anal fin Posted December 13, 2004 Report Share Posted December 13, 2004 Before I start off on my rant and rave I would like to tell you why I decided to get into reef keeping. Firstly - I love a challenge and so keeping a slice of the ocean confined into 5 pieces of glass in my lounge has to be a challenge (yes five pieces of glass a front, back, two sides and a bottom) or maybe I am just completely mad you decide. Secondly – My partner fell in love with Finding Nemo (the movie and the fish). We both found a common interest in wanting to keep a reef tank we spend a lot of time working out what we wanted in our tanks and what the end result should be. In a strange way our slice of ocean has brought us closer together in a way I never thought possible that been said I didn’t invite her to the reef meeting last Sunday in Christchurch and she was a tad annoyed (sorry Rebecca love you lots, P.S hope you read this part). Last but not least – My 3 year old daughter who also fell in love with Finding Nemo (yes the movie and the fish also). The look on her face when she sees something new in the tank or our travels to the local fish shops is more then enough for me to send a few extra dollars on a fish or a coral (the little picture you see below my user name that’s my daughter Sam). So as you can see for me at least it’s not about the money it’s about quality time with the two people I love most in this world. I am sick and tired of the senseless, mindless dribble that some users of this forum have to say. To me this forum was meant to be a tool to which I could find out information and discuses the processes of reef keeping, a place where everyone was welcome to share advice and their experiences, weather they are wanting to start out, beginner, novice, intermediate, expert or god. I am sure the creators of this forum had a similar idea when they got together and spent countless hours designing a place where we could talk and share ideas about keeping fish and other aquatic life, not to mention that this is a free source of information for all of us to use. You might still be wondering about my use of the word “Godâ€, well it came to me that we have several users of this forum that consider themselves God when it comes to reef keeping I myself fall into the category of novice and have no problems admitting this that was the whole purpose for me logging onto this forum was to advance my knowledge in this field. Simple Explanations: Wanting to start out – Someone that knows you can keep fish alive in a tank but has little or no idea what is evolved in keeping aquatic life alive. Beginner – Someone who has read little information but grasps the idea of keeping aquatic life alive (may or may not have got hands wet yet) Novice – (Me) someone who understands the principles of keeping aquatic life alive with some hands on experience but when faced with a problem requires advice to correct this or requires information to best keep a system up and running. Intermediate – Has a good knowledge on the subject and can offer the above people advice via there experiences but still requires help from time to time. Expert – Has a good solid knowledge on the subject and can offer solid advice to others who require it God – They just know it all no matter what, if they are found to be wrong will argue to the bitter end, someone who just wont keep there mouth shut even if no one wants to know. You know what I mean its hard to describe but it leaves a bitter taste in your mouth the hairs on the back of you neck stand on end you just want to bash your head on your keyboard and yell F**K off W**KER you full of S**T. So that’s about it for me hope you all enjoyed the show and got at least something out of my dribble and will remember to use this forum to help us lesser reef keepers out with solid advice and not about who has the best prices and who can under cut someone else or who has the biggest skimmer cause it really helps know one it just starts fights between little men with little dicks who couldn’t fight there way out of a paper bag. P.S Sorry for the use of the bad words but someone had to say it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ira Posted December 13, 2004 Report Share Posted December 13, 2004 That's the best post I've seen in this forum in ages. Thanks, AF. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted December 13, 2004 Report Share Posted December 13, 2004 For me, I was embarrassed a few weeks back when I encouraged some people to come to this site. So now, the situation continues, with abuse, sexual inuendo and insults to other people, and comments like "why don't you get a big black dog up ya?" To some people I suppose this is witty. Fair discussion, banter and dissagreement is acceptable, but I don't think the purpetrators of this gutter level drivel realise how disgusted some people are. It's also become obvious that every time one particular person posts, another particular person just cannot contain themself from making some mindless attack. And I mean EVERY time. Anyhow I am afraid I have now given up recommending this site to anyone. One day if people can sort out their personal problems and fixations I hope to be able to recommend the site again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ira Posted December 13, 2004 Report Share Posted December 13, 2004 The moderators are discussing some pretty heavy bans and/or completely shutting down the forum at the moment since some people obviously haven't learned to behave. