Save our frogs, appose mining their habitat/s...

[Insect Direct]

Below is an email thats has been forwarded to myself. Just thought Id like to share with the few people on here who maybe interested. I personally am not appose to mining in general. But I am apose to mining if it will destroy the habitats of our extremely rare and unique amphibians. If you would like a copy of the email please email me [email protected]

Unfortunately, the New Zealand Government wants to make a quick buck by mining some of the beautiful New Zealand forests which are home to Archey’s frogs (Leiopelma archeyi) and Hochstetter’s frogs (Leiopelma hochstetteri). If this goes ahead then we will be able to document the extinction of two more frog species.

In the 1990s areas of New Zealand that were considered to be of “high conservation value” (including many National Parks) were placed on Schedule 4 which recognised their conservation significance and proclaimed them as a “No go” area for all other activities. The New Zealand Government is now asking for public submissions about their proposal to remove some of this high conservation value land from Schedule 4 to open it up for mining (coal, gold iron ore and rare minerals). The areas to be mined include several long-term frog monitoring sites where the frog populations have been continually monitored for over 40 years – this represents the best data on frog populations anywhere in the world.

In addition the proposed mining area includes the ‘type’ locality of Archey’s frog (Tokatea on the Coromandel Peninsula) and Hochstetter’s frogs (Coromandel Peninsula). Archey’s frogs only occur in two areas of New Zealand and the Coromandel is considered the ‘stronghold’ population.

“Save our frogs – stop the mining” really is the biggest issue in New Zealand conservation – of course saving the long-tailed bat, woodroses and a North Island brown kiwi along the way is important too!

These endangered frogs (Archey’s are Critically Endangered losing 88% of their population since 1996) are just hanging in there and without our help they will disappear. If we destroy their habitat then we will quickly lose a part of one of the most important pieces of New Zealand history as well as a large piece of the amphibian evolutionary tree. We have a moral obligation to protect these original inhabitants of New Zealand – the little people of the forest.

For more information on how the frogs will be affected (including maps of distribution and proposed areas to be mined) click here…… http://www.nzfrogs.org/

To see some ppt about the mining issue during a recent Panel Discussion (including frogs) click here……. http://www.otago.ac.nz/law/nrl/mining/index.html

For more information about the mining in Coromandel click here……. http://www.forestandbird.org.nz/saving- ... coromandel

Please make a submission to the New Zealand Government by clicking here ….. http://www.forestandbird.org.nz/mining

AArk web site Contact us Donate now

The Amphibian Ark is a global non-profit organisation formed to ensure the global survival of amphibians, focusing on those that cannot currently be safeguarded in nature.

Submissions close 26th MAY

[Zev]

Hmm, would not like to see them living in a fridge in ice cream containers as has happened with the snails...

[phoenix44]

I dislike the use of emotive language in a submission like this; makes it very hard to read and form an objective decision.

Poor frogs though. Is that their only habitat?

[alanmin4304]

No

[Insect Direct]

I dislike the use of emotive language in a submission like this; makes it very hard to read and form an objective decision.

Poor frogs though. Is that their only habitat?

The above is just an email. You write a submission if you please.

The frogs are hardly widespread or in numbers like they use to be. So any mining that effects any of their habitats is not good imo.

[Stella]

you can do a quick submission through the Forest & Bird page:

http://www.forestandbird.org.nz/mining-quick-submission

It is about as onerous as signing a petition (name, address, email address)

You can also alter the submission however you like to express what you want to say.

[bdspider]

Actually, political leanings aside, I would be interested to hear why you support mining of conservation land Phoenix?

[phoenix44]

I actually disagree with destruction of habitat and what have you; that's why I asked it that region was their only habitat.

But given the set of circumstances we face today, the balance of payments deficit and gloomy outlook for a nation that is taking on more debt, I agree with mining to reduce the burden on the economy.

As animal lovers we tend to overlook the reality of the economy as it is today. fact is if the economy suffers further or is susceptible to some market shock that is considered out of the ordinary, there won't be enough money for what we consider basic kiwi organisations.

what if the soaring debt levels get to the point where the government steps in and says - look we have some money for infrastructure, but we have to reduce funding towards healthcare? This has been done recently, and did not go down well. how would parents with sick children, or sick people feel if they knew that animal care in New Zealand came before primary healthcare?

I don't like the whole mining issue; infact I'd like to think us humans would have the sense to at least leave one nation on this planet untouched. But given the current situation I don't think they have many more options. If you go through the budget, look at the ins and out, accept that huge treaty payments are being made in a period of global recession; there isn't much other choice. the only other option is that the govt. borrows some more. but what does that solve? it could potentially decrease the credit rating of NZ, thus making everything we have here more expensive, not to mention it would increase our exposures to an international market that NZ has little/no control over.

The core issue here is to look at the macroeconomic outlook and situation we face today. the country needs money; for the december 2009 quarter the BOP was 3.1 billion NZD in deficit. where's the money going to come from? The government needs to explore every possible situation.

