pH question again

[ripping]

I've had a 100l tank set up for about three weeks. Things are ticking over nicely apart from the demise of a couple of neons and an ancistrus.

Tests done tonight show >pH7.6, 0 Ammonia, 10ppm nitrates, 0 nitrites.

The tap water shows pH value of >7.6 too.

Is there anything I can/should safely do to reduce the pH? I do have some 'pH Down' product that I've used before, but consensus here seems to be NOT to use chemicals to reduce pH. Would that even apply to my high pH? I have an idea its well over 8.0 straight from the tap.

Setup is 100l with Fluval 205. Around 15 plants of different varieties.

8 Neons, 8 lemons, 2 Gouramis, 5 Glass catfish, 2 Kuhli's, 1 pleco. 1 Chinese algae eater, 1 Ancistrus.

[jayci]

I have been told be the LFS guy that Brightwater gravel buffers the water down to 6.8ph.

Maybe some driftwood in the tank can help to buffer down.

[alanmin4304]

Nice tank--what is wrong with 7.6?

[ripping]

Nice tank--what is wrong with 7.6?

probably nothing. but its not 7.6. Its well above that... 8.0, 8.5 9.0?, I really don't know, the pH test kit indicates >7.6. I do know it takes a lot of 'pH down' to get it below 7.6.

[Caryl]

Without something buffering it, the pH will just swing wildly if you add stuff like pH Up or Down and this will be worse for the fish than a steady but high pH. Leave it as the fish seem OK. Driftwood will drop the pH a bit, as will a bag of natural peat tucked behind a rock or in a filter.

[Nicolette]

I have had high ph in my tank too, I have used rain water during water changes to lower it but the down side has been its not as stable. But maybe a mix of rain water and tap water would help lower it stably?

I lost 3 neons as well but the rest are doing better now I have got the ph down to 7.4. Good luck

[SpidersWeb]

I have been told be the LFS guy that Brightwater gravel buffers the water down to 6.8ph.

Maybe some driftwood in the tank can help to buffer down.

You can't buffer water down unfortunately, peat can remove some of the buffering, but not brightwater gravel. Sounds like your local guy wasn't as on to it as we'd like.

As Caryl said, dont' use ph up or down, its more important that your water has a stable pH. If you get a 'High Range pH' tester it'll tell you the proper result. If it's constantly above 8 you'll certainly have a few problems, but hopefully its 7.6-7.8. Also do the test about 24 hours after a partial water change, because tap water needs time to 'age'.

[jayci]

Have to agree with spidersweb. Don't use chemicals to adjust ph. A stable ph is most important.

With your tap water so high it must have a real soapy taste to it.

Maybe go for speices that like high ph.

[ripping]

thanks for all replies.

The tap water tastes ok to me... but then... I'm no water connoisseur either!

I'll look out for a 'high level' pH kit, or more likely a probe to get a better idea of what I've got. Might even phone the council.

Rainwater could be an option, tho would not like to be too dependent on that, esp during summer months.

I do have a smaller tank with a lot of wood in it. I just did a pH test on that and got 7.2. So quite right, the wood does seem to drop the pH, tho it is leaving quite a dark tannin stain to the water. Maybe I could just transfer 1 smaller piece over to see the effect it might have.

My medium term plan is to go with Discus in the bigger tank I've yet to set up. I hope I can manage the conditions to allow that.

[jn]

What type of stone have you got in there?

Found this on the web (http://en.allexperts.com/q/Freshwater-A ... reatly.htm):

Some of the types of rocks that can release minerals and raise your pH (also known as Calcareous rocks) are; Chalk, limestone, Marble, and Tufa, and most rocks whom have several holes are often Calcareous. The holes are caused by the erosion of brittle calcareuous substances within the rock. If you have found your rocks to be unsafe, some calcareous rocks will fizz when vinegar is placed on them and watched if it fizzes, this isn't always a tell-all indication and perhaps the best test is placing it in some water and testing the pH before and a week after placing the rock in.

Keep in mind safe rocks that are inert are Coal, Basalt, Flint, Granite, Sandstone, Quartz, Slate, and lava rock.

Very nice tank by the way !!

[ripping]

What type of stone have you got in there?

not too sure the stones. Most appear to be 'hard' stone, such as granite and a little obsidian, but then I'm no geologist.

Certainly the water going in is high pH (as tested) and the wood in the small tank is only getting it down to 7.2 or so. And I did have the same sort of high reading before using stones in there (or wood).

I'm thinking about using a CO2 system for the bigger tank, so that should knock the pH down a notch or two for that one.

But fishies seem to be doing ok for the moment.

and thankyou..

[jim r]

If your ph IS really high I am surprised that your plants look so healthy.

[ripping]

If your ph IS really high I am surprised that your plants look so healthy.

The illusion of photography mostly. !! I'm still battling algae and decimation from Apple snails.... And many plants in the tank are only a week or two old.

(went shopping at hollywood)