sharn Posted February 26, 2006 Report Share Posted February 26, 2006 hello all getting my a into g on my planting. this weekend coming i will be putting a plant growing substrate (plain old aquatic mix ok for this?) on the bottom covered by sand. i will be getting a double light hood thingie so i can have two tubes running (will need to get the tubes unless the ones i have now are ok) and will be dosing with flourish excel and if i need the plant balls that go near the roots i can get them too. few questions now 1: how often do i dose with flourish? it says on the bottle every day and the man in the shop said i could only do water changes once every few weeks (i would be doing 25% or so every 2-3 days for the discus and rams for their nitrates and clean water). if i cant do my water changes without adding heaps more i wont use it as it would be too costly after a while. 2: whats the best under sand substrate for plants, im not wanting to go spend hundreds on it so is that aquatic mix ok? its nice and cheap too also how thick of each without the sand going off? 3: two lights enough? i have just got a amazon sword today, some small plant (dont know how to upload pics from my puter) and some more val. got camboma and java fern already in there but will be adding more. what specific tubes/brands do you reccomend? the lights i own now are... phillips TLD 36W/84 NEL FL40SSBR/37-HC, Tri phosphor T8, 37W (pretty old) OSRAM 36W/11-860, lumilux plus eco daylight with the system im running what other plants do you reccomend, id prefer something not overly hard :oops: thanks to all in advance, bit nervous about all this plant business so any tips would be appreciated Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kookie Posted February 26, 2006 Report Share Posted February 26, 2006 IMHO, you would be just fine with sand as your base. Also, you could do away with the flourish and just use bio balls if you really wanted something. I've found the best booster for my plants are plenty of fish and good lighting. what are the dimensions of your tank? If it's not too huge, i can't see why two lights the length of the tank wouldn't be enough. I've seen mention about day glow/ aqua glow lights on this forum, maybe if you search lights you will find some good info. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharn Posted February 26, 2006 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2006 the tanks a 230L, standard 4 foot, 38cm wide and 42cm tall. im probably going to end up using the bioballs if i have to keep dosing with flourish because of my water changes, thanks for your reply and ill go do my light search now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanksman Posted February 26, 2006 Report Share Posted February 26, 2006 Hey Sharn I wouldn't put the cabomba in there. It is a messy looking plant that never seems to look quite right with the amazons IMHO. The Val is a tall spreading plant that will fit in better. Chuck out the cabomba and find a few more crypts or echnydoris sp? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plantman Posted February 26, 2006 Report Share Posted February 26, 2006 the tanks a 230L, standard 4 foot, 38cm wide and 42cm tall. im probably going to end up using the bioballs if i have to keep dosing with flourish because of my water changes, thanks for your reply and ill go do my light search now the size of your tank will give you a rough estimated need of lighting. lighting are measure by wattage and kelvin. the wattage determine the strenght and the kelving determine the colour of your light. some brand do not measure in kelvin but by Lumilux (not sure of spelling). and some does not said at all. 6,500 kelvin is the best as it closely resemble the sunlight. 10,000 kelvin is pinknish in colour and i think 8,000 is blue. (someone correct me if i am wrong). for wattage, Amano provided guide line such as 2.5 to 3 watt \s for every 4 litres of water. so if you have 230 litre of water, you will need to have at least around 140 wattage of light. this all is to simulate enought sun light for your plant to grow BUT if you do not have enough plant in your tank, you will also be encouraging algae to grow as well (which you do not want). so you need to made sure you have at least half your tank cover on the ground with plant. i strongly suggest that you put the old but going tube aside. you are introducing new plants into your tank and they are trying to establish themselve. their roots needs to develop (thus the needs for root ball fertliser). once your plant is well establish (every little new plant introduction), you can use back your old tude if you want but suggest that you do not use it other than just for lighting purpose. Flourish is for the leave to grow healthy. if you do not want daily dosage, you can dose if on the alternate day but calculate your dosage properly. your plant will either die or your algae will grow. for lighting tube, they are only good for the first six months. this is useful if your are planting new plants. if you see that the plannt is developing new shoots, you will be fine. keep those weekly water changes, it is crucial. i do not know why the LFS said once a efw week. (i would be doing 25% or so every 2-3 days for the discus and rams for their nitrates and clean water). that will be good as it keeps your PH leveled and the water fresh for the plant as well. all the best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharn Posted February 26, 2006 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2006 thankyou very much, now i know what to base my light buying on hehe, must go out this weekend and get a new tube then, dont want to start kill them as soon as i get them! hopefully i have enough cash to get a nwe tube, the sand (cheap as) and the aquatic mix (if i need it) plus some of the root balls. its going to be one hell of a long weekend thats for sure :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiverJohn Posted February 26, 2006 Report Share Posted February 26, 2006 Hi Sharn, Plantman has pretty much covered it all... Couple of things thou Kelvin is the "temperature" of the light and, in most cases gives you an indication of the colour of the light. EG: 4200K is orange tint (something like a "warm white" tube), 6-7000K is quite a "brillient white" such as a daylight tube, and closely approximates daylight. 