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Posted December 13, 2004 Report Share Posted December 13, 2004 As one of the mods, I can't say how well the opening post to this thread is showing up the salties. Congratulations. To those of you to whom this post has been addressed. Beware of what Ira has just said. You may be really, as the saying goes, Pooping in your own fishtank. Lets try and ALL be sensible about this. Cause you don't appreciate what you have, till it is gone. Alan 104 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fay Posted December 13, 2004 Report Share Posted December 13, 2004 Ira <> Please don't shut the forum<> I have viewed my disappointment in the past also. Once about rude comments on my pics don't forget you were the one to start the rude comments which I still have not had an apology for by you, you should be setting an example. My other disappointment was posted about the fighting mainly caused by people that are in the trade, but these people are the ones with the knowledge, I think they forget they are not the only ones that use this forum and don't see that they are an embarrassment to themselves and the hobby. I have learn't such a lot from the forum, and think some should not ruin it for all . Use the ban just don't keep threatning even if it's just for a month, untill they can behave, they might think twice if they keep getting banded.How about three strikes and your out for good P.S. You might all be wondering why I got so upset about those comments of my photos<> Well that week I had to have a man arrested in the shop, he is still in jail a the moment. I will have to go to court over this<> So as you can see I had a very bad week and to get on site to find my friends being horrid was just to much, MY POINT being you never Know what is happening in other peoples lives at the time they sit down at the key board. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phillz Posted December 13, 2004 Report Share Posted December 13, 2004 Well said everyone, I love reading this forum, and hope one day to be able to have a marine set-up (when lotto desides to pop out my numbers LOL) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted December 13, 2004 Report Share Posted December 13, 2004 Shut the forum? Totally unnecessary! A permanent ban on some people is also overkill. What is needed is some effective moderation. Just deletion of offensive posts, and if someone does not then get the hint, they get banned for a month. Then if someone STILL does not get the hint, perhaps they should be regarded as an inveterate offender and a permanent ban considered. But most people are capable of positive contributions in a well run environment, and a permanent ban should only be extreme last resort. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pegasus Posted December 14, 2004 Report Share Posted December 14, 2004 Wasp said: What is needed is some effective moderation. Just deletion of offensive posts, and if someone does not then get the hint, they get banned for a month. You ARE joking of course..? EFFECTIVE MODERATION This forum is monitored constantly by half the moderating team, and as soon as one issue is edited... removed.. or modified.. another issue starts up.. often within hours. What happens then...? The moderators are slagged... verbally abused.. among other things, and despite both private warnings and ones posted publicly at the head of the section by the Admins, it STILL continues. There has been more causes for moderator intervention in the Saltwater Section this year alone, than there has been for all the other forums combined since the site was started. The actions of a handful of "know it all" marine keepers have broght this section to its knees, and now from the hundred or so members that USED to frequent this area, there are now just this handful left, who's aim it seems is to continue to demolish the few remaining strands of this forum that the decent members are trying hard to maintain. This virus created by these inconsiderate members is not only putting the image of the forum in jepardy, but the image of the FNZAS Fishroom also. My vote is put a stop to it NOW before it is too late. Bill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brianemone Posted December 14, 2004 Report Share Posted December 14, 2004 vote pegasus i agree, it should be a happy place Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted December 14, 2004 Report Share Posted December 14, 2004 Hmmm... Well I didn't say it as a joke. What I see happening is what you said Pegasus. Every time a moderator moderates, there are complaints. However I have been wondering if this has led to the moderators feeling intimidated, because I'm pretty surprised to see what's been let slide of recent times. And what makes me cringe is us being referred to as "you salties" as if we are all to be judged by the very worst posts a few can come up with. Most of us love our hobby and would like a cordial relationship with other like minded people. You moderators own the board. You do not have to take crap. If you see a post that is abusive, delete it. If someone gives you crap, ban them (temporarily). No need to enter into arguments with people, if they don't like it there are other forums. That is what most of us want. