zuri08 Posted February 1, 2012 Report Share Posted February 1, 2012 i just sent down my clown loaches to chris b and 3 of them dead on arrival? what i did was this poly box 2 heat pads wool foam insulation proper bags have never lost a single fish shipping until these :an!gry i got them out into a bucket with there original water then used same tank water and put into 5 individual bags then added 2 clowns a bag except for big ones then i triple bagged them had heat packs on bottom of poly put them in there added some wool to fill in the gaps so they wouldnt fly around everywher if moved and then for more insulation added some insulation foam then taped the lid on tightly and sent them at 5 yesterday my sourier picks them up at just after 5 i cant understand why they would die? did i do something wrong? sent a jag same time and arrived today 8am perfectly fine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanmin4304 Posted February 1, 2012 Report Share Posted February 1, 2012 May not be the answer but I would have put the heatpad (only one) on the top and used oxygen rather than air. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smidey Posted February 1, 2012 Report Share Posted February 1, 2012 sounds like you did everything right to me. i think the most important thing while shipping fish is oxygen, generally fish can handle a bit of a temp decrease. how much air/water was in each bag and how big were the fish that shared a bag? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zuri08 Posted February 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2012 plenty of oxygen in the bags i did the blow in trick smidey so was definelty lots in there it was 2 small in a bag big ones had a bag each and one tiger medium a bag by itself he said that they wernt over heated just at normal temp id say around 26 and loaches like 29 so just dont understand.i only put samll amounts of insulation foam in there just to help fill it in more just absolutely stunned as have never lost a fish and have alwasy done this method Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smidey Posted February 1, 2012 Report Share Posted February 1, 2012 plenty of oxygen in the bags i did the blow in trick smidey so was definelty lots in there it was 2 small in a bag big ones had a bag each and one tiger medium a bag by itself he said that they wernt over heated just at normal temp id say around 26 and loaches like 29 so just dont understand.i only put samll amounts of insulation foam in there just to help fill it in more just absolutely stunned as have never lost a fish and have alwasy done this method how much water was in each bag? one thing having enough air but if there isn't enough water to absorb enough of it for the fish to breath then they are in trouble. I have found that at least 50% water is best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zuri08 Posted February 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2012 yep would have been 45-55% water mate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smidey Posted February 1, 2012 Report Share Posted February 1, 2012 what size is the bag? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zuri08 Posted February 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2012 the bags are 20x30cm mate so decent sized for the loaches they had enough room and enough for oxygen aswell i got these off a breeder who had used these same ones and had shipped thousands of fish in them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smidey Posted February 1, 2012 Report Share Posted February 1, 2012 the bags are 20x30cm mate so decent sized for the loaches they had enough room and enough for oxygen aswell i got these off a breeder who had used these same ones and had shipped thousands of fish in them interesting, i won't use anything smaller than the 300x450 ones i have and the majority of the fish i ship are 4cm or smaller. what length were the clowns? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zuri08 Posted February 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2012 biggest was 12cm id say but wasnt the one that died only the medium sized ones did i have used those nags to send red zebras blue zebras demasoniis electric blues.thats just a rough estimate they might be bigger than that though.there definetly was enough space for them.i have been using these bags all the time and like i said havent lost any so still cant understand why you dont think it was overheating ay smidey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smidey Posted February 1, 2012 Report Share Posted February 1, 2012 biggest was 12cm id say but wasnt the one that died only the medium sized ones did i have used those nags to send red zebras blue zebras demasoniis electric blues.thats just a rough estimate they might be bigger than that though.there definetly was enough space for them.i have been using these bags all the time and like i said havent lost any so still cant understand why you dont think it was overheating ay smidey i have seen tanks at either end of temp range, 13deg to 33deg and the fish didn't die and i doubt the temp got to more than 33. maybe the secret is temp but it made the oxygen release out of the water to fast for the agitation it was getting. from the info you have provided I think the bag was too small for a 12cm clown and it was lack of oxygen due to size or heat or both. we rely on the package being moved to oxygenate the water during the time they are in the bag so maybe it sat still for too long for the amount of water and the amount of oxygen the fish was using inside it. i'm sure that some fish use more oxygen than others so maybe it was a combination of all these factors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zuri08 Posted February 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2012 its so hard to just give a definete answer but they wernt even in there for 24 hours bags arent too small i know there defintely big enough for fish that size that was just a rough geuss.i have shipped over 30 fish over 10cm in them so cant be size smidey.thanks for your help though i dont know waht to do from now on though as we hadnt finished payment only half was paid so? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smidey Posted February 1, 2012 Report Share Posted February 1, 2012 just my thoughts and this is a discussion forum i lost some once so i refunded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrienne Posted February 1, 2012 Report Share Posted February 1, 2012 Its a risk the buyer takes when wanting fish shipped however it is up to you to decide what you want to do. I wonder if they got too hot - its hardly cold at night and if they were too hot the water may have run out of oxygen. By the time they were delivered the temp would have dropped. Then again, maybe they were just too stressed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David R Posted February 1, 2012 Report Share Posted February 1, 2012 Loaches require highly oxygenated water (regardless of the conditions they're "used to"), more so than lake dwelling cichlids, and are more sensitive to stress and deteriorating conditions than most cichlids, especially when they get bigger. Small bag + high temp (less dissolved oxygen) + deteriorating/less than ideal water + sensitive fish could explain why you had problems this time when you haven't in the past. I also think Adrienne could be right about the temp increasing, I've never used them before but I understand heatpads generate a considerable amount of heat in which is why people usually put them on the top of the box so the heat can diffuse throughout the parcel and keep everything warm. If put directly underneath the bag it may have excessively heated the water when first activated then cooled down. Would be interesting to see what temperature the water would get up to with the heat pad sitting directly underneath it in an insulated box. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zuri08 Posted February 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2012 yes i understand that but have shipped 8 skunk loaches overnight exact same methods and pads etc heat pads on top do not work out properly you have to place them on bottom but you cannot put a bag directly over top which is what i do not do anway.well im putting this out there courier cost 62.50 overnight courier at 5.057 kgs heat pads at 6 dollars each.90 was deposited 7 fish were sent and 3 dead on arrival so 4 still left which means i made 17 dollars.i have asked for 40 dollars to cover my costs i think thats fair what do you guys think?please serius unjudged answers as im not happy that my three clowns are dead and i took absouletly all precautions and double checked everything.i know its buyers risk but i am willing to comprimise and take 40 because he only ended up with 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris b Posted February 1, 2012 Report Share Posted February 1, 2012 hi guys and girls we are discussing payment at the moment chris (the seller) said he paid $60 freight. we came to an agreement of $180 including shipping. i have paid $90 and was going to pay the other $90 when they arrived as you know 3 died, chris doesn't expect me to pay the other $90 but would like me to pay $40 for the extra freight do you think i should pay the freight? i said i would pay $20 then i thought id met half way and pay $30 later on how much do you think i should pay what you guys say is what we both agreed on will be paid, anything from 0-60 we are on good speaking terms so this wont get messy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zuri08 Posted February 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2012 have just sorted it out we agreed on thirty.feel really stink about this aye has put me off shipping for good as i did take all precautions but still not good outcome so feel real sorry for the guy as its his sceond time getting clowns sent from auks and didnt make it.sorry chris b Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris b Posted February 1, 2012 Report Share Posted February 1, 2012 thats a good outcome thanks for being so understanding you will see the $30 tomorow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zuri08 Posted February 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2012 no worries mate atleast the other four have gone to a great place i am truly sorry ay it sucks.cheers for being understanding to i hate to lose fish its a real shame &c:ry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkLB Posted February 1, 2012 Report Share Posted February 1, 2012 Nicely sorted, well done guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zuri08 Posted February 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2012 We started off on a bad note about the clowns but just had different ideas and ended up turning out to be a great guy always good when u can sort it out quickly I don't know if I should stop shipping or not? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkLB Posted February 1, 2012 Report Share Posted February 1, 2012 I'd say carry on shipping but maybe stay away from sending Clowns, they sound sensitive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zuri08 Posted February 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2012 yea will definetly stay away from them.cheers mate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrienne Posted February 1, 2012 Report Share Posted February 1, 2012 It also is, from what I have been told, a long haul to get the fish to Timaru ie not a straight flight down there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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