Stella

yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes!!!!!! :bounce: Don't know what the mods would think, but I would love it Could include native marine too. Stella

I have only just found this thread thanks to this other natives thread: http://www.fnzas.org.nz/fishroom/viewto ... 202#246202 yay for natives! First I shall copy and paste what I said there about mudfish so I don't need to repeat myself

Regarding mudfish, from what I have been able to gather from DoC there are no individually protected native fish outside of the details I posted above. Mudfish are an interesting case. They are often presumed to be more rare than they actually are, due to being harder to catch or something. In certain areas they are very populous, in other areas they are severely threatened or locally extinct. They live in wetlands, which are very threatened overall. With collecting them from the wild, you *can* but it may not be ethical or legal. Ethical where they are locally rare or threatened, and legal if their habitat is protected. A lot of the wetlands they are found in decent numbers are protected, therefore illegal to take anything from them. Personally, for my book on keeping native fish, I have chosen not to include mudfish, due to the above considerations. As to keeping them in aquaria, apparently they do make good inhabitants, but their requirements are quite different to other natives, and, apart from a couple of bully species, they really have their own little habitat niche to themselves (thus single-species aquarium). As a side note, I do not know a lot about them and may be barking up the wrong tree with something above, but due to not knowing, I suggest leaving them alone. But the *very exciting* part is I have been asked by some people at massey to breed brown mudfish for a translocation/restoration project (part of someone's masters thesis), all costs covered!!!! :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce:

Mine are at 13 degrees, though I could have sworn it was 3 degrees after spending a while up to my bicep in it trying to scrape algae (eftpos cards are brilliant algae scrapers!!!). Those tropical owners don't know how good they have got it! I have been looking over my power bills since January. Latest bill was $60, peak of summer it was $80..... the difference is in not cooling my fishtank!!! (I had a fan and a chiller, um and I think that month I managed to leave the freezer partly open for over 24 hours....) (oh and no I don't have gas, that is my whole power bill..... I'm very scottish and cheap....) The native fish lab at massey is apparently in an air-conditioned room of 12 degrees year round. I wouldn't worry about fish getting too cold unless it got to 5 degrees or less for a long period. Oh, Caryl, you mentioned pond fish basking at the surface then diving into cold water. Very good point, only I wonder if it should really only be applied to still-water fish? My natives are from swift streams and rivers where there would be little opportunity for such changes. Hmmm..... but don't they say sudden temperature changes can cause swim-bladder issues for goldfish? Too many thoughts at once.... Stella

Hey Caryl, now that you have got me thinking about articles for your journal, what about compiling a list from this thread for the journal? You know... I really ought to join so I get it..... Stella

Hi Alex, Where do you see that mudfish are protected and thus illegal to keep? Stella

An old expired eftpos card for cleaning algae off the glass without scratching it. I have had ongoing scratched glass issues and finally I have a method I know is not going to harm it. No risk of it picking up bits of grit for me to scrub into the glass!! Not only that but it is a MIRACLE algae remover. Takes everything off, even stuff I had long ago given up on ever getting off. Two swipes and it is gone Stella

I gave up keeping plants in my native tank. Without any algae eaters (no native ones) they just get covered in algae and go icky and die. I find it looks so much more natural anyway. Most of our streams don't have plants, which is the habitat I am going for. However I am cultivating some nice flowing green algae which is spreading in a carpet on my larger rocks and adding some nice green to the look. The long flowing algae gets annoying, grows so fast and gets ratty, but the short stuff makes a lovely lawn Apparently native plants can often be found in garden centres in hte pond section. Stella

yup, pretty much, and ONLY put them back where they came from, never a different stream (even if it is more convenient for you) Pegasus, I could write something simple about it to go somewhere.... Here the answer is buried on page three following a lot of 'it is (partly) illegal' posts.... Don't know the best way to do it. (I am writing a book on how to keep these guys in tanks, which is why I needed to know what the law really was. It took a lot of badgering of poor DoC people as it is confusing even for them. So I am pretty confident it is correct now.) Stella

