Jaide Posted December 1, 2012 Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 I lost a clown loach a few months ago - he became what I can only describe as anorexic and eventually died, I couldn't figure out how he got to that state as the other loaches were fine and growing well. I now have a 2nd loach also showing signs of losing weight and have now researched to find about a disease called "loach skinny disease" which is apparently an infestation of some sort of internal parasite. Can anyone please recommend a good treatment for internal parasites? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F15hguy Posted December 1, 2012 Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 most likely worms, try Avitrol plus has both Levimisol and Praziquantel. problem being most clown loaches are wild caught. just be very light with treatment as Loaches can be particularly sensitive to chemicals. check out http://www.loaches.com/disease-treatment/levamisole-hydrochloride-1 (this site should almost be stickied as it not only explains the treatment but also how and why it works VERY GOOD) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaide Posted December 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 Thanks I'll trot down to my LFS tomorrow, I hope they have it as they usually just stock the generic white spot treatment or wunder tonic or some such. I have Furan but not sure if that will do the trick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F15hguy Posted December 1, 2012 Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 Avitrol is a bird wormer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sophia Posted December 1, 2012 Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 aviverm is what it's called up here Jaide, Furan is an antibacterial medicine, only for certain sorts of bacteria too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaide Posted December 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 An antibiotic, yes I know- when I was looking for meds for fish another time, it was that or white spot tonic that the shop had and that was it :-? I'll ask about aviverm today, not sure about the bird wormer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sophia Posted December 1, 2012 Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 aviverm is the bird wormer, it's the brand name for levamisole. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaide Posted December 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 Bird wormers to treat fish - I guess what works for one.... I just hope the LFS has at least one of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sophia Posted December 1, 2012 Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 Levamisole is sold as a bird wormer because it's a wormer. And mostly used for birds. It works for both. Same like Drontal brand name (fenbendazole) is sold for cattle and furry pets but also still works for fish. You just need to know the dosage because the vet most likely won't tell you because they don't work on fish much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaide Posted December 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 So how much do I add to the tank? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F15hguy Posted December 1, 2012 Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 everything you need to know http://www.loaches.com/Members/shari2/levamisole-hydrochloride-1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaide Posted December 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 Thanks Not sure about the gravel vacuum though, my tank substrate is sand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanmin4304 Posted December 1, 2012 Report Share Posted December 1, 2012 Be aware that "wasting disease" is also a sign that can present with Piscene Tuberculosis. The safest thing is to where waterproof gloves. This is the main reason for the requirement to wear gloves when dealing with fish in quarantine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sophia Posted December 2, 2012 Report Share Posted December 2, 2012 These are the instructions I use, from Jennifer: the dosage of aviverm is 1ml per 100L if you know for sure it's worms, if not use 1ml per 150L. Leave it for 24 hours with no lights, then do a gravel vac worth 25-40% of the water, then do a smaller vac over the next few days. if it's sand you could just stir up the bottom but not actually vac the sand. When my 2 loaches were super skinny after they changed homes I used 1 per 100L and they went down hill and disappeared. It didn't do anything for the CPDs that were wasting so that could have been TB but I will never know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaide Posted December 7, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 7, 2012 Be aware that "wasting disease" is also a sign that can present with Piscene Tuberculosis. The safest thing is to where waterproof gloves. This is the main reason for the requirement to wear gloves when dealing with fish in quarantine. I don't think it's that as it's only the Clowns that are affected. I tried cat wormer (as they didn't have the other stuff), as recommended by the fish guy at the LFS (he said he cleared up a case of worms with his discus) and a week later my clown isn't looking any fatter. He's still feeding well though - looks fine in every other way, just bony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sophia Posted December 7, 2012 Report Share Posted December 7, 2012 the sort of animal it worms isn't so important, but what the actual drug is. what is the name of the drug, not the brand name? it takes a couple of weeks for them to fatten up again, or sometimes they just stay at not-fat stage and get skinny again later Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaide Posted December 7, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 7, 2012 the sort of animal it worms isn't so important, but what the actual drug is. what is the name of the drug, not the brand name? it takes a couple of weeks for them to fatten up again, or sometimes they just stay at not-fat stage and get skinny again later The bird wormer they had didn't have that ingredient so we didn't try it. He suggested the dog/cat wormer as it worked for him (and it was recommended by someone else) so I gave that a crack (and used the left over pills to worm the cat OK, I'll keep an eye on him and see how he is next week. I just did a water change and cleaned out the filter so will see how it goes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrienne Posted December 7, 2012 Report Share Posted December 7, 2012 What are you feeding the clown? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaide Posted December 7, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 7, 2012 What are you feeding the clown? All sorts, tonight he had shrimp pellets, novo tab and discus bits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaide Posted December 10, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 10, 2012 Still no change with him - he's still eating well but is still bony and none of the other fish are affected. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sophia Posted December 11, 2012 Report Share Posted December 11, 2012 If he doesn't appear to be getting skinnier he might go on like that for a couple more weeks before finally getting quite inactive and then seperating himself from the group for a quiet death. What is the most obvious change of behaviour is the not hanging out with the other fish, and mine would go after food but not eat it. I put the first one of mine to sleep but then after that I let them die peacefully in their home. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaide Posted December 11, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 11, 2012 So you're saying it's not worms and you don't know what's wrong and I should put him down? The problem is, it's not the first Clown to get this condition and I'm concerned there's some sort of chain reaction going on with them, so if I don't work out what's wrong and fix it, I'll lose the lot :tears: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sophia Posted December 12, 2012 Report Share Posted December 12, 2012 Where did I say that? I was telling you that my loaches have behaved like yours and then what happened after. If you want to try other wormers you can, but I never have, for no particular reason. I don't think you should or shouldn't put the fish down, it's up to you. I haven't put mine down as they seem to just fade away quietly which seems to me to be more humane than trying to catch them in that state. But that's just me. If you think he is suffering you should do what you think is best. I wormed my last 2 skinny loaches in the riverbed tank and they went downhill visibly in the next 24 hours and disappeared in the week after. I was advised that sometimes there are so many worms in the system that killing them is too much for the fish to cope with so they die anyway. What has happened since I've had loaches is that I've had 6 or 7 loaches at a time and over a few months I've noticed one get skinny and die. I replace the fish and then in a few months another one goes. I haven't replaced the last 2 and so far the last 4 are all fatties but it's not to say that one will not get whatever it is. It's possible they have the worms in them all the time but if they get sick or lose condition it's enough for the worms to take hold. Unless you know someone who can look at a fish and diagnose it and treat, you can only do what you know to do and then leave the rest to nature. That's probably not what you want to hear but it just seems really difficult to get fish health perfect when we are not vets or biologists, and that they are underwater. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James125 Posted December 12, 2012 Report Share Posted December 12, 2012 Bugger, i should have bought some praziquantel over with me, you could of had that and its liquid form, works really well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaide Posted December 12, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 12, 2012 Bugger, i should have bought some praziquantel over with me, you could of had that and its liquid form, works really well Thanks James, I appreciate it - that's very sweet of you I phoned my local vet and they have Avitrol so will pick some up tonight :happy2: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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