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chimera Posted December 14, 2004 Report Share Posted December 14, 2004 well said wasp. i agree, there needs to be a consistent form of moderation on this forum. i agree there are arguments about the most pathetic things, blatantly rude comments between members, postings that people should think twice about etc. however what i am highly opposed to is posts being removed due to the PERSONAL view of the moderator in question (still not taking away the fact that there are some crap and highly pathetic/argumentive posts). i personally have been flamed by a particular moderator (they dont need to be named) on a post that i disagreed on and replied too. i was told to immediately drop the topic when i replied indicating the sarcasm of the previous poster was uncalled for and I simply asked that I hoped the other poster received a similar warning. once a moderator adopts a disliking to a member, it is extremely hard to voice any opinion without getting issued warnings. in regards to fay's post regarding your anemone, i dont find any problem with a small bit of humour in this forum. there was nothing distasteful about the replies and they most certainly were not personal attacks. i do not apologise for my post in this case as I do not feel I was in the wrong, regardless of what else you were going through at the time (you're not the only one here). on the same hand, i have been put down by the "gods" of this forum myself for posting various questions. some i took offence too and replied, some i simply ignored and laughed them off. Anyway, I think the concerns expressed are namely the debate about importations and costs more than anything else. all in all, "anal fin" - your post has made me laugh (because it is SOOO true) i simply could not agree more and have to thank you for someone finally bringing this up. now lets see whether the moderators are going to send me a nice little warning-PM for expressing my opinion above. ch-intermediate-mera Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pegasus Posted December 14, 2004 Report Share Posted December 14, 2004 Fortunately I am not the moderator in question above, but when you make a statement like this.. i agree there are arguments about the most pathetic things, blatantly rude comments between members, postingsI think that you should look at some of the posts you have made that have PURPOSELY been made to create conflicts... not only for the two Admins that moderate this area, but for the rest of the members. Posts like... (both yours) taken from "Posts by Chimera" in your profile. fat chance of getting an apology from moderators. im not after an apology anyways, nothing to apologise for. keeps pushing my listing to the top everytime they ramble on ...and... dont be such an arrogant @#%@#$%. there are so many nana's on this forum, obviously you are one of them. if you are really intrigued by what it is, SEARCH FOR THE @$#%@#$ thing on google. you have the ..... have no place on this or any forum. And you say... however what i am highly opposed to is posts being removed due to the PERSONAL view of the moderator in question (still not taking away the fact that there are some crap and highly pathetic/argumentive posts). i personally have been flamed by a particular moderator Should the moderators you feel the need to mention just ignore these remarks, plus countless others by yourself and the other handful of trouble causers...? PERSONAL feeling do not come into the equation. You guys have.. (had).. the means to build the best source of marine info in this part of the world by sharing your knowledge with others, but instead you bite the hand that has given you an area in which to do this. Look at the above... This SW forum "could" have been bursting with posts from new members and old alike, but most it seems are so ashamed of the situation here that they choose not to visit. You want my opinion Chim...? Be grateful I don't have the means to put an end to this, or you would have been taking a nice long rest from the NZ Fishroom a long time ago, along with all the other members that see fit to ruin what is otherwise a great forum. Nothing personal here Chim.. but the end result seems obvious if the SW section is to continue. Bill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chimera Posted December 14, 2004 Report Share Posted December 14, 2004 Bill, thank you SO much. You have just proven my point EXACTLY regarding my opinion on Moderators. Take your post above, you are picking out posts of mine that DO NOT SHOW THE FULL STORY. do I have justification for posting what i did? In most cases yes, perhaps some no. How would anyone know otherwise? Highly unlikely, as you have removed the posts leading up to my comments. Try showing the FULL story next time. Be grateful I don't have the means to put an end to this, or you would have been taking a nice long rest from the NZ Fishroom a long time ago Now if