ferny troubles

[Sophia]

need some thoughts of yours....

I have java fern and bolbitis and they are not thriving. The java fern was healthy and green when I bought it many weeks ago and it lived happily in a bucket with incandescent lighting until the last couple of weeks when it has been in the tank. The bolbitis was bought at HFF and was nice and green and crispy leaved but since I put it in there it's slowly getting blackened and floppy (sorry HFF :oops: ).

Other plants that are doing well: tiger lotus, riccia, lily pad verticilata thingy, cabomba.

Water parameters normal/good, daily dose of flourish comp, 1 x 8w 14000k T5 for 10 hours.

The only thing I can put it down to is that the ferns are attached to wood that is undergoing algae transformation as it beds in, OR that it wants to be in the current and it's not, OR that it doesn't like the wood.

There is a piece of windelov wedged into a piece of smaller piece of the same batch of wood but it's in the current, and it's still happily green.

The algae looks like this:

it started as a wispy slime that could be blown off with a dropper to this penicilin like creature that is attached like a fine fur. if you blow it around the white bits float like snow.... it's quite attractive actually haha.

so any thoughts? have I overlooked something vital in fern care? I understood that they are low maintenance, that you stick em to a bit of wood (in this case they are wedged) and eventually they attach and grow.

[Sophia]

here they are

the algae doesn't grow on the plant, only the wood

[phoenix44]

looks like the wood is rotting, and you have too much light for the ferns.

[Caryl]

No idea what it is but it certainly looks different! :roll:

[Sophia]

looks like the wood is rotting, and you have too much light for the ferns.

too much wattage or spectrum?

the lighting at the shop was pretty bright I thought

the wood is rock hard, it's not rotting as in going soft

[Sophia]

No idea what it is but it certainly looks different! :roll:

artistic

[phoenix44]

it doesn't have to go soft to rot. take it out and smell it to see if it is rotting.

Light cannot be measured in watts, but I mean the light is too bright for it at the moment.

Also bear in mind that congo fern is grown emersed in a highly humid environment, and at the moment it is totally submersed so some of the leaves will die.

The black is associated with too much light. It does adapt to the change, and if a few weeks- months you will find new lighter green leaves popping up. well curling out..

[Sophia]

I don't think I can get bulbs less bright than 8w but if I take them off and plant on lower wood or weigh them down to the gravel it will reduce the amount of light they get. Or do you mean to reduce the Ks??

the congo fern was submersed when I bought it

HFF had been teasing me with it as being not for sale for a couple of weeks already too

anyway I will take out the wood

shame as it is such a good shape

it does smell but i don't really know if it's a bad smell, is just a smell

[Sophia]

maybe I should be asking instead are there other non stem plants I could be using that would prefer the conditions?

I prefer the non stem plants as it's rather like planting your garden with perennials than annuals, longer lasting and a little more interesting

[phoenix44]

No, I do not mean reduce the K rating. That refers to the colour of the tube. like 4000K is yellow, 6500K is white, 14000K is bluer etc.

Watts refers to how much power the tube uses, so your 8W T5 will be much brighter than an 8W T8 tube.

It sounds like a typical blue planet light for some reason, so you can try putting the plant lower down or in a dark corner somewhere.

Some sword plants will do well in that tank, but grow large.

A medium sized plant is ech. amazonicus.

They all need good soil nutrients though, so JBL balls are recommended.

Crypts will do well in that tank too.

[Sophia]

got JBL balls :bounce:

I will now offend my big killie and take out the wood

Stella, you can breathe a sigh of relief haha :lol:

tank rescape on the way :roll:

[Sophia]

hello nameless HFF person, thanks for your comments.

Did you grow it with Co2? what lighting was it grown with originally?

I've pruned off the obviously rotted leaves and weighted the rest on the bottom so hopefully it will pick up again

that driftwood was smellier than I thought too :roll:

[alanmin4304]

Your "algae" looks like it could be hydra which is an animal.

[Jennifer]

Hi Sophia, I have windelov growing well in very low lighting and I have some growing well in very, very high lighting so it is pretty adaptable in my opinion. However, it can go into shock when it moves to a new situation but I find that it bounces back well and grows very fast, particularly when you supplement with micronutrients (I am sure HFF has some Flourish Comprehensive that you could get if you don't have some already). My bolbitis prefers the brightest area of the tank but again, it is used to the light. You can see the new growth on the windelov as it appears as translucent dark green tips to the leaves.

Hope that helps. They are great plants and are very hardy.

[Sophia]

Your "algae" looks like it could be hydra which is an animal.

I've seen hydra and it wasn't that but anyway it is now gone.

the fish are now a bit naked!