I have posted the information a here number of times on what the legalities are regarding keeping natives. I can't be bothered writing out the plain English version again. so here is the technical version from someone I know in DoC. I have passed it through several DoC fish specialists who have confirmed this is accurate: *** Well there is no legislation that prevents people taking native freshwater fish for aquariums from a 'normal' (e.g., unprotected) river/stream/wetland etc. However there are some controls such as: if it is DOC land e.g, a national park or reserve then there will be collection restrictions and will require DOC permission. In terms of transfer to another waterbody, s26ZM of the Conservation Act requires that any live aquatic life that is to be transfered into freshwater (defined as a waterbody that is a natural waterway or has connections with a natural waterway, including during flooding etc) requires permission. If the aquatic life does not already exist in the waterbody then DOC approval is required. If the aquatic life does already exist then Minister of Fisheries approval is required. If you are shifting aquatic life between the North and South Islands then you will need an Inter-Island transfer permit from Minister of Fisheries. The right to take koura (and any other indigenous fish) from Lake Taupo is reserved exclusively to Tuwharetoa iwi and only the Tuwharetoa Maori Trust Board may authorise their sale (Maori Land Amendment and Maori Land Claims Adjustment Act 1926). If it's outside the Tuwharetoa rohe, then taking of koura by any person for non-commercial purposes is legal under the Freshwater Fisheries Regulations. There are provisions under the Conservation Act for the D-G to impose conditions or prohibit fishing for koura (s.26ZL). But if the stream is on private property, ie has no legal public access in or beside it, then the landowners could exercise de facto control of koura fishing by limiting access for only those activities they allowed. *** Stella

Well, I tried the credit card thing (found an ancient forgotten flybuys card). It is a miracle!!! I have problems with brown, blue-green and green-dot algae and it was getting a little rampant before the last water change. Brown and blue green come off easily of course, but the card gathers them into chunks so it can be removed from the tank easily. The green dot stuff is completely gone in two swipes of the card! (zip-zap! I do actually encourage flowing algae (beard algae?) it is nice and green and lush, forming carpets on my rocks, but unfortunately had left some very tough brown residue on the back wall which wouldn't come off with scrubbing. All gone in a flash with the card! Such a relief finding something I know wont hide nasty bits of grit to scratch my glass further with, and it even works better than everything else I had tried! Thanks

Very much so! Notably my kokopu. Whoever said they liked *slow* water?! The thing I forgot to say in my first post was that all my fish are wild caught, most within the last year, so it is not like water changes (or humans for that matter) have been going on their whole lives.

When I do water changes sometimes I swear the fish seem to enjoy the excitement of something different happening in the tank! The bullies get really, really, annoyingly curious. I often have to stop and shoo them away and have caught them in the vacuum before. The kokopu just seem to get really excited, but quite different from when scared (like avoiding a net). All my fish (natives) eat invertebrates so it is not like I am stirring up food for them. Has anyone else found similar things with their fish while doing water changes etc? Stella

THAT IS BRILLIANT!!!!! At least with a credit card you wouldn't be at risk of getting grit caught in it that you couldn't see. I have scratched up my tank horribly, it was pure and clean when I got it, despite being second hand. I have no idea which method scratched it (scouring pad, magnetic cleaner, handful of soft net cloth, piece of cotton cloth) or if it was the gravel being moved against it when I have had to move the tank several times. Stella

Yay! Someone else discovering our native aquatic animals! Crays are great fun. Do a search, there are several threads about them here. In the wild they are 95% vegetarian, and largely feed off 'allocthonic detritus", basically stuff that falls into the stream. Mine adore frozen peas and go nuts for the bloodworm I feed my native fish. Try him with a variety of veges, mine have also liked cucumber, green beans and corn. Keep a little pot of things in the freezer for convenience. Some can be picky, you will soon work out what they like. Make sure there are lot of hiding places. Stack up rocks to make caves. Crays are very timid (the 'mini-tank' look is defensive, not aggressive). However they will happily eat fish if they can grab them (thankfully their eyesight is not good), so if you have fish with him be careful with sizes. They are good escape artists, can climb and swim with sharp tail-kicks. Make sure you have a really good lid! Legality: there is a lot of myth and confusion. I pestered lots of various DoC staff and others and eventually came up with the following *rough* guide: you can take native fish (and crays) for aquaria, but may not move them to a different waterway without permits. You may not take native fish or koura from the Lake Taupo area unless you are part of a certain iwi. You may not take them from reserves or conservation land. Stella

someone did suggest using one as a tie clip!

