wasp Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 Now I'm getting into SPS, I really need better flow, but I'm finding this quite hard, I need some advice / help/ tips. The main problem is the tank is only 30 inches long, in a small tank like that I'm finding it quite hard to get good even flow throught the tank. I've put powerheads around, but they tend to blast one area heaps, but not good flow in another area. Maybe it's just placement and I'll just have to fiddle a bit. However I just thought someone may have some useful thoughts or experience to share. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reef Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 STREAM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cracker Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 When you come up to my place A. I will show you my setup. Heaps of current on the Cheap!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chimera Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 cracker, do you have enough current needed for sps? whats your tank turnover rate at? Once im finished mine will be: Sump return = 3,500lph (1 x Iwaki 55RLT) Closed loops = 13,500lph (1 x Dolphin Ampmaster 3000) Powerheads = 24,000lph (2 x 6100 Tunze streams) Total tank turnover = 41,000lph Main tank volume = 540 litres Turnover rate = 76 x main tank volume per hour Heaps of current on the expensive!! I believe SPS does best at 20 x tank turnover or higher. Go the (big and ugly) streams Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brianemone Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 elaborate on your setup Cracker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RnB Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 what is your estimated power use by everything tank related ie everything, lights,pumps etc I have access to a clamp if you are interested... cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brianemone Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 what kind of power heads are you using??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cracker Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 will do the math and check..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RnB Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 Dolphin Ampmaster 3000 these look way cute, when does yours arrieve, love to see it running and clamp it to verify power claims. P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cracker Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 By the way, tank turnover is irrelevant. You can have a powerful pump 3 feet away from an SPS that creates a set amount of movement. You can also have a smaller pump 8 inches from the same SPS and the Bloody coral does not or will not know the difference IMO. Tank turnover rates simply assist with filtering and self cleaning. I guarantee you can run SPS with smaller current than everyone presumes, so long as they are refreshed and the main tank turnover is sufficient for filtration needs. If the water parameters are all good, the the SPS wont mind faster or harder currents, (Within reason of course). DEBATES HERE WE GO!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetskisteve Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 Wasp cut the nozzles off yr powerheads- check Ultimate reef if you need pics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cracker Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 Right...done some basic math. Give or take 5% I am turning over my tank around 24 times per hour. What should it be? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cracker Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 Ive got: 2 powerheads 2 Sump pumps, (one smaller one with directional downward current capability). 1 submersible Laguna in tank Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cracker Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 Chimera boy, you have a storm in your system son!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chimera Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 Cracker... Let the games begin SPS require a vast amount of ever changing currents - ok sure, more so than total turnover but this is the easiest way to calculate how much you need (without getting into specific placement of powerheads) As I say, from what I have read this is at least 20 times the tank turnover per hour. You can also have a smaller pump 8 inches from the same SPS and the Bloody coral does not or will not know the difference IMO Why the need for high water velocity you ask? Predominantely to rid the coral of it's own wastes (which is true with any coral) Another key requirement for needing high water turnover (and high current) depends on the amount of SPS corals you keep. Large "heads" of acropora will significantly reduce the water flow about half way through a colony. This means the larger the (turbulent) movement of water the more chance it can satisfy SPS's current needs. IMO, even with most reef tanks we aren't even coming close to the water movements we see in nature! A small quote I found from a reef web site: Most SPS's will do well in a very turbellent enviroment where the water is moving past them in a strong burst like movement. RnB... Dolphin Ampmaster 3000 these look way cute, when does yours arrieve, love to see it running and clamp it to verify power claims Dude, I have the pump but have not hooked it up yet (awaiting an Oceans Motions 4-way from the States) But, I must say I am very impressed. How can you be impressed when you haven't seen it working yet you ask? Simple, the design of the pump is solid with quality parts - very much the same look & feel as an Iwaki. The thing weighs almost 15 pounds!!! It's like looking over a Ferrari motor versus Toyota motor, you know quality when you see it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeBlog Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 I completely agree with Chimera. Before I sold my 2nd Amp Master, I was pushing over 90 times turn over in my 5x2x2 and the corals (SPS) never looked better!!! I plan on getting another 2 stream 6100's to accompany the two I already have as well as an Amp Master 3000 (on a closed loop OM 4-way), and Eheim 1260 & 1262 as returns. You can never have too much flow for SPS!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pies Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 My tank is powered by 3x 6100 Streams, 3x Ehiem 1262x, 1x IWAKI 100 (x2 sea swirls). I have dead spots. Who said they had 90x turnover? Sounds dubious. Pie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeBlog Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 Well Pies, I said it and the guys in ChCh know that it was true!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ira Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 And here I was happy about my 30X or so per hour. *Sulks away in shame...* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fay Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 Are you sure you want to get into acros they seen a lot of trouble to me. If you want flow you can't go past streams. I've had that much flow I had to put them down below the rock, my softies hated it. It's taken lots of trail and error but I think Ive got every thing happy now. I have a small stream in the 2foot square tank and its great no need for other power heads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chimera Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 if you hate sps that bad fay and wanna sell ya streams fay, just let me know :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chimera Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 oh, and sps can bleach if they dont get enough water movement (cant flush away wastes and can also get 'burnt') some "real" evidence... http://the.honoluluadvertiser.com/article/2003/Sep/01/ln/ln08a.html hence one reason we need a large water turnover... and a chiller an extremely interesting excerpt from this is: There is a key threshold. When reefs sustain for several weeks consecutively a 1 degree (celsius or 1.8 degrees fahrenheit) temperature above the mean average maximum," corals lose their zooxanthellae, she said Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted February 18, 2005 Author Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 Wow, Thanks for all the replies. To many to reply to each one, but it's all good useful practicle stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pies Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 JoeBlog - 90x is a lot of turnover. How did you achieve so much? You must need over 50,000 litres an our of water flow. Not saying you don't, just seems like a lot, i'd be curious to know what you did to get it so high as I would like a little more myself. Cheers Piemania Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeBlog Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 Pies- Amp Master 3000 (closed loop) 13500 Amp Master 3000 (closed loop) 13500 6100 Stream (100% to 30%) 12000 6100 Stream (100% to 30%) 4000 DIY Stream (conservative estimate) 4000 DIY Stream (conservative estimate) 4000 DIY Stream (conservative estimate) 4000 Eheim 1262 (closed loop) 3360 Eheim 1260 (return) 2400 Resun King 3 (return) 2400 Total 60,000+ I have a total of ~650 liters (including the sumps), => 90 times turnover (approximately since I haven't calculated for head loss) In my new setup after the move, I ditched: DIY Streams (I hate that they are hard to restart and do not provide variable flow like the Tunze) Resun King 3 (basically because they suck) 2nd Amp Master 3000 (to fund the move, i.e. new sump for Miracle Mud, 4-way, another MH, etc...) which I plan to replace with two more 6100 streams, which will give me about 50,000LPH (approximately 80 times turn over) I like the flow!!!! 8) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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