My big malawi tank project

[trace&steve]

hows it all going???

just measured our tank its 70cm wide and 71cm high and 150cm long

all made of 10mm glass with support braces we made it our selfs i also spoke to my partner and if your interested he can get cheap 10mm glass

let me know if your keen but ill catch ya tomo anyways

[ryanjury]

Would be fairly dodgy making anything that big (especially so over 600mm high) in 10mm glass for a public place..

Talk to a professional tank maker or enlist the help of someone like Barrie for advice first because in a public place you are liable and if anything goes wrong people can die.. Someone had a big tank fail recently think it was Jim R and it threw chucks of 10mm glass across his fishroom and right through other tanks if someone was in there when it happened it wouldn't have been pretty.

[trace&steve]

(dodgy) our tank is not dodgy!!!! fair enough if your having it in a public place i have mine in my lounge and i have small children i dont think mine is dodgy at all we have alot of support braces inside and out!!!!

Would be fairly dodgy making anything that big (especially so over 600mm high) in 10mm glass for a public place..

Talk to a professional tank maker or enlist the help of someone like Barrie for advice first because in a public place you are liable and if anything goes wrong people can die.. Someone had a big tank fail recently think it was Jim R and it threw chucks of 10mm glass across his fishroom and right through other tanks if someone was in there when it happened it wouldn't have been pretty.

[ryanjury]

General rule of thumb if you use the calculations is don't go over 600mm high in 10mm glass..

Do some research, I know I have a tank that is 720mm high in 10mm glass that flexed so much at the bottom (with full bracing even running along every join even bottom to top in all 4 corners) that it blew the seal at the bottom, luckily it didn't shatter and cause damage. It is sitting still broken up against my fence and I am scared to fix it and set it up again as I have my kids and other people in the fishroom all the time I also don't fancy being cut in half by it.

I know that I wouldn't have a tank that tall in 10mm in my house with kids and stuff it is just too risky but it is upto you it may last for years and years or something may go wrong. The lower the safety factor the riskier it is especially if there is an imperfection in the glass maybe a flex in the stand and a kid or something else bumps it or an earthquake etc.

Plenty of info here

search.php?keywords=glass+thickness+calculator&terms=all&author=&sc=1&sf=all&sk=t&sd=d&sr=posts&st=0&ch=300&t=0&submit=Search

And the calculator here

http://www.fnzas.org.nz/index.php?PG=glass2 I think the min you should try and have is a safety factor of 3, you have just over half of that.

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=41468&hilit=glass+thickness+calculator

Did you do any research before you build your tank or did you just get a heap of glass and chuck it all together?

[trace&steve]

:oops: thanx for the info i dont fill it to the top its full of probably 600litres and our kids know not to touch it but never thought of if there was to be a earthquake touch wood!!!! oh now you have me worried but mined you we do have alot of braceing inside and out as you say might last 2 years that gives me a bit to sort out a new one thanks for the heads up

General rule of thumb if you use the calculations is don't go over 600mm high in 10mm glass..

Do some research, I know I have a tank that is 720mm high in 10mm glass that flexed so much at the bottom (with full bracing even running along every join even bottom to top in all 4 corners) that it blew the seal at the bottom, luckily it didn't shatter and cause damage. It is sitting still broken up against my fence and I am scared to fix it and set it up again as I have my kids and other people in the fishroom all the time I also don't fancy being cut in half by it.

I know that I wouldn't have a tank that tall in 10mm in my house with kids and stuff it is just too risky but it is upto you it may last for years and years or something may go wrong. The lower the safety factor the riskier it is especially if there is an imperfection in the glass maybe a flex in the stand and a kid or something else bumps it or an earthquake etc.

Plenty of info here

search.php?keywords=glass+thickness+calculator&terms=all&author=&sc=1&sf=all&sk=t&sd=d&sr=posts&st=0&ch=300&t=0&submit=Search

And the calculator here

http://www.fnzas.org.nz/index.php?PG=glass2 I think the min you should try and have is a safety factor of 3, you have just over half of that.

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=41468&hilit=glass+thickness+calculator

Did you do any research before you build your tank or did you just get a heap of glass and chuck it all together?

