dcase Posted July 15, 2007 Report Share Posted July 15, 2007 Hi Am coming to Freshwater forum after suggestion in Welcome Forum. Recently I purchased an Aqua One AR-620 tank & stand - also a 200W heater. I had water in my tank for a week and plants for 4 days ... was just going to initially add some Pearl Danios BUT Animates had a good sale and ended up getting: 6 Pearl Danio 4 Plecostomus Brittlenose 1 Rainbow Shark 6 Peppered Catfish 6 Harlequin Rasbora. I know I am not supposed to add all these at once but price was so good (buy one & get another free). I got them yesterday. I have been told the main thing to watch for is ammonia spiking - I have test strips and so far so good. I also got a pouch of Nitra-Zorb which I have included in the filtration system and I will change a 1/4 of the tank water tomorrow and every 2-3 days for a while. I have some queries: My temperature seems to vary during the from 25.7 to 27.1 - is such variation normal? For the fish in the posting above, what is ideal? I thought around 26 based on some eading I had done. I have shrimp pellots and algae chips to feed the bottomdwellers and tropical flakes for the Danios & Rasbora's but what is best for the Rainbow Shark? It seems to like decimating one of the plants. Also in a couple of weeks I would like to add a couple of feature fish. Any ideas would be appreciated as to what would be compatible. Any advice would be much appreciated regards David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael.qian Posted July 15, 2007 Report Share Posted July 15, 2007 Unfortunately what you did was NOT good. It's a new tank and hasn't been cycled properly yet, adding all those fish at once will definitely create and ammonia spike because there aren't enough bacterias to absorb all the ammonia and turn them into nitrite. This ammonia spike will be very dangerous to your fish, I know it was a good deal getting those fishes for half of what you would pay for them normally, but you also run a very high risk of them dying, ammonia is the more lethal than any other chemicals for the fish. Test for ammonia levels twice a day, change water as neccessary rather than sticking to a schedule, I would change 25% as soon as the ammonia gets over 1ppm, this way your fish have a chance of staying alive. Also don't do any cleaning, that might get rid of some of the beneficial bacteria that turn ammonia into nitrite. When the ammonia stays under 1ppm, only change the water when it beings to rise again, otherwise you'll get rid of some of the beneficial bacteria, but of course still do your regular water change once every week. Feed very little, you don't want the fishes to poop any more than neccessary and contribute to your ammonia levels. 26 is a good temperature to keep them at, though ammonia is less toxic at low temperatures, so I would set the heater to about 24 just for now. Hope this helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caryl Posted July 15, 2007 Report Share Posted July 15, 2007 You won't think it such a good price if they now die on you! The 6 danios on their own would have been best but it is too late now so lets see what we can do to get the fish over this without too much stress and death. The bristlenoses are often referred to as plecostomus but are, in fact, Ancistrus sp. They will have nothing to browse on in a new tank so make sure they get the bottom dweller pellets to eat (same goes for the corys). The ancistrus also appreciate wood in their diet to aid digestion so it would be helpful if you have some driftwood in there. I think though that good quality bottom dweller pellets have wood in them for this purpose. The rainbow shark is too big for your tank. It grows up to 15cm and needs room to swim. Please return it. If you insist on keeping it, and it survives, it is omnivorous and likes a vegetable component in its diet, like spirulina. It may also get aggressive and territorial as it ages, especially in a tank the size of yours. The Nitra-Zorb will probably stuff up your test readings so you won't have a true idea of ammonia levels. The water changes you plan to do will be good and you will need to keep them up until the tank has cycled. The Nitra-Zorb may slow down the process. Temperature will vary (try seeing what it is in the middle of the night when the room temperature has dropped a lot) and your variation is nothing to worry about. Anything between 24 - 27 is fine. Most keep their tanks around 26C. Do not add any more fish until your tank has fully cycled - at least 1 month. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael.qian Posted July 15, 2007 Report Share Posted July 15, 2007 Actually you can put your temperature even lower, as low as 20-22 will be fine for your fish, at least for now until your tank is cycled. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caserole Posted July 15, 2007 Report Share Posted July 15, 2007 I would agree with what has been said already including getting rid of the Nitra-Zorb. But MAKE SURE you keep the water changes up every second day even if you don't fell like it or you think your readings are not that bad, IT WILL hopefully prevent ammonia burns on you fish gills and later nitrite poisoning until the ammonia, nitrite and nitrate readings are 0 in a month or so. Also I would feed you fish sparingly to keep the load on the bacteria low while not starving your fish. Good luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrienne Posted July 15, 2007 Report Share Posted July 15, 2007 Hi, I'll leave the cycling side of things to Caryl and the others. Please if you can return the shark, they like heaps of space, can stir up trouble and also if you have the lid up/off watch out as they like to fly across the tank and out onto the carpet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael.qian Posted July 15, 2007 Report Share Posted July 15, 2007 Or you could return all the fish, cycle the tank without the fish, your fish shop will tell you how, that's one way to make sure all the fish will live. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HummingBird Posted July 15, 2007 Report Share Posted July 15, 2007 I'd recommend keeping the nitra-zorb in there, it'll keep ammonia levels in check till the nitrifying bacteria establishes itself in your filter. I'd say remove it in about a month or so, but watch your ammonia/nitrite levels when you do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purplecatfish Posted July 15, 2007 Report Share Posted July 15, 2007 This is one of the times that I would recommend dosing with stresszyme or cycle as it has the bacteria that you need to convert the ammonia and nitrite. It would be better than using the nitrazorb which will slow down the cycling process. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loopy Posted July 15, 2007 Report Share Posted July 15, 2007 I can offer 2 things here. I don't know how well they will help but possibly worth a thought. 1. I can offer to seed the new filter from one of my well established filters. could really help get the bio-filtration going. 2. Or i can offer to fish-sit some of the fish till the tank settles a bit. I understand the wicked temptation of those dang fish deals at animates over the weekend. I was very tempted myself but we have reached our full capacity for fish i think. Animates do have deals like that on tuesdays and wednesdays too. And if you come and join Totally Tanked i am sure you can get some pretty good info and advice and the occasional good deal there too. I hope we haven't scared you off with too many slaps on the hand and telling offs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanmin4304 Posted July 15, 2007 Report Share Posted July 15, 2007 Forget the pills and ointment and go with loopy a & b. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zev Posted July 15, 2007 Report Share Posted July 15, 2007 Yep, I'd go for Loopys deal as well.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caryl Posted July 15, 2007 Report Share Posted July 15, 2007 Ditto, an excellent offer. Thanks Loopy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jn Posted July 16, 2007 Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 That's a seriously good offer dcase. Think of how peeved you'll be if your bargain fish all die and you have to buy them again near full price! Your tank is probably starting to spike now I bet...and then there is the nitrite. Ammonia is one thing, but when the filter is just starting to work, the first stage is conversion to nitrite (not nitrate.. this is different) and nitrites are more toxic to the fish than ammonia. This will be like fish hell for your guys...it's different if you add only a few fish, the spikes are smaller and shorter lived and the fish will cope but this is really throwing them in the deep end. The amount and frequency of water changes you'll need to keep them alive you'll soon go off fishkeeping (water changes twice a day that someone mentioned below was not an exaggeration!) Plus if your fish are exposed to alot of stress it'll make them susceptible to illness so you may finish the cycle and come up on a whole new raft of problems. Even a lightly stocked tank takes a couple weeks to finish cycling I wouldn't dare guess how long it would take in your case. Oh.. and I'm not sure if it's been said yet, but until you sort them out, feed them but only barely! The more they eat the more ammonia they produce. Take up the offer Loopy is one of the best experts here in chch I'm sure! All hail Loopy (and when you're all sorted post some pictures and let the fun begin! I just bought an AR620 myself but haven't set it up yet!!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowfax Posted July 16, 2007 Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 did the fish shop know how long you had had your tank up & running? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zev Posted July 16, 2007 Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 Even a lightly stocked tank takes a couple weeks to finish cycling I wouldn't dare guess how long it would take in your case. More like four weeks if you can't seed the filter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dcase Posted July 27, 2007 Author Report Share Posted July 27, 2007 no issues and fish appear healthy have been doing a water change every 3-4 days - don't mind doing this - biggest issue is planning so I have the heater off for 30 mins beforehand and I have several buckets of water sitting for the 30 mins ready to go in the tank. At the moment I actually enjoy doing the water changes. There was a query as to whether Animates knew I had'nt cycled the tank - yes they knew and provided the Nitra Zorb which I think has been the main factor in the tank staying healthy. I know the shark will grow too big and also the catfish but when they do I have a spare tank I will look to bring online for them. The shark is territorial and nudges other fish from his area. Only real issue seems to be that often there are 3 of the Pearl Danios (which are smaller than him) that like to give him hell - they deliberately invade his territry and gang up on him. Many thanks for the kind offers Loopy but seem to be coping ok for now Anyway will keep you updated as to progress. regards dcase Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jn Posted July 27, 2007 Report Share Posted July 27, 2007 Good job dcase. You've obviously taken to it like a fish to water Do you have to be careful when you take nitrazorb out? (I don't know anything about it) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
herefishiefishie Posted July 27, 2007 Report Share Posted July 27, 2007 If your tank is at the lower end for ph reading it will help. It will mean the nitrogen produced by the fish remains harmless longer in the form of ammonium, dosen't convert as easily to harmful ammonia etc. Test kits can be misleading leading as ammonia tests record both ammonium & ammonia as one. As long as you do small water changes every 3 days, feed only a small amount every 2nd day. Don't bother feeding the bottom feeders, they get what hits the ground. That way you don't have pellets going off in the bottom of the tank. I would be feeding whatever food you have that has the lowest protein value too. Don't go with the she will be right attitude till at least 4 week mark. It will more than likely take that long for the tank to settle. Wood is good for bristlenoses. Plants will be good for the health of the tank, something like val, that grows fast etc. Oh well, shit happens, lets get on with making sure it goes well. 90 litres few small fish, bottom dwellers... should be fine. Just keep on top of it. Oh, I would get rid of the shark too. Here is a good read, http://faq.thekrib.com/begin-cycling.html Frenchy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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