Squirt Posted June 7, 2012 Report Share Posted June 7, 2012 LOL 'we' meaning more than just me ;P maybe something like we create an info sheet that can be distributed to petshops, get an article in the FNZAS magazine, get people to spread the word to other forums and gatherings of aquarists... I think it would be good to put an article on the main FNZAS website. A care sheet would be good IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twinkles Posted June 8, 2012 Report Share Posted June 8, 2012 Three other freshwater species are listed in Schedule 4C7 of the Fisheries Act. These are Lamprey Freshwater mussels Koura stocks in the South Island. To fish for non QMS species a fishing permit is required. However no new permits are being issued for species listed in Schedule 4C in recognition that these species are subject to concern about current utilisation/sustainability..... ....Part 5B also makes it is an offence to sell fishing rights to freshwater fish12 or to buy or sell or possess freshwater fish taken in contravention of the Act. That sounds fairly clear... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsveda Posted June 8, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 8, 2012 Can you please link to the full document/site where you're quoting from? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsveda Posted June 8, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 8, 2012 Also it says no new permits are being issued -what if the suppliers have an existing permit? Then they wouldn't be taking the mussels in contravention of the act, so it wouldn't be illegally selling them either. How could we find out who the supplier is, and whether they have the right permit to trade in them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twinkles Posted June 8, 2012 Report Share Posted June 8, 2012 Sorry, should have included the link.. https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=cache:8JyYErN3JOcJ:waimaori.maori.nz/publications/TWMT%2520Environ%2520Scan%2520final.pdf+freshwater+mussels+selling&hl=en&gl=nz&pid=bl&srcid=ADGEESi6aRnofH0oWot6LCp1Jb5yyb2STnXsuatrIbEp_hx4BtQHJG4bW8nXN04EBK3gpXD-jz7N8GHNtt3T0vDuWbl59xtD8U_BLdMzEovEfKu-_rRp9D-p1nbbF1IZM3wPiReWKCdY&sig=AHIEtbRlOGe_nr8ZvojfHloBu9U_OIAF3w And here's the act itself... http://www.legislation.govt.nz/act/public/1996/0088/latest/DLM394192.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twinkles Posted June 8, 2012 Report Share Posted June 8, 2012 Also it says no new permits are being issued -what if the suppliers have an existing permit? Then they wouldn't be taking the mussels in contravention of the act, so it wouldn't be illegally selling them either. http://www.legislation.govt.nz/act/publ ... 96933.html that's the part covering permits already existing. So who wants to contact animates and anywhere else selling them and see where they get them from, to see if they've got a permit? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsveda Posted June 8, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 8, 2012 I've just contacted a guy called Brendon Mikkelsen from the Ministry of Primary Industries (which has absorbed what used to be MAF) and he's going to look into the mussel supplier and find out where the mussels are coming from and who's gathering them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsveda Posted June 8, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 8, 2012 Also contacted Wonderworld Pet Centre in Rotorua ([email protected]) and received a really crappy response from Jo Drummond: Gretchen, I dont have to answer your questions. I have customers to serve. Go save the whales or something. I usually deal with the guys in the fish part of the store, and have never received anything other than excellent service from them (and I've spent a huge amount of money there in the last year or so). In one fell swoop this woman has soured any good feeling I had for them. I won't shop there again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twinkles Posted June 8, 2012 Report Share Posted June 8, 2012 I wont be ordering anything from either :evil: What did your email say to them? Have also just found out that freshwater shrimp don't breed in tanks - have a marine stage - thanks to the person who informed me So the ones on trademe aren't captive bred and probably shouldn't be sold either. Are freshwater shrimp covered by the freshwater fisheries rules? Or general fisheries? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F15hguy Posted June 8, 2012 Report Share Posted June 8, 2012 freshwater fisheries. all regulations regarding Koura apply to shrimp accoding to DOC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsveda Posted June 8, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 8, 2012 This was my email to them: Hi guys I've recently found out that the freshwater mussels on sale in petshops are NZ natives which are under threat and being harvested from wild populations for the aquarium trade. They are not farmed. I've also learned that filtered aquarium water is too clean, and the mussels (some of which are decades old) starve slowly to death and rarely survive a year in captivity. Are you aware of this? Mussels need greenwater and infusoria which they filter for their food, and they need lots of it all the time. Can you please tell me what you feed yours, and what advice do you give to customers who buy them? I'm sorry if I've come off as preachy - I just really like these little guys and I'm dismayed at the thought of how many of them must be dying horrible slow starvation deaths in people's fishtanks around the place. I've decided to contact each of the petshops where I've seen mussels to find out more about the situation. I would like to find out where they're being harvested from and what the suppliers are telling the petshops about their origins and care. Can you please advise? Too much? