Hamstar99 Posted February 12, 2012 Report Share Posted February 12, 2012 protecting what? the low ph is just slowing their growth. I think a few have been lost in the filter wash up. Hence the ammonia spike. lifting the Ph will help them recover a little more quickly back to the original levels. Mini cycles and ammonia spikes dont usually take this long to sort them selves out in an established tank. Usually wouldn't think any more than a day. water changes will only harden the water if it bore water maybe. Regular water changes will help keep the ph more stable with soft water though as your Ph drops with nitrification process. Another thought - you could try is some stress zyme if you have any. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanmin4304 Posted February 12, 2012 Report Share Posted February 12, 2012 Bore water is infinately variable like any other water source so it will not make the water harder always. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueether Posted February 13, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 13, 2012 To stop the speculation about water our water is quite soft [EDIT]correction the tap water today is at 7.4 [/EDIT] as it comes off a native bush clad hill via rain. I suspect that with the pH at or below 6 this stopped the bacteria re-building up after the filter clean. Another mitigating factor is that it is a native tank so they are fed raw heart most of the time, this would have a very high oxygen demand to breakdown any small bits that get into the filter - this might have also added to the slow nitrification bacteria growth. tonight: pH at about 6.4 - 6.6 ammonia still about 2ppm off to do another ~20% W/C Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamstar99 Posted February 13, 2012 Report Share Posted February 13, 2012 sweet. Temperature will also slow them down. I guess if its your natives it will be cold? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueether Posted February 13, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 13, 2012 sweet. Temperature will also slow them down. I guess if its your natives it will be cold? very, about 16.5 - 17 deg IMG_20120131_164823 by nzbeeman, on Flickr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanmin4304 Posted February 13, 2012 Report Share Posted February 13, 2012 When you say your tap water is 7.4 do you mean pH or KH because if you mean the latter it is not very soft. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueether Posted February 13, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 13, 2012 When you say your tap water is 7.4 do you mean pH or KH because if you mean the latter it is not very soft. pH, I had always thought that the water here was soft and acidic. Don't have tests for hardness here but I could probably find that out from my oldman (they test the water as it enters the dairy factory) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamC Posted February 13, 2012 Report Share Posted February 13, 2012 So your source water drops from a pH of 7.4 to under 6 in your tank without deliberate acidification? As your pH is rising but ammonia levels are not falling further, perhaps you need to stop the water changes until the ammonia levels start to fall again as the rising pH is converting ammonium to ammonia. Or use something to lock up the ammonia such as Ammo Lock, while continuing the water changes? Ammo lock converts ammonia also to ammonium which remains available to nitrifying bacteria. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueether Posted February 14, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 14, 2012 Total Ammonia has halved to about 1ppm NO2- has done a small spike, about .25ppm and NO3- has jumped up to about 10 I guess that lifting the pH up to above 6.4 has kick started the bacteria :bounce: Any idea why I tested for about .25ppm ammonia normally? Do you thing I am reading green where there is none? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamstar99 Posted February 14, 2012 Report Share Posted February 14, 2012 not sure. Are you using API solutions? Can you test your tap water or something that should read zero. Should be bright yellow, pretty hard to get mixed up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueether Posted February 14, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 14, 2012 not sure. Are you using API solutions? Can you test your tap water or something that should read zero. Should be bright yellow, pretty hard to get mixed up. Yes API's Master Test Kit. Two secs and I'll test some tap water... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ira Posted February 14, 2012 Report Share Posted February 14, 2012 Yes API's Master Test Kit. Two secs and I'll test some tap water... It's been 7 minutes. You're late. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueether Posted February 14, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 14, 2012 It's been 7 minutes. You're late. Tap water is defiantly very yellow, when I have tested the tank, the 60 l or the 400l, there has been a slight green tint to it, somewhere just below .25? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamstar99 Posted February 14, 2012 Report Share Posted February 14, 2012 do you use stress zyme, prime etc? They can give false readings. If you have zero nitrites and nitrates you are all good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanmin4304 Posted February 14, 2012 Report Share Posted February 14, 2012 I wouldn't expect zero nitrates as the nitrites will end up as nitrates and most tap water contains nitrates. Possible in a heavily planted tank. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamC Posted February 14, 2012 Report Share Posted February 14, 2012 not sure. Are you using API solutions? Can you test your tap water or something that should read zero. Should be bright yellow, pretty hard to get mixed up. I get my daughter to check the colours for me ... my colour vision ain't that good! What do people think of those Seachem ammonia meters that stay in your tank for a year? I find that much easier to read, and it provides readings below the API liquid test kit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueether Posted February 15, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 Any idea why I tested for about .25ppm ammonia normally? Do you thing I am reading green where there is none?I have had a thought about this. I had never tested before I put the chiller on the cf1200 output, this dropped the flow through the filter by a good 1/3 to about 500 l/h, maybe there was just not enough turnover of tank water through the filter and balance point was somewhere between 0 and .25ppm total ammonia :dunno: Anyway back to my slightly bigger than mini ammonia spike The pH is heading back down (now 6.4) The ammonia fall has started to tapper off ( ~.75 - 1.0ppm?) The nitrites are still there (below .25ppm) The nitrates are still climbing (~15ppm?) I might have to get more flow across the lime chips to stabilise the pH at about 6.6 - 6.8, I must test the pH of the 2 or 3 streams/creeks that most of my fish ave come from to see what their pH is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamstar99 Posted February 15, 2012 Report Share Posted February 15, 2012 I wouldn't expect zero nitrates as the nitrites will end up as nitrates and most tap water contains nitrates. Possible in a heavily planted tank. Sorry. I meant zero nitrites and a some nitrates. My bad. Id say the lime chips will be slow to buffer your ph. Add some baking soda for a quick fix but im not sure the hardness and Ph levels of your natives. Same with the water temp. the higher the better but obviously without stressing the natives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueether Posted February 23, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 23, 2012 Just an update on the 400 l tank's issues: Mostly normal again, but there was a slight ammonia spike when I went back to the fishes normal feeding - to be expected I guess. Oh I found some references to the pH of the streams that the fish came out of 7.53 to 7.67, so somewhat higher than my tank has been running at. It is sitting at about a pH of 6.8 to 7.0 atm. tests5 by nzbeeman, on Flickr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamC Posted February 23, 2012 Report Share Posted February 23, 2012 Any chance of putting another pH specific scale on a right vertical axis? The current range on the y-axis doesn't really show the important pH values. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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