supasi Posted October 10, 2006 Report Share Posted October 10, 2006 this may be old news but have been surfing the net and came across these, mutated forms of discus http://www.angelfire.com/id/ttdiscuscenter/index.html through further reading of countless articles, it turns out that to form tis deformed , so called beautiful form(not in my opinion) of fdiscus the tails were contiually cut unti the fish nolonger grew a tail. yuk yuk yuk, well thats my opinion, what is evryone elses thoughts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke* Posted October 10, 2006 Report Share Posted October 10, 2006 get that outta my sight! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryanjury Posted October 10, 2006 Report Share Posted October 10, 2006 Yeah its not right! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimTam22 Posted October 10, 2006 Report Share Posted October 10, 2006 poor things Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supasi Posted October 10, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 10, 2006 i agree. its cruel. some people just have no idea of beautiful fish apparantly they are quite popular in asia(although i dont know how accurate that is) has anyone come across pics of these before? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ljtan55 Posted October 10, 2006 Report Share Posted October 10, 2006 Thats terrible.... developing strains is one thing, but anything that deforms the fish is disturbing. I was trying to find out more about the butterfly to figure out if its for real, (like the kitten in the bottle - turned out to be fake), and I chanced upon this. Really really disturbing. Warning not for the faint of heart... http://www.arofanatics.com/members/shawnchen89/crueltytoemax/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supasi Posted October 10, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 10, 2006 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharn Posted October 10, 2006 Report Share Posted October 10, 2006 docking is extremely common and for those who frequent quite alot of overseas sites dyed and docked fish come up a fair amount. parrot fish are often the ones subject to dying/docking, when docked they are called 'heart parrots' because of their shape and can be all colours of the rainbow. i can not express in words how sick this makes me feel and those who know me well can imagine what i would do to those people if ever i came across them :lol: it is one thing to create different colour strains and mutations like blackmoor etc but to cut pieces off a fish in order to pass it off as a new strain can only be described as *edits foul language out* rediculous. there are a few types of dying used these days with people coming up with more nobrainers every year. Injection: This involves removing the fish from water and injecting dye directly into the fish through a hypodermic needle. This needle is large in size (when in scale to you or a general household pet) and can often be completely un-sterilized leaving the fish highly susceptible to infection. This form of dying is probably the most common and has an especially high fatality rate. Tattooing: This involves removing the fish from the water and drying it to a point where a mild abrasive can be used. This abrasive makes the dye more easily absorbed to the fish in specific locations. This procedure affects the fish very directly and is among one of the cruelest things you could do to a fish without killing it. Dipping: This involves striping the fish of its slimecoat then dipping the fish in a coloured dye solution. This may take several "bathings" to reach an opaque colour and is highly stressful to the fish. Fish dyed this way have a slightly larger chance of reaching sale however due to the procedure (particularly the stripping of slimecoat) they're immune system is weakened and they often die within 2-4 months following the procedure. Laser Painting: This is a relatively new way of dying and involves the use of a laser to create intricate designs on the fish. In order for this procedure to be done the fish must be removed from water and remain moist for an extended period of time. This procedure works in a very similar fashion to "tattooed" fish and although a lot more sophisticated is just as harsh on the fish. taken from http://z14.invisionfree.com/RECICHLIDUS ... wtopic=892 this is one of those things that really gets me angry, its totally unnecessary (how bout we go cut some of their arms off?) and just goes to show how stupid the human race can really be Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim r Posted October 10, 2006 Report Share Posted October 10, 2006 i can think of better things to cut off and totally agree it is sick. It is sad what lengths people will go to for a dollar i'm with you guys. jim. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sirkus Posted October 10, 2006 Report Share Posted October 10, 2006 we got a tail-less fish in at work a while back but it was in with a load of seemingly normal fish which made me come to the conclusion that it was just deformed and so i made sure it went to a good home upstairs in my sis' tank with other so called 'less normal' fish, shes gives them a good home and they get fed very well. hes been tagged with the name 'stumpy' and can swim faster than the other fish now, much to my amazement. i had no idea that people were doing this sort of thing. there has been a 'pact' made in england where shops sign up to a list stating that they will not sell dyed fish, i think its on the pfk website somewhere??? anything like that in nz? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpidersWeb Posted October 10, 2006 Report Share Posted October 10, 2006 This is worth a read, regarding the 'Notched' deformity in angel cichlids: http://theangelfishsociety.org/articles/norton/dr_norton%2818%29.htm I've seen a young angel with this deformaty before. I thought thats what these Discus were :-? Given that its genetically passed on, I doubt the tails are cut??!!?