Ok, so it is a kind of odd topic, but there seem to be a few native fish people in this forum... I found these native fish brooches - very beautiful and unusual http://picasaweb.google.com/stellamcq/N ... 2367200130 They are from The Vault gallery in Wellington. I have bought the koaro (top). From top to bottom: Koaro, copper, 6cm, $82 Inanga, copper, 5.5cm, $74 Canturbury Mudfish, silver, 6cm, $106 I saw them a while back and couldnt remember which one I liked the most, so she couriered me one of each so I could choose! Edit, Alan. Please email or PM the poster for the email addy of the manufacturer, thanks I hope this isn't some kind of illegal post, just something I thought others might like. Stella

Cool tanks guys! It is so good seeing other people doing native thanks. I am rather obsessed with native freshwater fish (see the photos in the link in my signature). Native rockpool would be so cool. Damnit..... I shouldn't have read this thread.... I really DON'T need to get into native marine!! Thankfully the sea is very very far away and I don't have a car. (BTW: with chilling I note only ice and chillers have been mentioned. Something against using a fan? I have used a fan on my 220litre tank all summer with great success, just left it on all the time. I gave up on the chiller, not enough grunt and the fan was coping. Admittedly temps were 20-22 degrees without supplementary occasional ice, but I am impressed with the fan.)

who is you? if it is me, check out my signature or here http://picasaweb.google.com/stellamcq/NZNativeFish (though I understand it doesnt show them if you are not logged in or something... though you would have had to log in to post...) I have just changed it to my picasaweb page, prefer that to photobucket. Stella

I have natives (inanga, banded and giant kokopu, various bullies and a few crays) A chiller is useful but there are other ways of chilling a tank. It is fairly critical for most natives to have something keeping the temperature down. A really well-fitting lid is definitely needed for all species of natives. Even the bottom dwelling bullies wind up on the wrong side of the glass far too easily (albeit largely accidentally, the other species are hell bent on escaping). Yay for natives, my obsession, Stella

Mmm, it is, much better than lugging buckets, but rather annoying if there is only one of you and you have to run a stupidly long course to get between the tap and the tank. Especially if you did something dumb and the water has to go off RIGHT NOW as it is currently cascading onto the carpet... yet again. Still, yay for hoses and mains pressure Stella

Hey, that sounds like it might work for me.... can you get those? Any idea of how much? Or even what they are called? Could even have a generic garden hose thing to screw on the current one without a 'double adapter'. Would involve unscrewing and rescrewing each time, but a LOT more convienient than running outside all the time, especially over winter. The other two sinks in my house have those generic kitchen taps with the lever on top (no screw tap), so no convienient spout to shove something on. Are the bits and pieces everyone is talking about designed for screw taps or lever taps? (it does change the amount of 'shoving on' you can do). I feel a trip to Bunnings coming on... Using the garden tap is about as annoying as lugging buckets. Stella

thanks for the interest They haven't arrived yet. Nearly time. Rather nervous actually! I have only shown the book to a friend (andrew broome, who is on here) and now I am showing it to EXPERTS!!! Scary. Of course this morning I started doing a massive edit (a word here, a comma there) so it might be a few days before I let them have a copy to read properly. Somehow I don't think these sort of things are ever *finished*, you can edit forever! Stella

what, you mean you don't have three multiboards, an extension cord and two double adapters running off the same powerpoint??? (my house is slightly scary, electrically....) Stella

yeah I have two crayfish in two tanks. My first cray was huge, well, 10cm, and became bit of a menace. I lost three of my four uplands (the only bullies I had at the time) over two months. THing is I think I lost all the males, and it was geting into spring, so I think they were nesting and easier for him to pick off. Still gutted, they were becoming rather pretty fish. Then he decided to climb out on a hot day.... Then I got a smaller cray.... am guessing 7cm at the most. And now have a teeny tiny cray, perhaps an inch long. He is so cute! They are a risk, particularly after they catch their first fish... A deep tank makes them a bit safer. Do you have pics of your tank? I always love seeing other native tanks! Stella