Joe

!drool:

I'm not a guru, but I do love Apistos Dan would know more than me. That's not true at all :-? If I had put more effort into my trifasciata by getting some live food cultures set up for the fry, I swear I would have much fry more right now. That's partly true about the current - if it is really strong they don't like it that much, but as long as there are quiet spots in the tank then they'll be okay. A decent current is a good idea, to stir up the bottom so the crap gets sucked up by the filter. You can siphone it up off the bottom but you'll have to be careful not to suck fry up. The good thing with a bigger tank is that they'll hang out in different spots, so while they're at one end you can vaccume the gravel at the other end and vice versa. Soft water (pH less than 7 - about 6 or so), live food and a tank with the base dimensions of 45x30cm or bigger per pair is required. You can use oak leaves (boiled first to make them sink, and to kill any greeblies) for a more natural look too. If you don't want to use oak leaves then add peat or alder cones to the filter. They love tannin-rich water. Decorate the tank with bogwood, and use natural sand or natural fine gravel. If you want to use plants, get something that will grow aerial leaves because with tannin-rich water most plants won't grow very well because the light intensity will decrease faster with the tannins. Something like Indian fern would be ideal. I'm getting some for my 140L Apistogramma trifasciata tank. When they're breeding feed the fry brine shrimp or some other small live food. I lost a lot because I have no live food for them so I feed them dry food. Sometimes the male will eat the fry and he may have to be removed. But some males are excellent parents and can be left with the mother and the fry. Partial water changes (20-30%) every week or so (for a larger tank; smaller tanks should be changed once a week at the least) are good. Don't change too much water at the same time, and don't change the water chemistry too quickly because it will shock them and then they'll get stressed. If you want to redo the tank, save as much of the old water as possible. Dither fish aren't necessary, but if you really want to add some then get something very small like Ember Tetras (Hyphessobrycon amandae). I'm getting some Green Neons (Paracheirodon simulans) to put with mine. This site has great information Also click the link in my signature for my Apistogramma trifasciata tank journal.

Hey there 60L is a little small for electric yellows don't you think? I mean, you could have a few when they are really, really little but when they grow they are quite territorial and need a lot more space to swim around. Maybe look at something smaller like either Microgeophagus ramirezi, Pelvicachromis taeniatus or Apistogramma trifasciata and a group of tetras?

Yay there's females :bounce: Are you going to get one from Hollywoods Dan?

Awesome Hopefully there's some females in this shipment :bounce:

Wow they're actually still around in the shops? :bounce: I really wish I had more tanks

Tables zuri08 Just wondered are you going to breed from him or is he just a display fish?

Usually I hate mutations and hybrids but this is gorgeous !drool:

Beautiful !drool: Where'd you get him?

Aww damn! Lol. I thought that a lot of them were hard to breed and that there was much less of all that hybridization stuff going on? I'm sure I read that about plecs somewhere?

Yeah that's pretty much how I feel too haha I also am not a huge fan of normal neons, but I don't mind them. I'm getting Green Neons (next week for sure!) which are way cooler and I want to breed them in my 140L aquarium which is a good size for breeding lots of small fish. The thing that I like most about these fish is that they are very uncommon and rarely bred in captivity because people like normal neons or Cardinals, so they are probably much closer to a wild generation since they are mainly wild-caught. I don't think that they're mass-bred in Asia like Cardinals or normal neons. I'll try and find out for sure though because it would be interesting to know.

Yeah I know I could get them but they cost a bomb! Also they wouldn't be very helpful if I was trying to breed my Apistos because they'd eat the fry :lol: If I had more tanks then I'd get into plecs seriously, because they are so awesome and are also one of the few types of fish where there are little or no man-made colour morphs or hybrids which is good for me because I don't like mutations.

I was refering to Africans. Like some of the F1 fish that have been imported - it would be a shame if people were to hybridize those Even a lot of specifically-bred hybrids aren't nice IMO. Whether somebody likes hybrids or not is a matter of opinion. Personally I think all those hybrid species you listed (especially parrots and flowerhorns) are a waste of tank space and I'd never dream of keeping them :sick: But if you like them then that's cool with me The thing I like about this hobby is that there's something for everyone. I just wish that people would be more careful when hybridizing fish and make sure that they don't breed out the natural morphs altogether.

Gosh there are so many cool plecs that I want... Here's a few L183 Ancistrus dolichopterus L168 Dekeyseria brachyura Hypancistrus sp. L250 Hypancistrus sp. L260 L129 Hypancistrus debilittera Peckoltia sp. L140

I do not play "call of duty" whatever on earth that is (I assume it is a computer game). I will admit that I am a noob, but don't go round stereotyping people because of their age. I do not play any computer games at all and I think that a lot of them are a waste of time and are mindless violent rubbish. And I do not like slang. In fact I can never have a proper conversation with most of my classmates because I can't understand the crap that spews out of their mouths. I do not think that slang is the correct definition of words and I avoid using it. I suppose your statement brings you down to my level in some ways, so shame on you. Ira and Smidey your explainations of the word "frag" make sense. I apologise for my ignorance, stupidity and for being born :oops: I am also sorry if I have been disrespectful in any of my previous posts, and I shouldn't be such a cocky retard. I admit that I was wrong and I will learn from this mistake.

I was refering to the fact that the actual meaning of the word has nothing to do with fragments ;D

Your 50L setup sounds very cute! Photos please?

I thought that they were trying to be clever by shortening "mutation" and it sounded stupid. I didn't realise that they were using it in that context, and until today I didn't actually know the definition of the word but I have heard "mutt" in reference to dogs. Apologies for my ignorance :oops: "Frag" has nothing to do with coral fragments so IMO it is just stupid when used in that context. This is what it actually means; frag /frag/ Noun: A hand grenade. Verb: Deliberately kill (an unpopular senior officer), typically with a hand grenade. I can understand if hybrids are being bred specifically, but IMO accidental hybrid fry should be culled.

Wow that looks cool :thup:

Why does everyone call them "mutts"? It sounds so stupid :facepalm: A bit like calling coral cuttings "frags". And I hope they do die of bloat or some other nasty disease too. I think it is horrible when people go to the trouble of breeding nice fish and importing nice fish and people then go and do this. It's a disgrace to the hobby, especially in NZ where we don't have much of a variety.

Looks awesome, but I would worry about evaporation causing less water to flow into the jar resulting in the canister running dry which isn't good. Even if you have a lid on the tank (which slows evaporation down) over time the water somehow slowly seems to evaporate a bit. I'd like to try and make a surface skimmer out of acrylic tubes, and has a tube with a float attached so it bobs up and down with the water level and constantly stays at the right level so it is always getting the correct flow of water.

Go to Hollywood Fish Farms. They have some awesome cichlids like these; viewtopic.php?f=24&t=58984 viewtopic.php?f=24&t=58910

In a tank that big 10 tetras is gonna look weird. You need to quadruple that number at least

:lol: Nah I think I'll give it a miss this time. Maybe if I do well at college and go to uni I could work for MAF and look at getting more plants added to the allowed list and we could get way cooler things then :thup: However I highly doubt that that'll ever happen :facepalm:

Ok I think I might not buy it then. I think Liam is right and that it is probably Green Pine. Thanks for the helpful suggestions guys!