snookie Posted August 4, 2012 Report Share Posted August 4, 2012 i have just found out that prawns are not good as they contain thiaminase , and causes Thiamine Deficiency Syndrome and thinking about fish losses and symptoms i have had in the past sort of makes sense , i have been killing my fish slowly :facepalm: probably old news to some but not to me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F15hguy Posted August 4, 2012 Report Share Posted August 4, 2012 small amounts wouldn't hurt though would it?... hrmmm Thiamine deficiency in humans is called beriberi and causes brain damage, and is atributed to alcohol consumption... beer and prawns, sounds like the diet of a certain country I know across a certain ditch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F15hguy Posted August 4, 2012 Report Share Posted August 4, 2012 http://www.wetwebmedia.com/ca/volume_6/volume_6_1/thiaminase.htm good article. if you can't be bothered reading it all here is the summary How can I avoid the thiamine deficiency syndrome? Prevention is the best way to “treat” the thiamine deficiency syndrome. Things to avoid include: 1. Restrict feeding thiaminase containing fish to no more than 20% of all meals. 2. Avoid feeding exclusively frozen bivalves or shrimps, because these potentially have very high thiaminase content. 3. Avoid fish that was frozen for long periods (several months). Things to do: 1. Keep the diet generally as varied as possible! Remember, nutritional shortcomings in one type of food will be cancelled out by the other types of food, so the more types of food, the smaller the chance of nutrient imbalances. 2. Soak food in a vitamin product intended for pet fish prior to feeding at least once a week, more often when feeding lots of shrimps and bivalves! 3. Get small packages of food, and use them up quickly. Final words Thiaminase-containing food will not be instantly lethal to your pets, but over the long term can result in a slow decline in health. Simple measures and a little conscientiousness when buying and preparing food is all that is needed to easily avoid Thiamine Deficiency Syndrome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snookie Posted August 4, 2012 Author Report Share Posted August 4, 2012 very informative thankyou :smln: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wee2 Posted August 5, 2012 Report Share Posted August 5, 2012 beer and prawns, sounds like the diet of a certain country I know across a certain ditch beer cant go with raw seafood it may likely cause gout in oriental Medicine point view. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henward Posted August 5, 2012 Report Share Posted August 5, 2012 beer cant go with raw seafood it may likely cause gout in oriental Medicine point view. A lot of Oriental medicine is basd on myth. My parents too believe some of that. there was also a Oriental medical thng that says, if you have a cold, flue or feeling unwell, you cannot eat Lamb, Goat or Deer or something, Because those meats are considered to be 'hot meats' i dont believe much oriental medicinal things. I mean, Tiger Testicles - Bear bile - rhino horn? nah...... 8) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamC Posted August 5, 2012 Report Share Posted August 5, 2012 A lot of Oriental medicine is basd on myth. My parents too believe some of that. Beer and shell fish are both common causes of gout where the person is already a gout sufferer. Most gout sufferers (90%) are renal under excretors of uric acid, so an oral purine load will cause a spike in the blood levels which are already saturated and so is likely to lead to crystal deposition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F15hguy Posted August 5, 2012 Report Share Posted August 5, 2012 or you could just enjoy a cold one with a few shrimp and then deal with it later Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caryl Posted August 6, 2012 Report Share Posted August 6, 2012 "Hello, you look like you are in pain. What's the problem?" "Oh, nothing much, I am just a renal under excretor." :sml2: They say you learn something every day. I did not know that shrimps can have very high thiaminase content. :dunno: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F15hguy Posted August 6, 2012 Report Share Posted August 6, 2012 renal under excretor??? piss taker?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueether Posted August 6, 2012 Report Share Posted August 6, 2012 renal under excretor??? piss taker?? no, just couldn't give a piss :digH: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F15hguy Posted August 6, 2012 Report Share Posted August 6, 2012 :sml1: :slfg: :sml1: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henward Posted August 6, 2012 Report Share Posted August 6, 2012 fair enough, just pointing out that there are many myths out there so i would second guess 'old wives tales' before taking them on board. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F15hguy Posted August 6, 2012 Report Share Posted August 6, 2012 imo you should be feeding a variety of food anyway so your average fishkeeper shouldn't have problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanmin4304 Posted August 6, 2012 Report Share Posted August 6, 2012 I had a massive and bad bruise on my arm when younger that my Chinese friend cured with a bottle of traditional medicicine in about a quarter of the time I would have expected. I have also been to a Chinese trained doctor who put three fingers on my pulse and proceeded to give me my complete medical history. Some of it may be myth but european medicine has a lot to answer for sometimes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henward Posted August 6, 2012 Report Share Posted August 6, 2012 I had a massive and bad bruise on my arm when younger that my Chinese friend cured with a bottle of traditional medicicine in about a quarter of the time I would have expected. I have also been to a Chinese trained doctor who put three fingers on my pulse and proceeded to give me my complete medical history. Some of it may be myth but european medicine has a lot to answer for sometimes. yeah, i have seen those. we had witch doctors in philippines too. one believed he could penetrate human skin with his fingers to remove tumors, with out blood or pain...... :facepalm: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F15hguy Posted August 6, 2012 Report Share Posted August 6, 2012 please remember that the placebo effect is incredibly strong (GrahamC should know the exact figures) and pharmaceutical testing has to beat this level before it can be considered. there is a book called "Where there is no doctor" which describes the taking of modern medicine into Africa and their belief in injections in one area being so strong that people were almost Dying from no descernable cause after being cured of certain ailments, yet after an injection of pure water they came right. (shows both the positive and negative effects of placebo) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henward Posted August 6, 2012 Report Share Posted August 6, 2012 please remember that the placebo effect is incredibly strong (GrahamC should know the exact figures) and pharmaceutical testing has to beat this level before it can be considered. there is a book called "Where there is no doctor" which describes the taking of modern medicine into Africa and their belief in injections in one area being so strong that people were almost Dying from no descernable cause after being cured of certain ailments, yet after an injection of pure water they came right. (shows both the positive and negative effects of placebo) definitely. that is why when meds are tested, there are double and triple blind placebos etc. i know what you mean. i guess im just conveying my distain for culture based stuff:D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanmin4304 Posted August 6, 2012 Report Share Posted August 6, 2012 A lot of the meds we use a re the same as Asian or African meds The Africans might chew the leaf, the Asians might make soup from the leaf and the Europeans make a synthetic copy in the form of a pill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henward Posted August 6, 2012 Report Share Posted August 6, 2012 A lot of the meds we use a re the same as Asian or African meds The Africans might chew the leaf, the Asians might make soup from the leaf and the Europeans make a synthetic copy in the form of a pill. yes, in fact, some things are actually better from nature but one advantage that modern medicine has is the delivery system some agents from nature are effective but are unable to be transmitted effectively into the system or certain parts of the body. modern research enables those active ingredients to be transmitted and process by the body effectively. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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