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ira Posted June 8, 2012 Report Share Posted June 8, 2012 Whenever someone says, "I'm sorry if I've come off as XXXXX" that usually means it's intentional and they're not at all sorry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirt Posted June 8, 2012 Report Share Posted June 8, 2012 Whenever someone says, "I'm sorry if I've come off as XXXXX" that usually means it's intentional and they're not at all sorry. +1 it also makes your argument weaker IMO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsveda Posted June 8, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 8, 2012 It's too late to take it back. However, I did actually mean it. I didn't want to cause offense - I actually like(d) their staff and spend alot of time in their shop. I just wanted to bring something to their attention and find out what their experience of buying and selling freshwater mussels is. But, I don't think her response was called for regardless of how annoyed she was. There are other ways that she could have dealt with the situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twinkles Posted June 8, 2012 Report Share Posted June 8, 2012 Not too much, sounds reasonable and polite to me, not something to stir up a response like that anyway. I put a question on the tm auctions for shrimp to say that they're covered by fisheries legislation and illegal to sell, we'll see what they say if they answer.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F15hguy Posted June 8, 2012 Report Share Posted June 8, 2012 tried that, also made a report, no response and my message got deleted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cricketman Posted June 8, 2012 Report Share Posted June 8, 2012 That is just plain rude, regardless of ANYTHING you may have said, and terrible customer response... :evil: "Wonder World" often frequent these forums in the commercial sector... Anything to say for yourselves WW?? hmmmm??? Losing Customers by the second... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsveda Posted June 8, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 8, 2012 And then she really got up my nose and in the end I called her a name I shouldn't have, so that's definitely the end of my relationship with this particular vendor. Meantime, I've emailed a couple of other petshops and tried to be more diplomatic about how I approach the issue - see, I can learn from my mistakes! I also want to find out if they have any other advice for looking after the mussels than what we've gathered here, or found on forums around the place. Is JBL NovoTom and some home-cultured green water the best we can do? Speaking of, I've been using it for a couple of days now, and the little powder flecks of NovoTom do suspend in the water and not get sucked immediately into the filter. It's hard to tell if the mussels are ok but so far they're not trying to escape (apparently that's a good sign?) apart from one of them rotating itself 180 degrees on the first day, and I'm pretty sure they're the right way up (any advice for how to make sure I haven't got them upside down?) and they close up if I touch them gently so I know they're alive. One of the animates guys suggested sitting them on top of an upturned plate so they'll move down the slope towards the gravel and orient themselves on the way. Would that work or should I just trust that they're the right way up now if they're not struggling? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueether Posted June 8, 2012 Report Share Posted June 8, 2012 If you can see that they are open, then that should bet the right way up. The flesh/lips on the up end is browner and the bottom end is thick and white, you should also beable to see the feeding vents. The up end is alos the long end measured from the hinge of the shell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsveda Posted June 8, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 8, 2012 Thank! In that case I won't mess with them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamC Posted June 8, 2012 Report Share Posted June 8, 2012 Could these mussels have been in the shop for some years? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supasi Posted June 9, 2012 Report Share Posted June 9, 2012 Could these mussels have been in the shop for some years? Highly unlikely. What would they be feeding them? What difference would that make either way? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamC Posted June 9, 2012 Report Share Posted June 9, 2012 If so, then they would have some way of feeding them successfully. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsveda Posted June 9, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 9, 2012 If so, then they would have some way of feeding them successfully. They didn't research it until I asked them about it from the sounds of it - they're feeding them that NovoTom stuff now though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ira Posted June 9, 2012 Report Share Posted June 9, 2012 Could these mussels have been in the shop for some years? Seriously doubt it, they'd be long dead. If so, then they would have some way of feeding them successfully. Except they don't because they're pretty clueless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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