Tabz

Puff

Can i please say that my original post, was not a 'personal' attack on the pet shop, so can we please clear the air on that straight away. All i was trying to do was make people aware of how dragons are kept in pet shops. I'm sorry for naming the pet shop in my first post, before being edited, i should have forseen that it would kick up a storm, it honestly was not my intention. As far as i have seen the general standard of living given to dragons being kept in pet shops has been pretty poor, in all the pet shops I have seen dragons being kept in, there seems to have been a lack of knowledge on the proper care of dragons. I personally believe that pet shops should not be allowed selling these kinds of animals, i believe they come with far too much responsibilty, and that their young lives are far too fragile too be brought up with less than the best possible care and environment. I believe that it should be left to the breeders. I guess what i was trying to say with my original post is that pet shops are not where to buy dragons from, and please everyone, i am entitled to that opinion. Would i not be right to say that a pet shop has a responsibility to provide the utmost care for all of their animals that they keep, making sure that all of their special needs and requirements are taken care of? Would i not also be right to say that pet shops have everything needed to provide the perfect environment for dragons right at their fingertips? ie, proper size tanks, proper lighting, proper food, proper heat and books with information on the care of dragons. I don't know what book they've read but i cant think of any that says its ok to keep dragons and blue tongues together, neither any book that says that young dragons can eat vegetables as big as their head, nor any book thats says its wise to keep that many maturing dragons in one tank. I can recommend 'The Bearded Dragon Manual' by the Herpetocultural Society, released by AVS Books, Its the best book i've read on the care for Bearded Dragons, and may i suggest that if the Manager of said pet shop reads this, that he stocks this book so that buyers of dragons have some proper info on what they are buying into. Perhaps a little personal interest and education would do well in all pet shops. Can I please say that all i said was that i believed it to be a woman selling dragons to the shop, having no idea who, i did not name you, nor do i have any idea who you are. I am sorry that your name was brought up, but that was not my doing. Can you please tell me where/who recommended that it was ok to feed slaters to dragons? It is my understanding that because of the rotting wood they eat, they are highly likely to carry parasites. Personally, not something i would like to expose my dragon to. Nevertheless, keeping slaters in a pile of wood chips, so that the dragon has to take in mouthfuls of dirt or wood to eat, is not a good idea. Anybody who has read any information on impaction should know that that is common sense. To you snakey, can i please say while i do believe that dragons in the wild may eat spiders and slaters, can i also say that dragons in the wild also carry a lot of parasites. Parasites which do not appear to affect them because they have a an immune system built up from birth to handle them. Do you not agree that by taking on the responsibility of a dragon, it is your duty to replicate its natural environment as best as you can. Would you not also agree that taking all the bad, harmful things out of that environment, it is in your best interest to provide the best possible life for your dragon I'm all for creating a natural environment for your dragon to live in but when it comes to this 'in the wild' stuff. You have to understand that your dragon IS NOT IN the wild. So things that happen, 'in the wild' are not always the best thing for your dragon, and the way i see it a vivarium without predators and without parasites and with perfect temps is a bloody good upgrade from the real thing. That may be fact, but it does not make sense. Why would you take a dragon that is stressed out by creatures its own size, and put it in a tank with creatures 4 x its size? that dragon should be in its own tank! If your talking about the smaller of the two in the bluey tank, when i saw it, it was curled in a ball hiding in the darkest corner of the tank. This is the last thing i'm gonna pull you up on mate. I dont know how big your tank is, how many dragons you keep in there or what lighting set up you have, but what i do know is that the main dragon tank they have is definately insufficient. Red basking lights are bad, because they are not bright enough and cause lethargy in dragons, the uv tube, is too far away and is shining through glass (dragons need to be able to get within 6 inches of the tube to get any real benefit out of it). And most of all, the obvious one, is that there are too many adolescent dragons in that cage, you can see they have dominance issues because they are lying on top of each other and are taking bites out of each other. I am truly sorry about this being blown out of proportion. Sorry about long post.

Tank has been sold Thanks

is the branch where he is near the light or above the light? can he get closer to the light from his new position? Have you checked the temp on your basking rock? might be too high for him, so hes moved to where he likes the temp better.

Could be keen ay, would be nice to meet some other reptile keepers around Auks, and put some faces to names. Newbies welcome?

