dude Posted April 19, 2007 Report Share Posted April 19, 2007 hey guys first of all just wanna say you guys have amazing tanks iv been looking through and all the people on here are good at marine aquariums its amazing i dont know how u guys do it , i have been inspired and want to start a marine tank up iv been keeping tropical freshwater fish for about 3 years now and have wanted to do this for sometime but been put off cos i keep hearing how hard it is to get a tank going and maintaining it so thought i get my feet wet with a tropical tank first, this is what i already have (from old freshwater setup i had) for the set up and need to know what else i need 25gallon tank aquaone cf1200 canister filter 150w heater 2 lights with 2 bulbs in each themometre i know i need a protien skimmer and came across this one on trademe seems to be a good one can handle up to 100gallons http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing ... d=96593616 some info on the skimmer http://www.marineland.com/products/cons ... sclone.asp so what else do i need its gonna be fish only until i get more experience with marine tanks and i am only looking at keepin 2 or 3 fish only as i dont wanna over load a small tank Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidb Posted April 19, 2007 Report Share Posted April 19, 2007 dude if i was you i would get rid of the external filter and use lots of live rock to filter your tank. coz we all say our first tank is gonna be a fish only but end up getting a couple of easy corals and will end up needing a decent skimmer. why not buy now rather than buying twice? what lighting are you using? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeBlog Posted April 20, 2007 Report Share Posted April 20, 2007 I have an RSM (I think it's 24 gallons) tank and use a Deltec MC500. It does a GREAT job!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockerpeller Posted April 20, 2007 Report Share Posted April 20, 2007 lol thats my skimmer i'm selling. its ok but like davidb said, you'll always want more out of a marine tank besides fish. IMO i'd save for a skimmer that can handle way more then what your aiming at. although the skimmer i have now would be good for a FO tank, just think of what the future might bring, ie Coral, shrimp, etc. i have no clue what my skimmer will handle as i've never used it... (Edit) that is besides what all the sites are saying it can handle. no 1st hand experience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warren Posted April 20, 2007 Report Share Posted April 20, 2007 Dude to consideration of the Trademe Section rules, a slight oversight and a consequential ammendment to the rules, this thread has been restored to it's original state and unlocked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dude Posted April 21, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 21, 2007 thanks warren sorry about the TM link wont happen again, thanks for unlocking it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warren Posted April 21, 2007 Report Share Posted April 21, 2007 Please check the guidelines regarding Trademe Links. They can be added to a post as you originally did as long as it's not your own personal Trademe auction you are promoting. Questions about someone elses auction can be asked and links to an auction of interest are allowed. The guidelines have been ammended to reflect this. The only change is personal Trademe auction links must now go into the Trademe Links area... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted April 21, 2007 Report Share Posted April 21, 2007 As stated above it's best if you don't use the cannister filter for biological filtration. This is because they process ammonia and nitrite, but not nitrate, so using one can result in more nitrate than is good for a marine tank. They should really just be for fresh water tanks. Instead, you use liverock, which is porous, and will deal with nitrate also. As to skimmers, in some ways this can be regarded as your most important piece of equipment. In amongst all the gunge it skims from your water, are phosphates, heavy metals, and other nasties that are not removed by the normal nitrogen cycle. You should get the best skimmer possible. One of the things I've noticed in recent years, is that people are starting out, and within a few months sometimes have a tank that 10 or 15 years ago would have been regarded as world class, but now reasonably commonplace. IMO a big part of the reason for this is the much better skimmers available now. Not cheap though, but once you have a good one it will last you for life. Plus if you want to sell, the good brands do not lose much value as there is little to wear out on them. And lights, if / when you get a few corals, the type of lighting is important. In a fish only it does not matter, but nobody stays fish only! :lol:, what kind do you have? One more thing, a phenomena exists in reefkeeping, that there are certain rules you should follow to achieve success. But you will also find people breaking every one of them and still being successful! So every time you ask a question you will get several different answers, and often they will all be right, there is more than one way to skin a cat. But when you are learning, following certain basics such as good skimmer, no cannister, liverock filtration, among others will give you the best chance at success. And