Chimeras Tank Build (Sump room, new tank etc)

[Pies]

Chimera - Are you sure that tank is going to hold? Doesn't look like a lot of bracing along the top (particuary the back), given there are holes in the back too.

With the overflow, how much room do you have between the top of the overflow box and the top of the tank? Looks like about 3cm. Remember the more powerfull the pump, the higher the water level in the tank. Also are you going to put something over it (like a comb) to stop fish from getting flooded over? If so the restriction is going to push the water level even higher...

Pieman

[chimera]

Well I certainly hope the tank will hold! It has 3 braces over the top (2 ends and a middle) plus a strip along the front. I told him not to give up strength just for the sake of less bracing - I've left it in his hands to build it correctly.

The guy also said that the water level will sit about 5mm above the overflow so we allowed for that. There is about 35mm before the top. I wanted as much viewable area as possible in the wall. The comb will restrict water flow more but Im only picking about 2mm higher water level again.

[Pies]

My tank with the laser cut overflow (5mm open, 5mm closed) driven by a single ehiem 1262 sits about 1.5cm above the bottom of the comb.

The thing to think about is that if you feed some nori and it floats off, or a bit of algae floats up or a snail or startfish climbs up and partially blocks the comb, you don't want to end up with water falling over the top of the tank.

Pies

[chimera]

I will suss out something I am sure. Only the water test will give a better test, hook up the Iwaki etc

Sea-swirl arrived this arvo, gonna hook it up to my 4 foot tonight and see if it blows the front glass off :-?

[chimera]

Sea swirl is cool! I already noticed less cyano (or rather slower 'growth') on areas where there was previously little water movement and its only been 12 hours! The only issue is the return pump is an Eheim 1060 (at the moment) so its not pumping as efficiently as it could/should be. My only concern is that the Iwaki (which will be mounted downstairs therefore at a larger head) would mean flow (according to the chart) will be about the same as the Eheim 1060 currently. Of course, the only real test is once it all goes in.

For anyones interest, here's the flow rates for all Eheim's:

http://www.brooklands.co.nz/eheim/techinfo.htm

[chimera]

Weekend update: Sump room has been completely sealed with polyurathane. All plumbing down to the room has been completed (glued 40mm marley piping) and leak tested. All plumbing back upstairs has been completed with 20mm pressure piping. For this, I only needed 2 x 45 degree elbows to get passed a floor joist so this should keep good flow rate. Ceiling will be lined this weekend. Hopefully my sparky mate will be able to put in separate circuit on RCD to this room then too.

Got the tank valve put in the 3 foot sump as well as siliconing in a single baffle to make a small overflow (to keep heaters submerged) I ordered another union ball valve from Mico to go between the sump tank valve and the Iwaki (originally had a 25mm plastic piping but this was too difficult to get in and tied up plus makes removal too difficult) I also ordered a 3-way ball valve (f#$%@ expensive, $200!) to go between 4 foot refugium and 3 foot sump to make water changes easier. I also got another 25mm tank valve to go in a hole 50mm down from the top of the sump so if too much water is put in the sump (or the main tank backflows) it empties into either a holding tank or straight down the drain rather than onto the floor! (haven't figured which yet)

I also bought some flexible piping from a marine shop that is usually used for bilge pumps and the likes. This will go between the Iwaki output and start of return piping held with stainless steel clips. My only concern is that the flexible piping is not pressure tested - the guy at the boat shop assured me it was good enough. Can only test to find out!

I also painted the back of the 3 foot sump with transparent blue paint as a test prior to painting the main tank. I think it looks quite cool, problem is the room that the tank will be facing is pitch black so it almost seems pointless. However, I think there will be enough light reflecting from the MH's should give it a nice appearance. Makes the water look "deep sea blue". Will post a photo of this to get your opinions (on 'painting back of tank' post)

New photo's of room will be posted tonight!

[chimera]

here's the latest pic's, 3 foot sump all plumbed up. The hole in the tank at the left waiting for a 25mm tank valve to be fitted. This is, as mentioned above, incase of backflow or overfilling to go to a holding tank or drain:

and a close up shot:

Fingers crossed the black bilge pump piping will hold under pressure!

and here's a shot of the pressure piping heading back upstairs:

[Ira]

That doesn't look anything like the diagrams of what you were going to make the sump look like.

[chimera]

What do you mean? it's exactly like the diagram I have (on page 2 and 3) just that the pump is in a different position. And it is only slightly different than my basic pic's from the first page. I still have the heaters and skimmer etc in the same place, they're just not in yet coz they're running the existing tank I opted to leave the centre brace in the sump for support as it's quite deep. The skimmer will sit on a reef rack in the left side of the sump.

I also have a Korralin C3001 calcium reactor turning up next week sometime. Will probably go in or near the sump. Because I dont own it yet, Im not sure of it's exact dimensions or where I'll fit the CO2 bottle and reg. Plenty of room Im sure

You can just make out the blue colour I painted on the back of the sump as well - I know its a bit hard to tell from these pics, but thoughts?

[Ira]

There was another diagram a while ago of just the sump itself, probably your plans have changed since then. I just tried to find it, but couldn't, was thinking I might copy it if I get a sump made for my new tank. Had 3 vertical partitions, not completely open. Annoying that I can't find that thread.

[chimera]

Tested all plumbing tonight, hooked end of inlet piping straight back into overflow piping to create a loop without a tank. Water flowed perfectly, no leaks. Bilge pump piping is mint - definately recommend rather than 90 degree bends

Only problem was black plastic temporary "trough" i loaned from NickS is leaking where he puttied it up :lol: Gave it heaps of silicon and tested again. Photo's shortly...

