firenzenz Posted May 12, 2008 Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 Here are my guys Female is holding so I'll be stripping her Thursday. This pair is now around three yrs- I got them at Jansens Botany back when they seemed to know what they had, you may remember the big display tank was a malawi tank. Also got the maisoni at a similar time Even at 3 years they are both only 10cm which tends me to think they are correct as they are one of the smallest Aulononcara species. They are also timid, my guy has spent most his time in growout tanks as he can't foot it with the bigger peacocks I saw recently the parents of the Chilumbas that caused a raucous a little while ago. ApparentlyThey were obtained from pupuke aquarium as a trio( 2M,1F), this would have been around the time frame I got mine. One male was discarded as turned out as red shoulder. The other two were bred as chilumbas. The male is now 15cm and a definite Royalblue/Hansbaenschi variant- his size for a start should have given clues, if not his body shape The female I believe to be chilumba, and I have taken her home. She is a dead ringer for mine although slightly bigger than my girl by 1cm .she was living in much larger tanks. Her introduction already has paid dividends as my Chilumbas never spawned but the new girl appearance has finally got my two going. The male is dominant over this new female- something he's only managed with my existing female- normally he's bullied by anything. I plan to breed both females and keep fry seperate and see how the growout. Would really like to get this peacock up and going as a pure strain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livingart Posted May 12, 2008 Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 look identical to ours from 8 year old stock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryanjury Posted May 12, 2008 Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 Awesome it sounds good Would love to get see a pure chilumba around not either of the 2 dodgy lots that have been passed around recently I am sure that Ken originally had a female and male chilumba (but as you've said it got too large to be one) but belive the problem occured when he wanted to get more females and got some random shaped ones and bred from them, although he assured people he hadn't been the babies came out random shapes and sizes. I ended up with the male red shoulder that he had (he thought it was a female...) and he had brought that later apparently as a chilumba female so it was all a mess. I hope that you have more luck seeing the babies grow out would be a dead giveaway especially if they start doing random things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryanjury Posted May 12, 2008 Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 I have also seen fish being sold as "royal blues" that are the same blue all over but alot higher in the body (as stated some sort Hansbaenschi variant) these could easily be confused with chlilumba's guess only time will tell as we all know peacock id's are hard at the best of times.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firenzenz Posted May 12, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 Ryan I bought a royal blue to have a closer look and you're spot on. They are far higher and squat in the body, while the chilumba finer right through from head to Caudal Fin which is far taller in relation to body size. The flush shouldn't go anywhere near the shoulder either as alot of Kens do. It's the size thing that got me- 2mins research would have sorted all that mess out. Think maybe he thought red 'shoulder' was close enough to red 'flush' eh! Looking for Rubenscen females. One of my two died the other turned out to be very nice clean male peacock(not Rubens, and I have no idea)Anyone know the history of the rubens at HFF? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livingart Posted May 12, 2008 Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 variation in a single batch of fry for size shape etc is probably the best indicator of being pure or not Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryanjury Posted May 12, 2008 Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 Yep thats what he's going to try But even then there is the risk that it is an established hybrid line that throws babys of the same shape etc? Who knows what the importers have been throwing at us? I believe that the people that have had "chilumba's" for years may have had the royal blues because people have only started calling them chilumba's since the chilumba's appeared on the list its very easy to say hey that blue peacocks alot like mine mine must be a chilumba too.. One member on here did that and sold a whole heap of babies I know some people are still waiting to hear from her about sorting that out.. Who knows what Ken was thinking? From the results of this and other dealings ive had with him its evident how he deals with things and thats to take the money and run. My main concern was because of all the dodgy dealings going on we might have lost a species of peacock we may never see in NZ again.. Gutted about your rubins whats the male look like? There are a few people with them and they have started to breed so hopefully there is no risk of them dying out im sure you will find at the very least some babies in the future im unsure if anyone will have a spare female you know what they're like in a breeding programme you can never have enough! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firenzenz Posted May 12, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 I don't neccessarily go by size, as, there are in all batches-' the leaders'-'their followers', and the runts. Shape and paterning for sure. It'd be nice too say -"yep, all good" and sell them off as pure bred chilumbas. Probably get some quick coin. But... The royal Blue or regal blue was also coming in at same time,( A.species Koningsi, or Mbjeni), a variant I think is now so mixed with Hansbaenschi it is a mess. So there is always a chance of a mix up. P.S This is what can happen 3-4yrs down the track when time blurs the facts. Just a point for all that have run up the road of giving their peacocks a locality definition such as 'lemon Jake' with nothing more than hope to support it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryanjury Posted May 12, 2008 Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 Yeah for sure there are always bigger and more dominant ones.. And ones that just don't seem to colour up as well or the same.. I'm glad that your doing the right thing if things work out ill buy some chilumba's off you But ill probably be joining the end of a long line lol I forget that the royals were coming in at the same time, royals have been around for a while now.. I just had a thought what if the wholesalers/importers mixed a whole heap of peacocks? What do you think they would do? I think they would keep selling them as whatever they wanted... After all even though its wrong the boss would never authorise them to do whats right.. It is hard without varients listed.. But I have 2 different "strains" of jacob's both are jacob's dead ringers of pictures on the net and different varients both are also off the wholesale list but at different times and all of them are descended from imported parents and are identical to them? Both are bred here by descent breeders who only have one species in the tank and get them bagged from the shop. lol Now how do I differentiate between the 2 in naming them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Afrikan Posted May 12, 2008 Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 Very nice fish firenzenz.. 8) Ryan - In regards to both the Jacob variants you have... simple. variant 1 and variant 2 a good label for each :lol: :lol: What I can't understand is people naming their species of peacock a certain variant when they never arrived as the named variant to start with. Peacocks would be one of the hardest african to identify via photo and what it can look like in the flesh can make it look so different in a picture huh. I know you yourself don't agree with people naming their peacocks certain variants if they haven't come in as exactly that.. me just being cheeky with the suggestion of V1 and V2.. hehehe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livingart Posted May 12, 2008 Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 i have read a few studies done by scientists on lake malaw and most arrive at the same conclusion that there are naturally occuring variants of species within the lake rocky outcroppings less than 100 metres apart have the same species on them but each outcropping has a different variant as these outcroppings are isolated by the bigger predatory fish patrolling the no mans land between them i agree on your thoughts on the importers ryan as they have to rely on what they are told by the suppliers or there can be mixups at both ends of the supply line Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firenzenz Posted May 12, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 i have read a few studies done by scientists on lake malaw and most arrive at the same conclusion that there are naturally occuring variants of species within the lake rocky outcroppings less than 100 metres apart have the same species on them but each outcropping has a different variant as these outcroppings are isolated by the bigger predatory fish patrolling the no mans land between them i agree on your thoughts on the importers ryan as they have to rely on what they are told by the suppliers or there can be mixups at both ends of the supply line I read an article where they were discussing variances of a vertical nature, ie: size and subtle differences in a species which inhabits several depths of a relatively small location. The differences were put down to more than just age. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
my4age Posted May 12, 2008 Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 In regards to both the Jacob variants you have... simple. variant 1 and variant 2 a good label for each anyone knows what variants are they? i THINK there's lemon jake and one dat looks like Aulonocara jacobfreibergi (Otter Pt.). any suggestion on this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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