one thing often overlooked, every reef keeper should have a reverse osmosis deionising water purifier, to process your top off water. These can be bought for somewhere around the $300ish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dude Posted April 21, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 21, 2007 well i might be getting a deltec mce300 soon if things go as planned, how do u get live rock i was told this takes along time and cant be bought but read in books that LFSs should keep them, how much would i need in a tank thats about 120ltrs, is it just corals that have nitrogen cycling bacteria growing on it or something completely different, thanks for ur help guys ill read through the forum for more info on this i wanna know as much before i even fill the tank with water Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilson Posted April 21, 2007 Report Share Posted April 21, 2007 i know a few shops in chch that sell live rock but thats no help to you sorry good luck with finding some try looking on trade me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidb Posted April 21, 2007 Report Share Posted April 21, 2007 pm'ed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrienne Posted April 21, 2007 Report Share Posted April 21, 2007 Hey dude, never had a marine aquarium ever but if I was you and was wanting good live rock I'd ask in the buy and sell section on this forum first. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evilknieval69 Posted April 21, 2007 Report Share Posted April 21, 2007 Hey dude. I would suggest joining up at the marine forum - http://www.nzmas.co.nz There's heaps of very knowledgable marine guys there who will be able to find you some live rock for sure! Good luck with your tank! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dude Posted April 22, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 22, 2007 thanks guys uv been very helpfull, ill be on the marine website soon just havn some regitration problems lol, cant wait to get it all goin very excited Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TM Posted April 22, 2007 Report Share Posted April 22, 2007 Hey dude. I would suggest joining up at the marine forum - http://www.nzmas.co.nz There's heaps of very knowledgable marine guys there who will be able to find you some live rock for sure! Good luck with your tank! what and there are none here? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evilknieval69 Posted April 22, 2007 Report Share Posted April 22, 2007 Nope, i didnt say that Just that there is heaps of very knowledgable guys there, who dont visit here very often, if at all. There are still some very knowledgable guys here, but not many Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lduncan Posted April 22, 2007 Report Share Posted April 22, 2007 This is the marine forum. ( quality over quantity comes to mind ;-) ) Here's my thoughts on setting up a tank. Sell the canister filter, and get a REALLY good skimmer. A skimmer is the single most important piece of equipment. Looking around you'll probably find a whole lot of info around biological filtration, ignore it. I think there is far too much emphasis placed on biofiltration. Concentrate on mechanical filtration (skimmer) and leave the biofiltration portion to do what it does (you don't have much control over what bacteria do). Deltec will have higher resale value than generic chinese brands, which may be something to consider when choosing one. Don't be too worried about getting "live" rock. Often there is not a lot of benefit in starting a tank with it over just dry rock. Sometimes it can just be a hindrance. I prefer to start from dry rock. I would always recommend cooking rock both dry or live, as more often than not it comes loaded with P (hmm, "cooking rock", "P", could give some the wrong idea). Anyway "cooking rock" is a specific method for cycling rock. Basically you put it in containers of saltwater, in the dark, and let it sit. Bacteria in the rock grow and feed off the nutrients within it. As the grow and multiply, the push themselves out of the rock (like a cake rising out of a cake tin.) The gravity takes over and the bacteria which are squeezed out fall to the bottom of the containers as bacterial floc, taking with them the nutrients they've used. Periodically the rock is dunked and swished in containers of clean saltwater to dislodge any buildup of the bacterial detritus and to replace the fowled water with new water which keeps the process going efficiently. The keys to cooking rock are keeping the water clean, dunking and swishing, keeping it in the dark so that the bacteria dominates and uses the nutrients instead of algae. There's a long thread about it here: http://thereeftank.com/forums/showthread.php?t=66551 When done properly and fully, you won't have the "progression of alage" which many people say is normal for setting up a tank... it doesn't have to be the case. Also, you don't need a lot of it to do the job you need it to. Most tanks you'll see loaded with rock, but most of it just ends up being bioload. Try and get light, porous rock. These are the two most important aspects to get right from the start. Layton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evilknieval69 Posted April 22, 2007 Report Share Posted April 22, 2007 Post Removed. Evil.. take this as a warning. If you are out to cause