2P04) 3x a week +/- 3/4 tsp GH booster (e.g. magnesium sulfate/epsom salts) once a week after the water change Trace elements/micronutrients 3x a week 50% weekly water change Nitrate test kits are notoriously inaccurate (although some brands are better than others). The options are to add as much as you think will be needed and see if that works, or calibrate your test kits. For example, to make a control solution to calibrate your kit, you can mix 1g of KNO3 in 500ml of distilled water to create a 2000ppm nitrate solution. To dilute that solution to a usable ppm you can take 10ml of the solution and mix it with 490ml of distilled water to create a 40ppm nitrate solution. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sup42 Posted September 28, 2012 Report Share Posted September 28, 2012 Thanks again Jennifer I will institute the routine with due diligence. I have sorted out the flow in the tank to get and even gentle breeze sway all around. How long would you wait after adjusting the ferts till you increase the photo period from 6hrs ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennifer Posted October 4, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 4, 2012 You pretty much need to increase the nutrients as soon as you increase the lighting. The plants will take a few days to get used to things before they really start taking off. Just watch things closely and adjust as needed to keep the algae under control. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wellydave Posted November 23, 2012 Report Share Posted November 23, 2012 Answer the following: Dimensions & volume of tank Lighting Substrate Plants Fish stocking Goals - What you want from the tank, amount of time you have to maintain it, approximate budget you want to spend on it Dimensions & volume of tank L - 160cm W - 61cm D - 71cm apox 680ltr + 200ltr sump Lighting 2 x glo 54w power glos and 2 x glo 54w life glows currently running power glos for 12 hours (9am - 9pm) and life glows for 6 hours during that (12 - 6pm) Substrate JBL aquabasis plus with top layer of JBL monando and a little bit of a silica sand path. Plants dawrf hair grass, glosso, asstd swords, asstd crypts, zelandiae, twisted val, water rose, hygrophilia angustifolia, green camboba, c.balnasae, red pine, rotala wallichii, thin leaf java fern, normal java fern and windelof java fern Fish stockin nothing yet tank is still cycling Goals - What you want from the tank, amount of time you have to maintain it, approximate budget you want to spend on it heaps of growth a lush looking tank no algae and happy fish once they arrive. have plenty free time to maintain it and not to fussed on what it cost's me but dont want to be spending stupid amounts every week on it :slfg: currently have a pressurized co2 system in place and it comes on 1 hour b4 lights and is off 1 hour b4 lights tank has been up and running for around 2 days Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Godly3vil Posted November 23, 2012 Report Share Posted November 23, 2012 Just a heads up Dave, I am using the same sort of lighting on a smaller tank and they don't do a great job of penetrating to the bottom which is 60cm, I think you might have some problems trying to grow a couple of the plants you want as they really need more light. You should really consider going metal halide, thats what I am going to do after xmas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wellydave Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 yeah i was looking into metal halides to start with but couldnt find anything suitable in nz i could order something in but the cost was just rediculis ive been scouring trade me and there are quite a few that pop up but people are never in wellington and very rarely willing to ship them would still like to get at least 1 250w and keep the t5's going as well but like i said its more trying to find one Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrienne Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 At 60cm you will find the glosso reaching rather than spreading in search of the lighting required. I run 4 T5HO plus 2 T8 on my 60cm and do not meet its requirements. All of the others have in the past, or current, grown just fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wellydave Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 Ok so woke up thismorning and have notised growth in the tank already after only 3 or 4 days but a you said the glosso looks to be stretching so now im looking into getting some metal halides but need to know what ferts i need and at what levels/freqency i should be adding them Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennifer Posted November 25, 2012 Author Report Share Posted November 25, 2012 As you don't have any fish in there yet, this is a good time to get your CO2 right. You've got all the makings of a high tech system and if you go with MH lighting, it will most certainly be high tech so you may find yourself spending more time than you think each week trimming and pruning. Like the others said, the depth of the tank and your current lighting aren't ideal for high demand plants like glosso. On the other hand, it is a great configuration for a lower tech tank. If you are doing EI dosing of ferts, your key will be in getting enough CO2 to keep up with the demand from the lighting. A high tech tank will usually require daily dosing alternating with macros (KNO3, KH2PO4, K2SO4) and micros (trace, magnesium) plus water changes once a week. Dry ferts from a hydroponics supplier is fine but there are some commercial preparations that are excellent if you want to go pre made. The ideal situation is always doing the substrate and the water so you are nearly there. You should get your circulation and CO2 up high enough that you get pearling after the lights have been on for a while. You probably won't see pearling on the deeper plants, but you should see some on the plants closer to the light source. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wellydave Posted November 26, 2012 Report Share Posted November 26, 2012 yeah metal halides seem like they are going to be the go so im scouring trade me at the moment trying to find a decent mh set up for a fair price that is willing to ship to me in wellington. it seems i have the co2 sitting right after a couple days of adjustments i have the drop checker sitting at a nice green colour. have ordered some fert on trademe from valray so going to see how that go's and also have gotten a 3000 l/ph wave maker from him to create some more water movement in the tank so hopefully that will sort it out. thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sophia Posted January 5, 2013 Report Share Posted January 5, 2013 my turn again... My original planted tank's hair algae is getting steadily worse and I wonder what else I can do to knock it back. From a distance you can't see it, it's not THAT bad, but it's throughout the tank and it's noticeable. I assume it's hair algae as it's like hair.... long green strands of what you get out of a hairbrush. It used to only live in the twisted val, so I thought it was to do with weaker older leaves as my val gets very long and floats on the top due it being a small tank. Then it spread to the other plants and now it's everywhere, even growing on the plastic breeding box floating in there. Plants are all green and doing well. Parameters: 28cm deep water (top to bottom), 50cm long, 27.5cm front to back. Lights are 16w worth of 6500k and 14000k bulbs and they are on for 3 hours a day. Tank is in a well lit room but gets no direct sunlight. Phosphates tested today at 0.25, 2nd one down from the top of the API card, and Nitrate was 5.0. I was doing about a 4L water change weekly but over the last month I haven't done any in an attempt to create more balance. Fertiliser is 1ml of Excel once a week, and 1ml of Flourish comp at least once a week or up to 3 times if I remember. Once a week I get in there with a bottle brush and twist out as much as I can. Don't get very much other algae in there to speak of. A few tiny spots of black beard or brush on the old java fern leaves, a bit of green spot on the glass from time to time. edit.... also tank gets 1/8th tsp of epsom salts a week Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennifer Posted January 7, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 7, 2013 Lucky for you, this algae is a sign that your tank is doing relatively well! From here, you can help plant growth to out-compete the algae by doing the following: Make sure you are adding enough ferts. For low tech tanks like this I use: Excel approx 5mls per 40L, Comprehensive 1ml/40L daily (or 6mls/40L once weekly). If you are dosing ferts, you need to do water changes, 50% once weekly. Remove all visible algae. Remove all affected leaves/plants - they will not recover. Ensure your filter is clean/flowing well. The current should be enough to keep the leaves moving gently to and fro. Slowly (over a week or two) bump the light up to 5-6 hours a day. :thup: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superico Posted January 7, 2013 Report Share Posted January 7, 2013 hi all, i have decided to start fertilizing my tank properly and would like to know what to order from http://www.hydroponics.co.nz/bulk-nutrients.html and how to dose it. tank specs: Dimensions & volume of tank:106cmx60cm highx56cm deep with two dividers in the back and a water line of 30cm which works out to hold about 120 liters Lighting: life glo fixture with an arcadia plant pro buld and an life glo bulb on for 10 hours(10am-8pm) Substrate:30kgs of fine red gravel on top of 15kgs of jbl aqua basis plus Plants:various crypts, half a carpet of echinodorus quadricostatus, 1 large echinodorus argentinensis, 2 amazon swords, three small anubias and lots of stargrass which is going to be replaced be these:alternanthera reineckii 'red', hygrophila corymbosa, hygrophila difformis, ludwigia glandulosa, rotala rotundifolia. Fish stocking:1 pair of apistogramma agassizi, 2 laetacara curviceps,19 cardinals, 8 panda corys, 2 red long fin jewel Ancistrus, 2 rocket pencil fish(unluckily i purchased 1 female and 3 males so there is only one male left now :an!gry ) Goals - i want a tank that is entertaining and a good home for both fish and plants and i would like fast plant growth( and very little algae). any advice would be much appreciated cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sophia Posted January 7, 2013 Report Share Posted January 7, 2013 Lucky for you, this algae is a sign that your tank is doing relatively well! From here, you can help plant growth to out-compete the algae by doing the following: Make sure you are adding enough ferts. For low tech tanks like this I use: Excel approx 5mls per 40L, Comprehensive 1ml/40L daily (or 6mls/40L once weekly). If you are dosing ferts, you need to do water changes, 50% once weekly. Remove all visible algae. Remove all affected leaves/plants - they will not recover. Ensure your filter is clean/flowing well. The current should be enough to keep the leaves moving gently to and fro. Slowly (over a week or two) bump the light up to 5-6 hours a day. :thup: I can't afford to spend what I would need to in order to maintain daily dosing at that rate. Is there another option or a compromise? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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