The Net international liabilities for New Zealand in the Dec 2009 quarter was just over 167.5 Billion NZD - that at the time represented over 90% of the nations GDP!

The thought is absolutely frightening, and that's why (and I love nature) think we need to look sternly at the hole we are digging for our selves and try generating sources of revenue. Mining is one source. It's a touchy subject, and rightfully so - but someone needs to make the decision to reduce the burden on the BOP.

[phoenix44]

oh and I don't mean to upset any one, so if I have, PM me and let me know

[bdspider]

I'm sure no-one will be upset, it's an intelligent thought out post. I do know what you mean by raising revenue, but could that short term boost come at a cost? It's hard to measure what effect it could have on our biggest export which I'm sure you know is tourism. Maybe out of sight mines won't be noticed by the tourists. Maybe the false 'clean green' image which attracts people will put them off.

If I could be sure that it would only be small areas affected, with underground mines... Might be a different story. But even underground mines need their entrances & all the access roads and heavy machinery that needs to be transported in causes damage.

When looking at tourism in SE Asia I remember how they have supposedly protected national parks too, but with enough money any developer can build in them, with the detriment to locals who wouldn't stand a chance of competing with international resort chains. Is that how we'll turn out? National Parks full of hotels and mines, purchased by the higher bidder?

[Insect Direct]

I dont really want to get into a discussion. Just thought id bring it to peoples attention that if mining goes ahead on Schedule 4 conservation land it may have an effect on the frogs. If 88% of the frog population has already disappeared in the last 14years then any impact of mining could be enough to tip the balance.

I just hope the government doesnt just think of them as some silly little frogs and they end up like the snails as mentioned above. Theyre very very unique and being critically endangered I really hope all care is taken to preserve them. Mining can be done else where. The frogs wont necessarily be successful elsewhere.

[alanmin4304]

There is a little more to mining than hiding the entrance to the mine. What happens to all the spoil that comes out of the hidden entrance? If we extract all our minerals now, what will our decendents do to survive in 100 years when they face financial problems? They could offer to take all the radio active waste from all the countries that don't know what to do with it and charge them heaps to dispose of it in our existing mines ---that would reduce our debt. This country needs to learn to think ahead more than a fortnight.

[soloman5]

I'm not really up with the frog thing but why have and are the numbers dropping so badly? My partner use to farm out the back of Huntly and he said that there were huge amounts of frogs everywhere literally all through the paddocks. He was having a yack to his old farm boss the other day and he was saying over the last few years the frogs seem to have disappeared to basically zilch there don't seem to be any left in the dams or near the water ways either. Just wondered if anyone had any thoughts as to why this would be?

[Insect Direct]

Suspect chytrid fungus. could be pollution, things dont seem to be getting any cleaner in ponds, streams etc. More chemical use to kill insects. kiddies destroying habitats to collect tadpoles/frogs. maybe all of the above.

Amphibians seem to be on the decline throughout the world.

I must say though over the past couple of years the exotic frogs seem to be doing well in this part of the country.

[alanmin4304]

I understand that the health of frog populations is a good measure of the health of the aquatic environment. Doesn't say much for the way we are looking after our clean green country.

[Stella]

Regarding Phoenix's post about why he supports mining:

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/3657416 ... -geologist

"Talk of mining pulling New Zealand from the economic doldrums was premature, he said. "Mining is a long-term industry, it's not a quick fix. Getting a mine started can take 10 years, especially if it's on conservation land. It's unlikely we would have any mines other than coal or gold starting up in the next 10 years. The other commodities that get talked about in other parts of the conservation estate, I think it's more like 50 or 100 years."

[alanmin4304]

Another problem is that the general population and the odd overseas import have such little respect for our flaura and fauna that Doc have to remain secretive about the location of these rare species. Some person with an accounting bent might think that exporting them would be the solution to our financial woes. Because of this situation it is difficult to find out what rear or endangered species are likely to be located where mining is being proposed. As soon as it is declared that this is a site for something rare every man and his dog would be up there trying to find them.

[Stella]

wow, interesting point!

And there have certainly been cases in the past of simply destroying areas of bush or whatever that housed animal or plants that may have got in the way of a resource consent. And once it is gone it is gone, so no consent problems....

[MalcolmX]

the macraes mine near dunedin is right next to a protected site for Otago skinks, and they seem to do ok. Not that im for mining in all places.

[alanmin4304]

So it is highly likely that there used to be some where the mine is.

[bdspider]

http://www.stuff.co.nz/environment/3726456/London-Zoos-bid-to-save-Kiwi-frog

" One of the world's largest zoos has drawn attention to the plight of an endangered New Zealand frog, which could be wiped out if its protected habitat was opened up to mining.

Conservationists say the campaign, by the Zoological Society of London, has dealt New Zealand's green image another blow.

The society is calling on the British public to make submissions on the New Zealand Government's proposals to permit mining on more than 7000 hectares of the conservation estate. "