problems, then your antics will not be tollerated here. Bill Mod. Well im sorry bill, but i am not out to cause problems, and i dont see where my post broke the rules. I have sent you a PM. Please put my post back how it was Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dude Posted April 22, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 22, 2007 can this cooking procees be done with rock just bought from the shop as in dry and not been in water for awhile or does it have to have some sort of growth on it before the cooking process can take place, so all i gotta do is get some buckets and mix up a batch of aquarium water add the rock with a warmer and pump to oxygenate the water and leave it in the dark coverd for about a week and then remove and rinse in salt water and put them in new water and just repeat the process until hardly any stuff comes out of the rocks and settles at the bottom and then i can put it in a newly set up tank and cycle or should the tank be cycled before rock is added Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lduncan Posted April 22, 2007 Report Share Posted April 22, 2007 Yeah, just use dry rock. Don't need to add anything else, just put it in saltwater. There will be some form of dry dead life on it which will kickstart the process, so you don't need to add anything else. But sounds like you got the basis of it. The dunking and swishing is an important part which some people overlook. The cooking process is a cycling process. It's just done in a specific way which favours bacteria over algae, which allows the rock to be purged of nutrients so that when you add it to a tank with lights, you don't get outbreaks of algae. So you take your cooked rock, put in the tank filled with new saltwater, and then you're good to start adding fish slowly. You don't have to wait for any sort of cycle after adding cooked rock to a tank of new saltwater. Layton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dude Posted April 22, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 22, 2007 cool, this process takes some time so i might get some on wednesday and get some buckets out and get this started just for more info do i need to have a heater in there to keep the rocks at the same temp and salinity as the tank is goin to be, so after this is all done (how long will it take anyway??) i can put water in the tank get it up to temp and skimmer going add the cooked rock and start adding fish straight away or should i wait a week or so after the rocks have been added Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lduncan Posted April 22, 2007 Report Share Posted April 22, 2007 Have a quick look here, it might answer some questions: http://www.fnzas.org.nz/fishroom/cookin ... 19975.html In short, higher temp = faster cooking, lower temp = slower cooking Many of the bacteria involved are relatively insensitive to salinity. So cooking will work in freshwater, but you'll have to up the salinity slowly to tank salinity over a period of time so you don't shock the bacteria. But I really think it's preferable to have parameters match tank parameters as close as possible. i can put water in the tank get it up to temp and skimmer going add the cooked rock and start adding fish straight away or should i wait a week or so after the rocks have been added You can do it straight away (the rocks have a population of bacteria you need to detoxify ammonia and nitrite etc). But you still have to add fish slowly, to give the system time to adjust to the increased bioload. You can fill the tank and break in the skimmer while the rock is cooking too. Layton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dude Posted April 22, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 22, 2007 cool thanks to everyone who helped out i think i got most of the info i needed to get the tank started gonna buy some rocks soon and will get them cooking as soon as i get them, tank will arrive in about a week or 2 and the skimmer will also be here soon, excellent this is getting very exciting my first marine tank is now finally underway Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evilknieval69 Posted April 22, 2007 Report Share Posted April 22, 2007 Dude, if you want to you could buy rock which is already cycled, meaning you dont need to go through the whole cooking process. The advantage of getting live rock is you dont have to wait, and you can get some cool added extras, possibly some free corals which have hitchhiked! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petplanet Posted April 22, 2007 Report Share Posted April 22, 2007 Dude, if you want to you could buy rock which is already cycled, meaning you dont need to go through the whole cooking process. The advantage of getting live rock is you dont have to wait, and you can get some cool added extras, possibly some free corals which have hitchhiked! I think this is a great thing to do IF you are experienced and know what you are doing. To many people want to take what appears to be an easy short cut when setting up their tank. There is an awful lot to learn and going through, and fully understanding the cycling process is an important step. If you rush starting a tank you are heading for disaster. Patience is the best thing you can have. Stock you tank slowly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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