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Discusguru Posted October 10, 2006 Report Share Posted October 10, 2006 I don't think the heart shape discus is popular at all nor is any manually modified fish. Az far as i know nobody is interested in them at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishy_t Posted October 10, 2006 Report Share Posted October 10, 2006 If you ask me anyone who buys a Parrot Cichlid is supporting the kinds of people who do this to fish. ‘Parrots’ are just one step in breeding a fish which is mutilated just to give humans something new and 'interesting' to look at (as well as a profit for the developers). Doing that is bad enough let alone cutting of their tails and dieing them which just makes me totally sick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkLB Posted October 10, 2006 Report Share Posted October 10, 2006 I've only been fish keeping for 10 months and this is the first time I've heard of fish being mutilated in this way. I am sickened. IMO the whole point of keeping fish is to have a little Nature in your home and trying to artificially alter an animal in any way is nothing less than cruelty to the max. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MRSkz Posted October 11, 2006 Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 This is utterly discusting. How is this not considerd crulty to animals? How have the spca in whatever contry this is happening (hoping it's not in NZ) not been invovled? SpidersWeb I don't think words can express the discust we probably all feel at the thought of people actualy breeding theise muntants. To me they look as if they should all be culled as they are not whole fish!! The human race continues to discust and disapoint me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
me love fishy Posted October 11, 2006 Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 That is so fowl. People who take any part in this are cruel, heartless and pathetic and deserve to have the same thing done to them, IMHO. the poor fish, its disgusting and makes me really angry, why people can not see that doing that would cause pain and make a fish suffer is beyond me. :evil: Anyway I won't go on, everyone here probably feels the same anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
becc4 Posted October 11, 2006 Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 THere is also the process for making a desirable Wakin goldfish. I don't think that I would buy any fish that has been modified through cruel means Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharn Posted October 11, 2006 Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 fishy-t, i 100% agree, colour strains is one thing but hybridism is not right IMO. yeah they might look neat (flowerhorn, parrots etc) but when you consider their effects they have on the hobby its not something i want to help, or buy into. dont get me wrong, hybrids can have great personalities, but in no way are they better than any other true species. flowerhorn are my main moan when it comes to this, they are a mix of many things and have nearly wiped out pure Trimac in the hobby altogether due to unedcuated cross breeding and the general lack of demand cause FH are 'more colour and lucky', lucky my $%^! FH have been bred to be able to withstand many conditions and have infested and ruined water ways all over the world. alot of people think theyre more colourful and more personable but they dont really stand a chance against some of the pure species of fish. i can show you some pictures of pure Trimac and when compared to some of those FH you can hardly tell them apart, they look so similar now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sirkus Posted October 11, 2006 Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 as regards to the flowerhorn, parrot and other man made hybrids (this is not an opinion i support but merely an observation from a scientific point of view) the organism has found a niche for which it fits better than other (the interest from an owner) organisms and so survives so infact its better suited to its environment and thus relates to evolution; survival of the fittest. anyone have any views on that? of course part of the concept is that the genes of the parents for a particular trait are passed on to offspring and this doesnt apply to the heart shaped fish but to hybrids. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanmin4304 Posted October 11, 2006 Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 It would have to be a genetic thing that has been inbred to maintain the gene. You can't breed a fish without a tail just by cutting the tails off. They are a diformity and should be treated as such. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishy_t Posted October 11, 2006 Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 Sharn - 100% with you too - it's one thing to 'create' these hybrid fish for our entertainment, but when it is detrimental to the natural parent species it is even sadder. Sirkus - I agree that some of these fish seem to have found a niche to live in within the trade, but I still don't think that you could class this 'progression of evolution' as being natural as it is entirely manipulate by man and as in Parrot's the offspring are often not even fertile! Even so going back to my point is that supporting the sale of these hybrid fish is supporting and I think even encouraging the same people in the industry who are mutilating fish with knives and injections of dye. Either way this sort of issue is bad for the industry who many people already think is cruel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sirkus Posted October 11, 2006 Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 yup, you summed up exactly how i feel bout the topic as a whole. however i have heard reports of breeding parrots and thus does lead to the suggestion that this is the succession of a new species from this hybrid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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