:oops: :oops: :oops:

[elusive_fish]

Hi Trace and steve, thanks very much for thinking of my project and offering to help with sourcing the glass! I've talked to Tim from inside oceans and Errol from Bubble and Squeek and both feel that 10mm is sufficient for a 600mm high tank, even in a semi-public location. It sounds like the tank will cost $500 extra to go to 12mm glass. Eek.

Using the safety factor calculator linked by Ryan 10mm has a safety factor of approx 2.5, and 12mm 3.5

What would you guys do if it was your money/project?

[Zev]

Since it is in a public area I would err on the side of caution and go for the 12mm.

We have $4 million Public Liability insurance and the same for Public Indemnity, but the cost to your pride, reputation and sanity would be immeasurable if a little kid were to get injured.

[livingart]

i would go for a minimum safety factor of 3 that would mean there would br no chance of insurance not paying out and minimal chance of injury to someone

[ryanjury]

From that thread that I linked about Caryls tank people were getting reasonable priced 12mm tanks made if it was for my business and there were going to be alot of people cruising around it for my own piece of mind and everyones safety I would go with 12mm. Imagine what would happen if your tank did burst and people got killed or injured how you would feel saving $4-500 to start with? Not to mention the fact you business would be ruined..

In saying that I have no doubt a 10mm tank would be fine but a 12mm would be over engineering it enough to say it is less likely to cause trouble. How thick are the display tanks in most fish shops?

[elusive_fish]

I contacted Greg from tanks2u and was stunned by how cheap the tank would be, even in 12mm, even with $350 in packaging and shipping. As I need to fit the big poly feature in still im thinking to get him to ship the tank with the top bracing not attached, then to get someone local to attach the feature, complete the tank bracing and then do all the sump plumbing.

Anyone see any potential problems with this idea?

[livingart]

the bracing could be attached for shipping in such a way that it would be easy to remove and replace once you got it in place

[elusive_fish]

Everything is coming together now and im only a few weeks off having the tank operational.

One of the final areas I am still undecided on is lighting. I've thought of 4 options (although there will likely be many more) and some pros and cons, as I see it. Please let me know what you think! I've picked an odd sized tank at 2300 long as two 4ft lights would be too long. A 4ft and a 3ft combination would be a better fit.

OPTION 1 - Simple

This is putting 2 rows of aquarium light hoods directly on the glass, either side of the poly feature wall.

PROS: Great control of shadows in the tank, as I could move the lights closer together or further apart and drastically change the way the caves/holes/overhangs look in the tank

CONS: Not overly aeshetic. Can be 'monkeyed' with.

APPROX NEW COST: $390 (including simple tubes)

OPTION 2 - Build a hood

Lighting can be similar to the above option, or potentially cheaper method of buying ballasts, bulbs and reflectors and attaching to the ceiling of the hood

PROS: Stops tampering with the tank or people trying to feed the fish. Looks more 'complete' than 1

CONS: Would be a real pain when it comes to tank maintenance. As the tank is alread quite high I would have to remove the hood completely to be able to get my arm into scrub or vacuum.

OPTION 3- Suspended aquarium light hoods.

This would probably be a 4ft and a 3ft t5 double light hoods that are suspendable, like found here http://www.trademe.co.nz/Home-living/Pets-animals/Fish/Lights-lamps/auction-279958873.htm

PROS: Would look cool? Much easire for tank maintenance than 2

CONS: Poor light control - may be too much light going outside the aquarium for people sitting close. Might not make attractive shdows with centre feature.

APPROX NEW COST: $390 + tubes + hanging stuff

OPTION 4 - Custom made suspended unit

There are commercial hanging t5 lighting units that may work without a custom made hood, or t5 uits could be wired into the suspended hood as shown.

PROS: Possily considerably cheaper? Easy maintentance access

CONS: Would obviously require an electrician. Not as much control over light as other options.

[phoenix44]

Would rule out the last 2 unless you have a hood above the tank, to stop the light from shining in your eyes.

I like option 1, maybe with a hood.