Do you use beach sand or the exoterra stuff? beach sand is no good because of the salt, ive heard they lick it more often. The idea behind impaction is that you wouldnt see it in the poo as it compacts in the stomach, although if he is still pooing regularly then i think you're safe. as for the uv bulb. it is recommended that you change them every 6months as the production of uv/uvb diminishes over time. also it is important to note that a uv tube is only good for a bout 2 days of sunlight a month. not much when you think about it. also, to get any real use out of the uv tube, your dragon needs to able to get within 6inches of it. I cant imagine at 5 months your dragon would be trying to brumate. it may be coccidia, there is a really good vet on at the Blockhouse Bay end of White Swan Rd if you live in Auckland, i know of a few dragon breeders taking there lizards there. they do fecal exams onsite, it may be worth taking them a fresh sample for them to check, i think it costs like $10 ad its worth doing every so often anyway, so it cant hurt, and at least you will know. I had a similar situation with my last dragon around the same age (5-6 months), he became really lethargic and went off food. It turned out to be coccidia. It sounds to me that your temps are to low to begin with, so i wouldnt drop them any further. dragons need a temp of about 38-39 degrees to digest their food properly. i noticed my dragon was being a bit lazy today, i checked the temps under his basking spot and it was too low, i changed it to a bigger wattage bulb and instantly he was eating ferociously and running all over the place. Its not really neccessary to drop their temps slightly in winter until their second year. What are you using to check the temps? sorry about long post

Your enclosure should have a basking spot with a surface temp of 38 - 43 degrees. And the cooler side should be about 26 degrees. Does the sand cover the whole of the enclosure? sand can cause impaction if digested, does your dragon lick the sand often? do you feed it in the sand? if you must have sand, i suggest you keep it in a container or dish inside the viv as a dig box as opposed to an entire substrate. Do you have UV lamps? can he get to within 6inches of them? Do you use vitamin supplements? Do you keep your dragon alone, or does he have a mate in the tank?

You can complain to them, but what if they say "right well no one can have dragons now"? They saw me in there taking photos, I'm gonna give it a few days then I'll try writing them a letter.

Just went to a petshop, and was disgusted with the conditions that they are keeping their dragons in. I've never really been happy with how they keep them there and have spoken to them about it before, but its gotten worse since. This dragon was so skinny and had no toes on his front left foot. Same dragon with tail rot. Same dragon showing how skinny he is. Dragon was kept in a tank with another smaller dragon who looked like he had a tail kink, and these two massive blueys. This is the food they had for them, chunks of carrot and apple bigger than their mouths, fine for a blue tongue maybe, but not for a dragon. This was in their other dragon tank, a bowl with slaters and large wood chips, dirt and bark. Slaters carry parasites because of the rotting wood they eat. The tank also had ants and spiders running through it, i imagine from the wood chips. Sorry about bad quality of photos, only had camera phone. The other tank had 4 dragons in it, thank wasn't even big enough for one. Some of them had bits of tail and fingers missing. And the uv light was a single tube fluoro placed on top of the glass, about 2 foot away from the dragons. Way too far away and through the glass! What are they thinking!? I'm pretty sure its a woman who supplies the dragons to that shop, and if shes on the forum i suggest she goes down there and sorts it out. its disgusting. I wish there was someone to complain to, but with current problems with keeping reptiles in NZ I'm afraid it will lead to heaps of trouble for owners.

If anyone is wanting to view, I'll be at home for most of the long weekend. Please call me, Tyson on 021447911

when i used to have turtles i was told that too much sun causes green algae, and not enough sun causes brown algae. i moved the tank out of direct sunlight and the green algae wasn't as bad my 2 cents

Gotta love TradeMe. That deal fell through. SO! Cage is back up for sale:) I live in Ranui in West Auckland, if anyone wants to come and have a look.

Hi, my name's Tyson. I built that cage:) I was going to put it up on this site to see if anyone is interested but i sold it last night hopefully. If it falls through I'll post on here to let everyone know its for sale again. You're right mate, its worth more than that. All the equipment and fittings involved in that cage cost more than $800 to the average person, i.e (without discounts). To the lucky person that gets it, they're getting the labour for free. My only interest was paying off the new cage:)