Fat lips evolve at record speed

[Zev]

http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn1 ... speed.html

[Caryl]

Beats using Botox :lol:

[herefishiefishie]

That is an interesting read. We had someone post this up on a local forum here a few days ago. Surprised not many people seemed interested.

Frenchy

[firenzenz]

Yes, very interesting

Raises the question then on how 30 yrs of tank breeding could dictate any species development especially when isolation is enforced upon them.

Would isolated populations of rare fish kept in other countries develop to an extent that within 30-50 yrs they no longer identify and look to breed with each other. And if so, which would be the more valid species as far as experts are concerned?

I think of a situation where importation regulations would mean even though a species could be interbred within NZ it would eventually develop differently to one in Europe.

That is an interesting read. We had someone post this up on a local forum here a few days ago. Surprised not many people seemed interested.

Frenchy

Yes and you face regulatory factors that we don't yet.

[David R]

Would be interesting to see where they got that information from. IIRC the lips are one of the defining features that differentiate A. labiatus from other similar species (particularly A. citrinellus), its not like they are something that has just recently evolved. The whole "midas/red devil" complex is a pretty confusing area given that you have so many different-yet-similar fish living in the lake with nothing but water as a geographic divider, if they were from an african rift lake no doubt we would have a hundred different named varieties with minuscule differences and countless people arguing about names on various internet forums.

I've read that it is usually only wild caught fish that exhibit the big lips, and that F1 captive bred young from fat-lipped parents don't have lips anything like the parents. IIRC I read something on MFK about wild caught specimens lips shrinking in size over time in captivity where they weren't using them as they would in habitat. I wonder if anyone has done any research to prove that they are a hereditary trait, to me the article seems to be more about sensationalism than fact...

[David R]

http://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/forum ... ?p=4152984

Genotype and phenotype are two different things. Just because they don't show them in captive second and third generations doesn't mean the genetics for fat lips aren't there.

That makes me really question the article saying they "evolved" in 100 generations, especially if F2-3 captive bred ones from wild fat-lipped parents will develop the lips if places in an environment that requires them to use them.

[Aquila]

Yes phenotypic plasticity is increadibly strong in numerous fish species...

I worked on a huge project in uni looking at the diversion of a Stickleback's morphology into benthic and pelagic forms, including measuring gill rackers, body morphometrics, etc.

I haven't read the article really thoroughly but I image they were looking at a specific set of genes during the study to make a statement like that.

http://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/forums/showthread.php?p=4152984

That makes me really question the article saying they "evolved" in 100 generations, especially if F2-3 captive bred ones from wild fat-lipped parents will develop the lips if places in an environment that requires them to use them.