thats not a comment to spark off some debate and rebuttal, I dont know what is. I could take that as a personally offensive comment, but hey, Im one to laugh off others comments and not let it get to me... I think you are missing my point. I am not disagreeing AT ALL with anal fin's comments. In fact, I completely and utterly agree. I am simply expressing my opinion that SOME posts CAN be removed based on a particular moderators feeling towards the member or the context in which the post was made. Simply say the word Bill and I will delete my account on this forum and never return. Thats how strongly I believe in what I have stated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Posted December 14, 2004 Report Share Posted December 14, 2004 Wasp, I hope it wasn't the term that I make, and made about marine aquarist as "saltie" has you offended. It really is only a differentation of freshies to salties. If so, duh! :roll: It is not used in a derogative way at all, and I find it a lot easier to write than marine aquarist. I'm sure Ira could come up with a much longer name. Alan 104 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted December 14, 2004 Report Share Posted December 14, 2004 This is turning into a "moderators against the rest" thing. No need for any arguing at all, we're all on the same side, or I hope we are. The stuff quoted above is hardly serious enough to get in a flap over. I'm just supporting lifting this forum out of the gutter, and the moderators are the ones with that job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chimera Posted December 14, 2004 Report Share Posted December 14, 2004 and I am not trying to differentiate between moderator's and "others". in most cases, mod's do a bloody good job. all i am stating is: 1. i agree, bring this forum out of the gutter. most importantly, that ALSO includes no sarcastic remarks that provoke attacks otherwise it turns into a viscious circle. 2. some criticism is good (so LONG as it is constructive criticism) 3. moderators should have a slightly more open view on the posts, make sure they see BOTH sides of the story. 4. a little humour (in the right context) doesnt hurt anyone. try taking some jokes a little more lightheartedly Cheers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fay Posted December 14, 2004 Report Share Posted December 14, 2004 in regards to fay's post regarding your anemone, i dont find any problem with a small bit of humour in this forum This is my whole point Chimera you make comments which you think are funny, not caring about the feelings of others or what they might have going on in their lives at the time, this is a very selfish way of looking at life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chimera Posted December 14, 2004 Report Share Posted December 14, 2004 just edited my post above Fay to include point #4. im not going to carry on this debate furthur. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cees Posted December 14, 2004 Report Share Posted December 14, 2004 now lets see whether the moderators are going to send me a nice little warning-PM for expressing my opinion above. What do you want me to do now? You confuse me. One moment you make valuable contributions to this site, the next moment there is a lot of sarcasm in what you write. Why? What is the problem? fwiw, and apologies to posters in this topic in advance. When I find a moment this topic will be moderated and most if not all if it removed. Same will be true for other topics in this forum and the rest of the fishroom. http://www.fnzas.org.nz/fishroom/viewtopic.php?p=39677 Cees Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted December 14, 2004 Report Share Posted December 14, 2004 Ok well you will get some stick, but I support it. It will be best in the long run. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chimera Posted December 14, 2004 Report Share Posted December 14, 2004 ok, i apologise for that remark. it was uncalled for. i stand by the rest of what i wrote though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted December 14, 2004 Report Share Posted December 14, 2004 Well done Chim, even though what you apologised for was hardly the same league as some of the other stuff people have said. If others were man enough to front up and apologise this whole thing would be unnessecary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anal fin Posted December 14, 2004 Author Report Share Posted December 14, 2004 I don’t think some people grasp the concept of what I was trying to show... As for moderation we should not require this for the most part we are all grown adults and should know by now what is and what is not considered acceptable behavior don’t you think. When I take my daughter to pre-school I find myself looking around the room at a bunch of 3 year old kids with more manners and a sense of right and wrong then some users of this forum I am appalled by the lack or respect some user show to others. So how does one become a moderator ?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chimera Posted December 14, 2004 Report Share Posted December 14, 2004 fair call Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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