chimera Posted July 6, 2004 Report Share Posted July 6, 2004 I have red algae on my rocks :evil: :evil: :evil: that Im not sure if it's a form of deep redish corraline or cyanobacteria. i reduced feeding heaps last time i got an outbreak of the stuff and hardly feed at all (reduced amount and duration by about 1/3) i think it maybe cyano because an area of the substrate (with less water flow than the rest of the tank) looks the same as last time. the only thing different (which i thought should help) was the addition of about 20kg of more live rock. Been researching a bit more about it and found out a couple of interesting facts. Cyanobacteria is the oldest known fossil, over 3.5 billion years old. Also, spirulina (the good old green coloured health drink) is actually a species of cyanobacteria! The rice paddies of Asia, which feed about 75% of the world's human population, could not do so were it not for healthy populations of nitrogen-fixing cyanobacteria in the rice paddy waters (not necessarily the same breed of cyano you get in your tank!) Again, the best philosophy of getting rid of it is physically removing as much as possible from the tank then heaps of partial water changes over a few weeks. Just not 100% sure if it is actually cyano though?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chimera Posted July 12, 2004 Author Report Share Posted July 12, 2004 UPDATE: well it is cyano because there are small bubbles on it which is apparently a good indication. i do have high nitrate levels (20ppm) in my tank, partly to blame because of high stocking levels (soon to be fixed by a larger tank) and partly to blame because of my own negligence in missing a water change. from what i can read, it is "red slime algae", the one type of cyano that does not need nitrates to continue to "grow". so eliminating nitrates (which will obviously help in other areas) may not stop cyano. from researching more, i believe that the problem is due to a combination of problems rather than one problem: high nitrates, lack of water movement and more recently found out, poor lighting. there is plenty of information to suggest that poor lighting will cause cyano outbreaks. again, the new tank will mean ample water flow plus new MH's shortly will solve the lighting issue. Water changes at 30% every week rather than 20% every 2 weeks should keep the tank stable enough til the upgrade. (this has been posted purely to let others know of my findings incase they run into the same issue) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reef Posted July 12, 2004 Report Share Posted July 12, 2004 that is a high nitrate level. How high is you phostphate level?? What is on your tank? , how mant fish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pies Posted July 12, 2004 Report Share Posted July 12, 2004 I have 2ppm Nitrates, 0 Phosphates and my water quality is 'spot on'. Water changes are regular. My system has over 1100 litres of water in it. Well lit and very well circulated. I too have Cyno in both tanks (none in sump). Everything is very healthy, the skimmer has recently been upgraded from an APF850 to an APF902 which removes almost a litre of skimate every week. As a side note, when we were diving in Fiji I saw Cyno EVERYWHERE, accross the sand, on the rocks, between some corals. So I have decided to just leave it and call it a 'natural ocurance'. I will not be trying to intervien again in regards to cyno. YMMV. Chimera - I am glad you can tell the difference between Cyno and Corline Algae. Pie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reef Posted July 12, 2004 Report Share Posted July 12, 2004 cyno normally appears in tanks that use natural sea water for some reason. I have had a very small amout of cyno in a few spots some time ago but this was due to overfeeding the fish. do you use natural seawater??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chimera Posted July 12, 2004 Author Report Share Posted July 12, 2004 tank is overstocked and i know that, it was when i bought it 2nd hand, hence the upgrade to the larger tank as i dont want to get rid of the (9 fish and 3 shrimps) i currently have. phosphates are low, about 0.5ppm according to the salifert test. they *were* higher about a month ago but I put phosorb (i think thats what it's called) next to the skimmer. cyano is a very natural occurence everywhere and it is actually quite interesting reading about it. i dont mind if i have a bit of cyano in the tank, i just dont want it to start to take over the tank. pies - the reason why i wasnt sure if it was cyano or not is that some of my LR has a very dark red corraline on it, very similar colour to the cyano. the test was to scrape it off, cyano came off easy the other stuff was stuck like glue. from what i've read, IMHO once you have cyano, you can never get rid of it, ever. it will stay away in the right conditions but as soon as anythings go downhill, it comes out like a hooker at a stag party. and yes, I use NSW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reef Posted July 12, 2004 Report Share Posted July 12, 2004 .5ppm is not low phostphates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chimera Posted July 12, 2004 Author Report Share Posted July 12, 2004 ooops, i meant 0.20. i realise that 0.10 is critical and 0.25 coral growth is retarded according to the test kit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reef Posted July 12, 2004 Report Share Posted July 12, 2004 dont use natural sea water, it will go away if you use synthetic salt water. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chimera Posted July 12, 2004 Author Report Share Posted July 12, 2004 i tested the NSW before i did a water change on saturday. it read 0ppm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reef Posted July 12, 2004 Report Share Posted July 12, 2004 cyno will go away if you dont use natural seawater// Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pies Posted July 12, 2004 Report Share Posted July 12, 2004 I honestly don't belive it has anything to do with ASW/NSW as there are dozens of people on UR/RC with Cyno who use saltmix. Remember the majority of people here use NSW so its a bit hard to draw conculsions, only Alois and Layton on saltmix (anyone else?). Chimera - I completely disagree about your comments on cyno being there forever. How long have you had your tank? My cyno was there at the start of my tank, then disapeared for about 9 months then came back, and its definitly in recession again now. I am 100% confident that within the next few weeks I will have none again. I am also 100% confident that it may come back again at some stage. Phosphates should be 0. Piemania Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reef Posted July 12, 2004 Report Share Posted July 12, 2004 people that use natural seawater do have cyno to a degree. they are, mark, nick,steve.chris.chimera, anyone else i missed. i cant comment on the guys on RC as i have not seen there tank specs. steve atkins had cyno until he use synthetic salt water. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chimera Posted July 12, 2004 Author Report Share Posted July 12, 2004 pies - just because you cant see it, doesn't mean it's not there. it is interesting to note also that the slime you "see" is not the actual algae or cyanobacteria, but what they exsude. very good article on eradicating cyano: http://netclub.athiel.com/cyano/cyanos2.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reef Posted July 12, 2004 Report Share Posted July 12, 2004 In the greater majority of cases the nutrients these algae thrive on is dissolved organic material. That is why when using natural seawater you have a high chance of getting cyno. Protein skimmer can not remove everything. Chimera, see if you can extend your budget for a month and buy some salt. Be interested to see if the cyno goes after one month using synthetic salt water. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chimera Posted July 12, 2004 Author Report Share Posted July 12, 2004 ok, i will give it a whirl just as an experiment. will change water with ASW this weekend. reading maybe biased though as i dosed a small amount of anti-red to help reduce cyano until i get water chemistry back on track (pies = :evil: ) i think i will end up getting a larger protein skimmer at some stage too so if anyone's in the market for a deltec 1060 (in-sump, rated to 1,000 litres) let me know!!! it does work very well, am just thinking it might not be sufficient when i go to 1,000 litres as most articles mention getting a skimmer rated for double your tank size... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pies Posted July 13, 2004 Report Share Posted July 13, 2004 I am confused. You are worried about Cyno being there even if your can't see it? Who cares! It will be present (or could become present) in any tank, like algae, coal, fish or anythig else, if the conditions are right it will thrive, if not it won't. I don't belive you can eradicate it to a point that if the conditions are right it won't be present. Its always there, waiting... Dosing anti-red... Pies Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chimera Posted July 13, 2004 Author Report Share Posted July 13, 2004 no, im saying you cant completely eradicate it - and you just reiterated my original point, "it's always there, waiting". spawn of satan that stuff. errr,... yeah, anti-red :oops: did a half dose and all seems well so far... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetskisteve Posted July 13, 2004 Report Share Posted July 13, 2004 don't forget unless yr on tank water like REEF you will need to mix your salt wth rodi :-? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chimera Posted July 13, 2004 Author Report Share Posted July 13, 2004 yeah will do. will post results after the weekend!!! got plumbing to do this weekend too, argh, a busy one! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pies Posted July 13, 2004 Report Share Posted July 13, 2004 Interesting that its 3:11pm here now yet you posted at 4:03pm. FREAKY! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pies Posted July 13, 2004 Report Share Posted July 13, 2004 The boards clocks off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ira Posted July 13, 2004 Report Share Posted July 13, 2004 The board's clock is fine, you just need to adjust your profile's time zone to account for daylight savings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pies Posted July 13, 2004 Report Share Posted July 13, 2004 But its normally correct. hrmmm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lduncan Posted July 13, 2004 Report Share Posted July 13, 2004 Remember the majority of people here use NSW so its a bit hard to draw conculsions, only Alois and Layton on saltmix (anyone else?). I've never seen any cyano in my tank, ever. So maybe there is something to the NSW vs. saltmix theory. Layton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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