wasp

3 Days? :lol: Dude - The watched pot never boils!

? I'm dissapointed. After the way the picture was presented in the other thread I will confess to feeling misled. Specially after I passed on my congrats and all. Some people photoshop, some present pictures not even their own tank.

Yes it is Laytons tank, or that's how I took it from what was said when he posted that pic in the other thread. Better clear this up for us Layton.

Very nice photo of your tank Layton. Just the same questions I asked in the other thread, I see a little algae etc, I'm assuming it is back in the days when you had a DSB? Lovely big corals, I've not got anything like that myself. Were you able to buy them that big? or did you grow them from small ones? And congrats on owning such a pretty tank.

If no joy, I have some Hamilton 150 watt DE, 14,000k for sale.

"It's just a shame those photos have been altered so much, though" I mean, somebody, somewhere, is an expert on graphics so that proves it. Oh well, "I guess my standards are too high" :lol: :lol: :lol:

Well you may be right Ira. The only problem I had was the inference that the picture had been altered for more devious reasons, when the person making the statement could provide no evidence at all that it was even altered. Just a blank statement. Anyhow, this iron argument is really a blast from the past, an old chestnut, something that has already all been said. I'll just say that I am happy with what I'm doing, and Layton you are happy with what you are doing, everybody is happy , so I'll leave it that way and not sit up all night arguing over it Cheers

Actually, when reading the theory by people who believe that zeovit does not lower nutrients, in fact it adds one, the argument I saw used to support this, was that if it was low nutrients that cause RTN, how come you don't see sps RTN when they are suddenly put into a low nutrient zeovit tank. That's what they said. In fact, speaking as a guy who actually has a zeovit tank, this has been my experience, that the losses have occurred soon after putting the sps in the tank. Exactly what Habib, Bomber and LDuncan have said should NOT happen if low nutrients cause RTN, but rather it is iron. So the very argument used to prove that zeovit does not lower nutrients, but adds one, is proved wrong by your and Habibs and Bombers own argument Layton. You have based it on a wrong premise, just assumed the wrong things about what happens in a Zeovit tank, and ran with it.

Halving nutrients suddenly in an average non zeovit tank is unlikely to have any effect on a healthy acro. Tripling or increasing iron ten fold? No idea, never tried it. You try it.

Not that old chestnut again!!! :lol: :lol: :lol:

No need to be. Despite us all being constantly told that losses are the norm with zeovit, it is not true. I have had acro losses and it is no secret. BUT they have all been corals I just purchased that could not take the sudden drop in nutrients going into a zeovit tank. All my sps losses have occurred within the first few days of putting them in the tank. Once they have survived the first few days, I have not lost one. What I do now, is put new purchases into the frag tank, which is not as low nutrient as the zeovit tank. This gives them a chance to adapt, once they look healthy they go into the zeovit tank, this system has worked well. IMO just reduce nutrients slowly, don't go for the quick result just be happy to see gradual changes, and no losses are nessecary. That losses HAVE to happen with zeovit is an urban myth.

Cheers Dude! You're OK ( Sometimes )

I don't think it is a common practise. To try and get the best by fiddling with lighting etc is what everybody would do, but to photoshop a pic to say you got something you don't, I just can't see somebody doing that, maybe a few but I'm sure it would not be the norm. And anyway, you say there is some way to tell if it's been done? So why do it if people can tell? The other thing is I'm kind of surprised you find the photos so unbelieveable. Colours like that will be pretty much the norm in any well stocked and well run zeovit tank.

Agreed. All Zeovit tank pics have been altered. It's a FACT I mean, those colours could not possibly be real, right?

A DSB has pros and cons. To work as designed, ie nitrate reduction, it needs to be 4 inches plus. What happens is all the waste from the tank lands on it and goes into it, and is broken down by critters and bacteria. The nitrate cycle is completed, and the waste ends up leaving the tank in the form of nitrogen gas. I've had DSB's over the years and they can work well for a time. BUT - there is one big drawback. Not everything can be broken down by the nitrogen cycle, and this can stay and accumulate in the DSB. This includes heavy metals, and phosphate, both of which will slowly accumulate over time, and eventually a point is reached where, phosphate in particular, will reach levels where it starts causing problems in the tank. Even thorough vacuuming of the DSB will not completely solve this, as the phosphate will bond chemically to the substrate. The other extreme is BB, or a very thin layer of sand. BB is ugly, but at least all waste can be removed, LR and BB can be the basis of a high water quality system. Some people go somewhere in the middle, like say, 2 inches of sand. However, to some degree this can give the worst of both worlds, ie, the sand is deep enough to trap undesireable waste and accumulate it, but not deep enough to provide nitrate reduction in a deep low oxygen zone and complete the nitrate cycle. There are some lovely tanks running everything from DSB to BB, and many permutations somewhere between, but my personal choice is BB, or a thin layer of sand just for decoration.

Ha Ha I just thought of a good one! I'll add "It's just a shame those photos have been altered so much" To my Zeovit FACTS list :lol: :lol:

Yes you are right, guess I must have been very defensive. I was kind of wondering why you said "It's just a shame those photos have been altered so much", as if it's a fact. Suppose I'll just have to keep wondering why someone would say stuff like that. I don't believe they are altered at all.

"All kinds of evidence" As in, precisely what, in this case? I cut and pasted this, from the bottom of the article, headed Camera Specifications "All of the pictures on this webpage were taken with the following: 1. Nikon Coolpix 4300 2. Canon 10D with and without a Macro Lens. Preset settings were used. On the Nikon, Night Mode without Flash was the choice for colorful pictures and the full tank shot. Macro Mode on the Nikon was also used for clearer & closer images. No other setting were changed and white balance was not used with the preset settings. For the Canon 10D (Naka's camera), I used his preexisting settings and chose the P mode for all pictures. The Macro lens was used most of the time for clear crisp images you see below under HQ Images. Tripod and other settings were not used for any of these camera's." My guess is that it may have been nessecary to use a picture editor to change the size of the picture, but I'd be very surprised if the actual colors had been tampered with in any way at all. In fact I would consider that misleading and dishonest, and just don't believe he would do it.

Same as all zeovit tanks. Photoshop

Good work Misnoma, great thread. Youch that Waterkeeper guy is scarey :lol:

Have to ask though, in what way are those photos altered? I'm no photography expert but I can't see any sign they have been altered. I'll bet in real life the tank will look just how it looks in the photos.

Oops :oops: Yes sorry about that I was only home for a couple of fairly rushed hours or so that day. You didn't miss much though my tank is pretty budget, especially compared to those other great tanks. I enjoy it, but I know it just doesn't compare against the skill and commitment of many others.

Yes those growth shots are AWESOME!! Just shows it CAN be done, small frags to great corals.

Chimera, just be careful to go slow, that's the main thing I'd say to someone starting zeovit. Especially if you are wanting to get some cool photos, it's tempting to hurry things along, and end up loosing corals. You'll see some changes probably within the first few days, but take the long term view of months to get where you want to go. You should be planning on several months at least to get to phase 3.

Thanks MadCookie, another guy in the same industry told me about them.