Aquatopia

Anthony - I think what Kermit meant (if you dont mind me saying Kermit), is that you might feed the return up through the bottom of the tank and continue it up higher with pipework to a location near the top of the tank. (and that way if there was any syphoning then it would just be the volume of water at the top of the tank till it got below the level of the return).

Pies - why is that? Always keen to learn the "techie" side of things.

Sounds great angelfish - wouldnt mind a trip to nelson sometime to see it when its done. will you be able to make it down for any of the chch reefers meetings?

cookie... Clown triggers. Lovely fish. Im amazed he doesnt cause more mayhem in a reef though. Never kept one myself though.

Id be up for say half of the rock there. He's got 120kgs in total. That leaves another 60kg for anyone else.

Thats very true Aaron. I do want to support the LFS's but there are just some things they need to wake up to. Other things, they do well at. But the hobby is moving on and people are becoming more and more aware of whats available to them. If they let the internet take over then they will lose out ultimately. I have an example of one shop here in chch (no names) selling a product for $1500. Another shop in Auck is selling the EXACT SAME thing at $900. Now i dont care what you say about shipping costs - it doesnt cost $600 more to ship that item down here. Thats just being bloody greedy at the end of the day. And if i hear the argument that perhaps the Auckland store got a better deal through the wholesaler - as a consumer Im not interested. Thats something the retailer and wholesaler must sort out between themselves instead of being complacent about the issue. Anyway, the points been made. I'll say no more. Don't want this thread to lose track too much.

Fair enough

Well sorry for being new and raising an issue that has already cropped up. :oops: The fact that is has cropped up before makes my mention of it all the more valid i would have thought. Lol. And what i am saying is that people are going to online stores because certain items are not available unless they are exorbitant prices. Its THOSE items that retailers should be trying to get at decent prices in order to re-gain that custom which is being lost to online stores. Why would they do this you say? Simple - because its better to make SOME profit on an item and retain the custom of a hobbyist, than not to make ANY profit at all. :lol:

Its OK - but why not have the outlet from the pump running straight out to the left as far as it needs to, to go up towards the tank - that way you dont have a 90 degree immediately the water leaves the pump - and you end up with ONE not TWO 90 degrees under the tank. Also - is there any reason why the width of the sump is so significantly less than the width of the tank? Why not make the sump a bit larger?

anthony - you may have misunderstood - the SCWD is still powered by a pump, but its not an integral part of the product, thats all. Ultimately with a power outage or if you turn it off, you will have no flow anyway - unless you install a UPS (uninterupted power supply), so thats not a consideration. The more important thing is what Brianemone just said and that is $ for $ the swirl is better cos it doesnt restrict flow - and thats something i was not aware of till he just said it. Dont get too bogged down with the 90 degree angles. Yes they restrict flow but in your setup its only small so the effect would be far less than say in Pies or Chimeras setup if they had tonnes of 90 degree bends - (althought they have the most amazing F*%£*$* pumps which would probably counter and problems raised by a plumbing elbow. Your second diagram is technically better by the use of 45 degree elbows but you would be better off using a larger sump and having to put up with 90 degree elbows as the greater water capacity would outweigh the effect of the plumbing. I hope thats clearer than mud.

Sea swirls are from US$127 on the Marinedepot website - probably work out at NZ$200 all up ? Or thereabouts. Chim - can you jump in here? Would eductors do for now for Anthony here? Also as its a simple setup he's planning - what about SCWDs (Anthony these are simple mechanical non electrical units that alternate the outflow between two outlets thus creating a wave effect) They are cheaper than swirls.

Layton - looks like you are gonna have brain ache by the time ive finished chatting to you then ! I love my MAC but its been a hard transition. I spent years on PC's and everything was second nature then.