[chimera]

Sump room was put on hold last weekend coz the wife wanted a fireplace in and its on hold this weekend coz Im going snowboarding However, here's an update as of tonight:

Replaced the Iwaki MD-30RX with an MD-40RX tonight (next model up) This is rated at approximately 3,000 litres per hour at a 3 metre head height (rather than 2,200 litres per hour). The 3/4 inch Sea-swirl is rated at a max of 3,200 litres per hour although they recommend running near the maximum figure for optimal performance so Im right on the money. A single model up makes a massive change, I have been testing it tonight and you can simply hear the difference let alone see it!

Last week I also picked up some egg-crate for reef-rack/lift the skimmer and more perspex for an extra baffle or two in the sump. Will show pic's of that once its complete.

The temporary setup (shows the big blob of silicon on the 'trough' needed to stop the initial leak )

Water into sump (temporary piping!)

Close-up of water dropping into sump, this will be fixed to the wall via a 3-way ball valve shortly:

I added a loop pipe at the top of the return (upstairs) to go straight back down the marley overflow pipe. I ran the pump for about 30 minutes. Again no leaks.

And, just to show a pic of how much better this whole setup will be, here is a before pic of the sump and wiring under the current tank - yuck!!! The marley pipe with blue tape on it to the right is the overflow for the new tank that goes under the house to the sump room.

As you can see, I am very keen on getting the new setup complete and this mess sussed out! It currently makes water changes a nightmare!

[Pies]

James that awesome mate. I am very impressed, thanks for all the info and pics, some of this stuff is helping me out a lot.

Piemania

[chimera]

No worries dude, glad to be of assistance! I will collate/document the whole setup and upload to my web site once it's done.

[RnB]

your deltec skimmer?

[chimera]

yeah my deltec skimmer. what about it?

[jetskisteve]

more pics

[chimera]

this weekend, fingers crossed!

[chimera]

Ok, not exactly sump room but part of the big project. Not alot done last weekend either (oh well, at least I got the fireplace in!) Anyways, I have 3 x 25mm holes in the bottom and 3 x 25mm holes near the top of the tank for closed loops. Two of them at the bottom (the two ends) are intakes for water to go to down to each pump. The 3rd hole in the bottom (the middle one) as well as 3 other holes near the top of the tank are outputs (4 total), alternated in pairs by two SCWD's. I've made the spray bar out of pressure piping for the output on the middle/bottom hole in the tank as follows:

and complete (less holes drilled in it):

The other 3 outputs at the top will be connected with rotating flow nozzles.

I am about to make the 2 intakes (that sit beneath the reef racks) for the water to go to the pumps. My question is the maximum size of the holes in the piping for the water to flow through. If they are too small, the closed loops wont perform optimally or may become clogged. If they are too big, they will possibly suck in things that could block or break the pumps. The smallest thing I could find at the plumbing store was as follows (10 cent piece to show size)

All this will sit under a reef rack but there is still a chance with the amount of water flow for shit to get sucked into the holes. My second option was basically to use end-caps (similar to the ends of the spray bar above) and have it sit vertically with holes in it.

The spray bar will have a specific number of 6mm holes in it so that its entire surface area (of the small holes) equals the same area as a 25mm hole. So, using Pi r^2 gives 490sq mm for a 25mm hole. The same equation for a 6mm hole gives 28sq mm. Dividing this means approx 18 holes for the spray bar/intake. Of course, this is a very approximate way of calculating it as flow rate increases exponentially the larger the hole you go. However, its important to maintain some form of pressure with a spray bar so I will stick with the 18 holes: one on each end of the caps =2 and 4 along each side, both front and back=16 or a total of 18 x 6mm holes. The intake bar could be a much larger number of holes without a problem, at a guesstimate at least 25 x 6mm holes would be more optimal.

Anyways, your thoughts about the cap shown above - is it too big??? Would I be better off with a vertical-reverse-flow-spray-bar? (which I'll call a VRFSB :-) )

[jetskisteve]

Snails????

[chimera]

perhaps. i think a shit load of holes will be sufficient.

[Ira]

What're you using to glue the pipes together? I'm thinking I'll do something similar for the return from my sump, at least until I get a sea swirl.

[chimera]

novakey solvent cement (plumbers glue) from any plumbing store. paste on inside of fitting and outside of pipe then push together and hold for 30 seconds. immediately wipe any excess glue off the pipe (and off the inside if possible) bonds the pvc together by essentially "melting" it. very strong and if done properly, leak proof. make sure you leave 24 hours then give it a bloody good rinse out (preferably with salt water!) dont get that stuff on your hands or you'll know about it pretty damn quick!

[Pies]

I wouldn't use the part as pic above. I am just going to use pressure piping with an end cap and drill many holes in it (10mm wide).

Whats up with the screw in end bit? does that screw into the hansen tank inlet? If so will you be able screw it in now that its glued together?

Pies

[chimera]

Already decided against the piece shown above for obvious reasons!

The threaded piece is a 25mm pressure fitting that I hacksawed down about half as follows:

I did this to get the spray bar sitting closer to the bottom of the tank. It screws straight onto the Hansen tank valve. I can still screw it on because I made the size of the spray bar so I've got about 5mm clearance from the back of the tank. I would have made it about 30mm longer each way otherwise - but hey, its still good enough!

I am using the same parts for the intakes on the other 2 holes with pressure pipe that goes up about 100mm with an end cap on and various holes drilled around the top.