Hi Sophia,

hello

yes, thank you for your comments, good to hear of another's experience. I have been giving a daily dose of Flourish comp. I had windelov for a short time before I took down my other tank and I enjoyed it then. I have instructed them all to perk up again or else :-?

[Sophia]

No, I do not mean reduce the K rating. That refers to the colour of the tube. like 4000K is yellow, 6500K is white, 14000K is bluer etc.

Watts refers to how much power the tube uses, so your 8W T5 will be much brighter than an 8W T8 tube.

It sounds like a typical blue planet light for some reason, so you can try putting the plant lower down or in a dark corner somewhere.

Some sword plants will do well in that tank, but grow large.

A medium sized plant is ech. amazonicus.

They all need good soil nutrients though, so JBL balls are recommended.

Crypts will do well in that tank too.

thank you P44 by the way

[Joe]

My Bolbitis loves CO2. I have a little bit tied to a piece of bogwood at the bottom of the tank, and it gets mulm and decaying matter on it which also helps it along. Water current does help, but it is not crucial. Once I just had it drifting around the bottom of the tank, where there was no current, and it was sprouting little leaves quite happily!

[Sophia]

Joefish your plant sounds crazy like you :lol: (in a good way!)

I won't be getting into Co2 but some new bogwood may be in order when I have settled on a new layout.

[phoenix44]

thank you P44 by the way

Happy to help

[Joe]

I have much less Bolbitis than you (only 3 tiny plants I NEED more, but I'm saving up for a $3000 aprox. Arcadia metal halide pendant lightinghood, so I can't spend money!) but it seems quite ok. CO2 in my tank is DIY. It is easy. Surely you can rig up a DIY system. I use a 3 liter juice bottle, with:

2 cups white sugar (dissolved in 1/2 a liter of boiling water, then cooled afterwards by being topped up to 1 liter with cold water). I then put it in the bottle.

1/2 a sachet of yeast

A squirt of tomato sauce

Then I shake the bottle, and top it up to about 10-15cm from the top.

I use a Pollen Glass Nano diffuser.

[FuglyDragon]

If you want to cut down the light over ferns get some wire or plastic mesh and place it on top of the lid between the light and glass lid to 'diffuse' the light hitting the fern. I had lots of problems with java fern (and bolbitus) producing lots of brown patches on leaves untill i cut the nutrients way back, seems they dont like the level of nutrients i use for most other plants so now i grow them in a tub of their own with very sparse nutrients added. they deffinately grow better in a emerged hydroponic state (just roots in water, leaves in moist warm air)

[Jennifer]

I had a bit of windelov that I started. At first it looked like this beneath the three T8 tubes:

It got some brown spots that went away with micronutrient/macronutrient supplementation:

Now the entire log is in this tank under 4 PowerGlo T5 tubes and for the first 6 weeks it went brown but now it is all coming back and growing like a weed with a much higher level of fertilisers and CO2:

[Sophia]

thanks for the interesting comments, I am absorbing!

The challenge for me now is deciding on the new layout, what fixtures such as rock or wood I can get away with in the small tank.

After I took the wood out last night the fish were rootling around in the gravel and then later I found the main 'couple' up to fishy business again in one of the hollows. They obviously aren't as concerned about lack of cover as I thought they would be!!

[Sophia]

Some sword plants will do well in that tank, but grow large.

A medium sized plant is ech. amazonicus.

They all need good soil nutrients though, so JBL balls are recommended.

Crypts will do well in that tank too

there is an amazonicus on TM at the moment, looks far too huge for my tank - maybe an exception to the rule.

have been looking here http://www.aquahobby.com/e_aquarium_plants.php at crypts, they mention these 3 in the 1-20cm size range:

• Green Wendtii Crypt (Cryptocoryne wendtii 'green')

• Brown Wendtii Crypt (Cryptocoryne wendtii)

• Undulated Crypt (Cryptocoryne undulata)

does anyone have any alternative experience that would suggest they wouldn't be happy in my tank? I don't want to plant something that I think will stay small but ends up taking over. I like the brown leafed one for something different but don't know if I have sufficient iron for colour, unless a daily dose of F/Comp would give enough. And if F/Comp & JBL balls is enough iron would I be able to have rotala with red leaves too? I heard that likes iron and more light than I've got to stay pink.

[Jennifer]

I think crypts would go beautifully in your tank. Just plant them and leave them where they are and they will grow fast in the right conditions. In the last two photos above that is C. wendtii brown. Alan was just over a few minutes ago and we reckon it is about 250mm tall. Undulata will not grow that tall.