Anthony - where you have put the sea swirl, you need to raise the box part so it shows that it is above the top of the tank. Effectively the plumbing to it will go into it horizontally, not from above - what package are you doing your drawings with? I am so lazy i have not looked into mine yet (although Im using Apple Mac)

Yep - you are right Reef - i was thinking ahead of myself. Would there be any mileage in wholesalers bringing in Iwaki pumps so that our LFS can offer them at a reasonable price to try and out-compete say, Marine-depot? or is this just not feasible? Rather than saying retail is retail is retail - I should have said the only comparible price is the one you can get the product for (in terms of the consumer). I realise this is not the case for the retailer or wholesaler, but at the end of the day - folk are gonna try and find the best price, and the purpose of this thread is to advise FNZAS members of the best way to set up their aquarium. If that means that some items will be sourced at places other than the LFS then so be it. Thats the way it works now. What we should do is give them ALL the options, along with the pros and cons of buying from your LFS or the INTERNET. My only concern with internet buying is that there isnt anyone to scream and shout at if things go wrong. I will try to support my LFS and the local economy as much as possible, but where there are huge margins, i have to support my own wallet to maximise what i can achieve.

I see what you mean about comparing apples with apples Warren - but retail is retail is retail - whether it be from a retailer in New Zealand or a retailer in America, surely ?

the pic is SORT of right - but the sea swirl control box sits on top of the tank and has bracket screws to hold it in place. It is not submersible - its only the outflow part that is underwater - thats right i thinkl (from their website).

Not really - we are addressing this from the viewpoint of putting information for newbies on HERE. So the ones who dont know about this site dont come into the equation. However, if they do know about this site and see the information we post - it should be info in their best financial and operative interests. Its fair to assume that if they have the knowhow to find a www forum on fish, that they are familiar or at least able to purchase on the internet too. And certain products come in 240v options on the American sites now anyway (vis Iwaki pumps). And it could be said that if retailers are concerned about customers buying "outside the box" then perhaps they should start stocking those items that are more attractive on the internet. After all - Im sure they could negotiate discounts from the suppliers for buying in "semi-bulk".

Ira - now that pic brings back memories ! We used to (and they still do) run a lot of stuff on those in the NHS back home. Bloody VMS. ever been tempted to type in @sys$system:shutdown ???? (or something like that - forgotton it all now). Anyway - we digress

Buzzy - exactly - get the best skimmer you can and then it is future-proof (or as much as possible). Deltecs hold their value more too if you should choose to sell (hopefully not). LFS will get the tank connectors / bulkheads - but they will cost more than if you go to your friendly plumbing supply store (or better still get a mate who is a plumber to do this). Mico do it all i have been told.

Layton - that Sohal is spectacular. And the algae blenny is a favourite too. What a long list. Maybe we should be hosting the chch meeting at yours first, lol. Looking forward to seeing it all sometime. Chris

The other thing to bear in mind is that for the money, a Deltec isnt THAT much more than other DECENT skimmers on the market. Sure its a lot more than the crap ones, but at the end of the day if the budget is there - its worth the extra - its like a couple of hundred bucks more on an overall budget ten times that at least. I would rather get a slightly lower rated Deltec to save the money and know its gonna do a good job than try to find an equally rated other brand.

Aaron - put me down for some of them there seeds too !

looks ok, but that pic is a bit wee to see. when you say you want the return going through a powerhead, do you mean you are intending to use a powerhead as the return pump?

You could do it that way - there is nothing to stop you connecting that return to say a spray bar which is submerged but pointing slightly up to break the surface of the water. this should not give you bubbles.. The alternative is to hook the return up to sea squirts or revolutions (i will leave chimera or one of the others to elaborate as they are using them already i believe). The sump should be as big as you can fit within the limits of your space. Also, you need the level of the sump to be set so that if there is any back-syphoning from the return, that the sump will hold that volume of water. Thats just a case of measuring the drop from the water level in the tank to beneath the spraybar and calculating the volume and ensuring that a RISE in water level in the sump as a result of syphoning could hold that volume.