HaNs Posted May 17, 2008 Report Share Posted May 17, 2008 Im wanting to compile an article soon and am wondering what people think/know. What pro's and cons can you see in the alternative foods that you use/used? Iv noticed better growth feeding beef. Beef Pros: High protein/energy? = high growth rates Cons: Higher fat content than fish meat = liver problems? Shrimp Pros: More similar to what fish would eat in the wild Cons: ???? Reading the back of my Haikari carnivore pellets pack i see that they contain wheat flour. They are min 47% protein, min 5.0% fat. Max 3% crude fiber, max 17% crude ash(ummmm ash???). Any other input is welcome Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Afrikan Posted May 17, 2008 Report Share Posted May 17, 2008 I like to feed fresh shrimp from the fisheries... would feed that over beef anyday.... 8) Hmmm natural in wild..... fish climb out of water and butcher a cow.... hmmm probably not :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snookie Posted May 17, 2008 Report Share Posted May 17, 2008 i reckon my ornate would try to eat a cow ! :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HaNs Posted May 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 17, 2008 What % of trimmed/clean beef heart is fat? Im trying to find out hard facts. Carrots? High in carotene = Help with orange coloration Cucumbers? Potato? Starch = ?? Garlic? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snookie Posted May 17, 2008 Report Share Posted May 17, 2008 maybe have to watch the salt content in shrimp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HaNs Posted May 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 17, 2008 maybe have to watch the salt content in shrimp High sodium + fish = ? heart issues? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livingart Posted May 17, 2008 Report Share Posted May 17, 2008 there was a thread a few months back that contained some useful scientific facts on beef heart etc i think the fat content in heart muscle is quite low found it for you http://www.fnzas.org.nz/fishroom/1-vt28 ... sc&start=0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HaNs Posted May 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 17, 2008 Healthy mammal liver tissue and heart muscle don't have fat in them Im got a few more hours of reading to do tonight Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freakyfish Posted May 17, 2008 Report Share Posted May 17, 2008 Another problem with Beef is the fat is a different fat then fish are used to consuming and they dont digest it as well Brad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bastables Posted May 17, 2008 Report Share Posted May 17, 2008 Another problem with Beef is the fat is a different fat then fish are used to consuming and they dont digest it as well Brad And collagen the binding agent in warm blooded animals is also insoluble and indigestible. When fish eat insoluble vitamins and fats they can't use it. Insoluble items are stored in the liver. Since animal fats and collagens can never be digested the build up leads to death through liver failures. You can get around this by bumping the temps up to 30deg and above where animal fats then start becoming soluble. Bumping up the temps is why you get this odd dissonance where most cichlids are kept at 26 to 28degs but bred discus fed on beef heart need temps of 30deg merely to survive as they process the animal fat's they've been fed through their time as juveniles. Collagen the binding agent in cow's and humans is much more problematic as a warm blooded animal does not want the stuff that literally ties their body together melting at normal body temps. Cow's internal temps range in literature from 37 to 40 deg. So you end up with a fish that slowly appears fatter as their liver fills up with stuff it cannot excrete nor process. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whetu Posted May 20, 2008 Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 What % of trimmed/clean beef heart is fat? Im trying to find out hard facts. Carrots? High in carotene = Help with orange coloration Cucumbers? Potato? Starch = ?? Garlic? Veges are an 'alternative' food? Wow... don't tell my fishies. They think they are a staple. Of course it depends on what type of fish you have. My gold barbs love their veges but I'm sure they would turn up their noses at beef heart (not that I've ever tried it). I put some sprigs of fresh new grass in my tank the other day but nobody even nibbled it! If I put a variety of mixed veges in the tank, the sweetcorn gets eaten first, the peas second and the carrots left till last. IMO variety is vital - as people have mentioned, a buildup of some nutrients can cause problems (for all sorts of animals, not just fish). So if you feed a variety of commercial dried foods and fresh foods suitable for your fish then you're likely to get it about right. By the way, my fish and I eat organic vegetables whenever possible because we don't like pesticides! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HaNs Posted May 20, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 Im talking about alternatives to commercial foods. Wanting more pro's and con's info if possible. Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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