[Ras]

Sorry off topic here.. Where is your cafe elusive_fish?

[ryanjury]

I would go with option 2 you don't want people to have access to the top of your tank or your lighting, plus you can make the hood go down to the water level so the tank appears to be very deep and it hides those water marks that hard water tanks get around the water line.

[Zev]

2 for the reasons Ryan had - could you hinge it off the wall and hook it up when you do maintenance, or hook it up on some sort of ceiling suspension thingy so that you can wind the hood up?

I have seen some marine tanks with this type of setup, some looked pretty damned ugly, though :roll:

[elusive_fish]

I'd have to find some kind of system to lift the hood. Anything that makes maintenance hard will only make me get sick of doing it in the long run. Or maybe it isnt too high to work through the top of the hood? The stand will be about 850 high and the tank 600 on top of it.

[ryanjury]

Make the hood in several pieces so you can just (with the help of whoever else you are working with) lift a section out. Also bear in mind you wont need to lift the lid to do water changes and you can get one of those magnetic algae scrapers to take care of any algae. So you would really only need to get in to get fish out and if this is a display tank then I doubt you would be doing that very often.

[elusive_fish]

Sorry off topic here.. Where is your cafe elusive_fish?

89 New Brighton Mall, New Brighton, Christchurch.

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=89+brighton+mall+new+brighton+christchurch&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=48.956293,78.662109&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=89+Brighton+Mall,+New+Brighton,+Christchurch+8061,+New+Zealand&ll=-43.507422,172.72778&spn=0.005517,0.009602&t=h&z=17&iwloc=A

I might have to put on a cheap food or coffee day for all the chch fnzas people! I got the chance to meet a couple at the cafe already, which was very cool (Hi bdspider, jennifer and caryl!)

[Jennifer]

8) Looking good!

I'd go for option 2 as well but I would rig it so it isn't a problem to get into (if that is possible) nothing worse that a tank that is a pain to get your hands into. :roll:

[alanmin4304]

One thing I prefer but many do not take into account is the height of the tank. I think it should be slightly below eye level when sitting down so you are not looking up into the lights.

[elusive_fish]

so it sounds like 2 is the preferred option, presumably for the tamper free nature.

But I would require some creative solution to be able to get into the tank. Working through the hood would make it very high and you would be restricted. Removing the hood is not an option as it would require at least 2 people and somewhere to put it. I really wanted to avoid option 2, but I guess there is a reason it is the 'standard'.

Anyone know of cheap source for 3ft and 4ft t5 lighting? Pet stores are expensive and lighting store units dont seem to include reflectors to focus the light directly down.

Thanks for the help!

Ben

[phoenix44]

The standard bought lighting "units" will come with reflectors inbuilt. They always do. brands include arcadia, hagen and so on...

[ryanjury]

so it sounds like 2 is the preferred option, presumably for the tamper free nature.

But I would require some creative solution to be able to get into the tank. Working through the hood would make it very high and you would be restricted. Removing the hood is not an option as it would require at least 2 people and somewhere to put it. I really wanted to avoid option 2, but I guess there is a reason it is the 'standard'.

Anyone know of cheap source for 3ft and 4ft t5 lighting? Pet stores are expensive and lighting store units dont seem to include reflectors to focus the light directly down.

Thanks for the help!

Ben

I still think you could have the hood made in a few pieces so it was an easy lift you won't need to get into the tank very often and would most likely be doing that when customers aren't around anyway I would think..

Lighting just buy standard lighting battens from mitre10 or even building recyclers or trademe and stick the right bulbs in them, they wont be T5 but still plenty bright enough if you get some 10k and maybe a blue one, inside your hood you have the room to do 2 banks of them if you want it brighter anyway. You can get an engineering company or maybe someone you know to fold up some ally or something like that to make reflectors for them. Or stick something to the entire underside of your hood, paint it in silver paint or something like that, I have even heard of people using tinfoil but that is probably a little too hori and rough for this job. Building paper might work?

[alanmin4304]

I get my lights and tubes from Lamp specialists but they only do retail for cash. You can buy cheap but good reflectors from most pet shops that clip on to the flouro tube.