dennis Posted July 25, 2002 Report Share Posted July 25, 2002 can someone e-mail be there recepie of what they used thanks Dennis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeves Posted April 5, 2003 Report Share Posted April 5, 2003 sorry to dig up such an old post, Ive just read thru the whole thing and it all sounds interesting - I wanna try it. I have a garden center quite close to me so I might go up there and check out if they got all the ingredients I need. One small problem I have is that I dont understand all the chemical names off the linked website mentioned earlier in the thread, so if any one could post it here or send me the recipe in plain English that they have had success with Im sure it would be a great help to any one that might be interested in growing plants and/or fighting the algae scourge :roll: :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KerryO Posted April 5, 2003 Report Share Posted April 5, 2003 I read the whole article also a couple of days ago. I then jumped in the car and went up to the local garden centre, I had no problem finding the epsom salts (Magnesium Sulphate) and the trace element mix. Total cost 8.00 I then stopped at the local dairy on the way home and got a small bottle of drinking water (using 300ml of it), into which I mixed 2.5 tablespoons of the epsom salts and 1 tablespoon of the trace element mix. It wouldn't all dissolve properly, but I just give it a shake before adding about 3-5mls each day to my 130L tank. (small squirt) I didn't get the Chelated Iron as it is already in the trace element mix, and I didn't want to over do it with iron, as it is so poisonous to fish. I really need an iron test kit, but I'm sick of buying test kits for now. I also couldn't find the stuff to stop fugus growing in the mix, so I'll have to keep an eye on it. In a matter of days I have noticed the difference in my plants, mainly turning greener. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeves Posted April 6, 2003 Report Share Posted April 6, 2003 I will go give it a try. maybe if you put the mix in the fridge it might stop the fungus from growing in the bottle? :-? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ira Posted April 6, 2003 Author Report Share Posted April 6, 2003 I've had mine sitting for months on top of the fish tank. No noticable fungus or mold or anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dennis Posted April 6, 2003 Report Share Posted April 6, 2003 and is it working good ira? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ira Posted April 6, 2003 Author Report Share Posted April 6, 2003 Yup, working fine...Well, actually this last batch isn't doing so well. But, that's my fault because I thought I'd try filtering out all the particles that aren't dissolving in the mixture so it doesn't cloud the water for an hour or so...And I think I filtered out most of the minerals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warren Posted April 6, 2003 Report Share Posted April 6, 2003 It shouldn't be cloudy. I'm using pretty much the basic mix as per the Sears-Conlin report and its not cloudy at all. It also does not cloud the water. What are you doing different to make yours cloudy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KerryO Posted April 6, 2003 Report Share Posted April 6, 2003 That's interesting mine is cloudy too. In the bottom of my bottle is about a small teaspoon of undissolved particles, the colour of rust. I was kind of wondering if you guys had found a liquid form of the trace mix. I also thought of filtering it out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ira Posted April 7, 2003 Author Report Share Posted April 7, 2003 Hmmm, You're using the pure chemicals aren't you, Warren? I'd say that's the difference...Maybe it's filler or something that's in the garden center mix, or just the form of the garden center stuff doesn't dissolve as well. Mine is a yellowish color. Well, the undissolved stuff is yellowish, if I let it sit so that all settles out the remaining is a bluish color. I'm pretty sure the yellow stuff eventually dissolves in the tank too, because I haven't noticed any kind of yellow sediment in the tank or in the filter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warren Posted April 7, 2003 Report Share Posted April 7, 2003 You are probably getting a precipitate from the iron. If the wrong chemicals are used, the chelated iron will react to form an insoluble precipitate, - hence the cloudiness. Will post the exact chemicals I use later tonight. Maybe you can try them instead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ira Posted April 8, 2003 Author Report Share Posted April 8, 2003 Nah, I don't think so. Since the yellow of the fertilizer mix is exactly the same color as the yellow trace element mix. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KerryO Posted April 8, 2003 Report Share Posted April 8, 2003 My trace element mix, is made by Riverside Products in Terapa. When it settles my water is blue too. The particles that settle to the bottom are dark brown like rust. when I shake the bottle it all turns rust brown. I've stopped using it for now, until I or someone else furthers my edumacation about the stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warren Posted April 8, 2003 Report Share Posted April 8, 2003 Why do you think the mix is yellow... Maybe because chelated iron is yellow and it represents a major percentage of the trace mix. Don't know where the blue is coming from, - maybe copper. Dissolved copper will react with chelates to make them precipitate. If it is copper in solution, be careful of its ppm. If it gets too high it will kill the fish and plants + filter. Therefore it is highly likely the cloudiness is caused by a precipitate reaction of the trace element mix. The brown sediment sounds like it is a solid. If it wasn't there immediately after the mix was made but settles later then it is a precipitate. Try mixing some of the trace mix just with water to se if you still get a precipitate. Here is my mix. It does not use powder trace mix other than the iron chelates. 1 480ml bottle of Aquatic Plant Stimulant (Aquarium Pharaceuticals) 20 Tablespoons of K2SO4 (Potasium sulphate (Sulphate of Potash)) 40 Tablespoons of MgSO4 (Magnesium sulphate (Epsom Salts)) 0.25 Teaspoons of Manganese sulphate 4 Teaspoons of Iron Chelates 1L of Water (from the tap - who cares whats in it) 4ml of HCl (Hydrochloric Acid - Conc) The Aquatic Plant Stimulant has all the nutrients in quantities close to that required. It is just a little deficient in manganese and iron (hence extra added). The water is from the hot tap (no hotter than 50'C) to help everything dissolve faster. It is left to cool with an airstone in the bottom to stop crystalisation during cooling. Makes just under 2L, - enough to last abot 2 months. Never goes cloudy, never precipitates when added to the tank. The only other difference I may have is I used RO water mineralised with the following salts. Per 1000L: 30g Sodium bicarbonate (Baking Soda) 20g Magnesium Sulphate (Epsom Salts) 20g Calcium chloride 15g Potasium sulphate (Sulphate of Potash) These are added to the RO storage tanks 24 hours prior to use. This keeps the pH stable at 6.8 with approx 15ppm CO2 added. Because I have a very controlled environment with no organics or other unknown dissolved salts, I don't have any precipitate problems. There may well be something in your water source that reacts with one or more of the fertiliser ingredients. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajbroome Posted April 8, 2003 Report Share Posted April 8, 2003 Warren said... > ... it is highly likely the cloudiness is caused by a > precipitate reaction of the trace element mix. Bear in mind that if you're using a cheap 'garden store' trace element mix it will not've been optimised for use in aquaria so it's possible that there is just some less soluble material in the mix which causes temporary clouding. I've just made up a mix containing cheap stuff (trace elements, potassium sulphate, magnesium sulphate basically at the levels suggested in the 'Sears-Conlin report'). It's a cloudy solution (and was from the start) that temporarily clouds the tank water but it clears soon enough. The fish seem to be coping but I've only added it for the last 2 days. I'm adding about 8mL per day to my approx 300L tank. > 0.25 Teaspoons of Manganese sulphate > 4 Teaspoons of Iron Chelates What's the suggested benefit of the Manganese sulphate? Where'd you get the 'Iron Chelates' from? > The water is from the hot tap This may be significant. I used cold RO water and no HCl. > I have a very controlled environment with no organics > or other unknown dissolved salts... You're not adding any nitrates? I didn't have easy access to Potassium nitrate so skipped it. But, am now wondering if I should add Manganese nitrate (which I can easily do - there are benefits to working in a lab ). What about Sodium nitrate? Thoughts? Andrew. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KerryO Posted April 8, 2003 Report Share Posted April 8, 2003 The Iron Chelates are available at the garden centres. Don't forget there is already some in the cheap Trace Element mix. I don't know how much though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajbroome Posted April 8, 2003 Report Share Posted April 8, 2003 KerryO said... > The Iron Chelates are available at the garden centres. Ah. I looked but couldn't find any. > Don't forget there is already some in the cheap > Trace Element mix. That's what I figured so I thought I'd go with that in the short term. > I don't know how much though. No, it's a pain they don't seem to have a list of ingredients... Andrew. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KerryO Posted April 8, 2003 Report Share Posted April 8, 2003 Prior to making up my mix, I bought some Plant Gro, the new iron enriched version from my LFS. The blurb on the side of the bottle says: Plant Gro Iron Enriched contains only chelated iron, which is easily assimilated by plants and safe for aquatic organisms, will not affect fish etc. On the otherside of the bottle is the recommended doseage (a one off doseage) no on going doseage. Also: We recommend using the Nutrafin Iron Test Kit to regularly monitor chelated iron levels. I emailed the manufacturers "Nutrafin' and asked what the ongoing doseage should be. This was their reply: There are two types of Plant~Gro, Iron Enriched and NPK, I have to guess you are reading the Iron Enriched because there are no dosage periods mentioned. The reason for this is that Iron is used in varying amount by various environments, and although it should not drop too low, it can be harmful when dosed in excessive levels. The only way to be sure, with any fertilizer that adds iron, is to use a proper test kit to ensure the levels stay within safe ones. To be honest with you, we had an iron fertilizer ready for quite a while before we felt we could sell it, waiting for the addition of an accurate iron test kit to allow safe long-term usage. Well I don't know, it looks like I need to buy an iron test kit now. I could be way under or way over the levels, and I'd have no idea, unless fish start misteriously dying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajbroome Posted April 9, 2003 Report Share Posted April 9, 2003 KerryO said... > ... no on going doseage ... Presumably you top it up after water changes though, otherwise at 25% change per week, you be down to none again in a month... > Well I don't know, it looks like I need to buy an iron test > kit now. I could be way under or way over the levels, and I'd > have no idea, unless fish start misteriously dying. Mmmm... looks that way. Although, you could add until you get acceptable plant growth and then stop, perhaps... A tad risky though since you don't even know if Iron is limiting you... Andrew. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ira Posted April 9, 2003 Author Report Share Posted April 9, 2003 Potassium nitrate would be in the garden center sold as "Stump Rot" It's pure potassium Nitrate. White salty looking stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajbroome Posted April 9, 2003 Report Share Posted April 9, 2003 Ira said... > Potassium nitrate would be in the garden center > sold as "Stump Rot" Ah. Thanks for that. Andrew. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kriber Posted April 10, 2003 Report Share Posted April 10, 2003 Be careful with potassium nitrate, you wouldn't want to mix it with sugar and stick a lit match to it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ira Posted April 10, 2003 Author Report Share Posted April 10, 2003 Hmmm, Potassium nitrate and sugar? Just pour the two together or does it have to be mixed in water to mix well and then dried? Hehehe, have to try that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajbroome Posted April 10, 2003 Report Share Posted April 10, 2003 Ira said... > Potassium nitrate and sugar? Just pour the two together or > does it have to be mixed in water to mix well and then dried? > Hehehe, have to try that Here's a safe way of doing it: http://www.vro.be/research/propellants/ ... npage.html or less so: http://www.unitednuclear.com/smoke.htm Note: Playing with explosives is dangerous and is not recommended. Andrew. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pauly Posted April 10, 2003 Report Share Posted April 10, 2003 I'm going to try it tomorrow ,sounds like lots of boys will be boys fun, cheers Andrew Pauly Ps. this fertilzer subject has been very interesting , Ill put all this info to use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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