8000K is still white but is developing a blue tint, by the time you get to 10,000+K you are really starting to get into the blues that the marine chappies use. Plantman refers to "lumilux" this is a brand name - sorry plant man . But he is refering to "lumens" or "lux" which relates to the amount of light the tube puts out, and this in most cases, for normal colour tubes, this related to the wattage of the tube. Higher wattage (longer tube) gives you more light. There is also the colour rendering index of the tube (CRI). This relates to the quality of the light produced. Typically you have a choice between cri of 80+ or 90+. Where ever you can go for the 90+ HTH John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanmin4304 Posted February 27, 2006 Report Share Posted February 27, 2006 The amount of light required actually has little to do with the number of litres. It has more to do with the depth and clarity of the water, the time the lights are on and the type and establishment of plant. If you pour in too much light before the plants can utilize it you will cultivate algae big time. When the plants are established they will do well with lots of light and beat the algae to the nutrient. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharn Posted February 27, 2006 Author Report Share Posted February 27, 2006 well the tanks 42cm high and the water is very clear. all these plants will be getting introduced over a period of weeks i suppose. will have quite a few of the 'easier' swords, some grassy looking sword for the foreground, val and any other plants that will grow well with my tank :lol: im not trying too hard to stick to the amazon theme but do want plants that grow well in those conditions. the lights are on from the time i wake up (10am, yeah i know i sleep in lol) till around 11pm... algae doesnt bother me too much as long as its only the green stuff that grows on the glass and can get scrubbed off. wow, all these CRI's and Kelvins etc are pretty confusing hehe so basically i want to not over do it on my lights until my plants have been in for (how long?) and then chuck them on? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanmin4304 Posted February 27, 2006 Report Share Posted February 27, 2006 You want as much light as you can get without having algae problems. The lighting can increase as the plants get more established. It is a bit of a balancing act as Echinodorus sp like light and heavy feeding through the roots. You just have to watch and adjust as you need to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharn Posted February 27, 2006 Author Report Share Posted February 27, 2006 thankyou so much alan !! saved me a bit of money this week (was going to get two tubes and hood) ill get that new tube and chuck it on the tank and once i need more lighting ill get that double tuber and a new tube and get things up and running. my new plants (the sword and some small, grass looking chain sword) are still in pots. should i leave them in them or take them out when i replant the tank? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanmin4304 Posted February 27, 2006 Report Share Posted February 27, 2006 It sounds like you have a pot of microsword which should be taken out of the pot and split up. It should be lots of plants and is probably getting root bound about now. These potted plants are usually grown emersed and the pot will contain a lot of organics which could upset the tank. I would remove them from the pots and remove the mediia from the roots. Others may have other ideas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiverJohn Posted February 27, 2006 Report Share Posted February 27, 2006 Yeah, i agree Alan. Last time i bought potted plants they were very root bound. I would suggest you get a pair of sharp scissors and try to cut the pot a bit before removing the plants. One point i forgot to make is that if any of the tubes are older than 12months you should consider changing them sooner rather than later. Altho you plan to increase light levels slowly to reduce algae. If the tubes are old they will have shifted spectrum and be putting out the wrong colours. They usually shift towards the red/orange/green which is ideal for algae growth!! HTH John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharn Posted February 27, 2006 Author Report Share Posted February 27, 2006 i have a pic of it but not sure how to upload them on here as i dont get an attatchment box? thanks for that you two, will remove them today and maybe the oscar can have some new toys to play with (the pots) :lol: got my list for the weekend sorted out, yay! i get to spend money Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiverJohn Posted February 27, 2006 Report Share Posted February 27, 2006 HI Sharn, no problems. As for pics there are lots of posts on how to do it. Basically other than in teh members tanks section, you dont "attach" pictures to your posts... What you do is insert a link to your picture. Your picture must first be uploaded to a photo-hosting website such as http://www.photobucket.com. You should sign up then upload your pics. Once you have your pics uploaded, when you type a post you insert a link to your pic hosted on photobucket. The link looks like this... (but i have replaced a sqr bracket [ with an astrisk otherwise you wont see the link format.) *IMG]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v626/DiverJohn/Rotala_Macranda15Aug05002SM.jpg But when you submit or preview your post a correctly formated link, will display your pic!! :bounce: Like this..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharn Posted February 28, 2006 Author Report Share Posted February 28, 2006 http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f351/ ... 0_5136.jpg can you guys get to that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faran Posted February 28, 2006 Report Share Posted February 28, 2006 Sure can! If you resize it to 640 pixels wide and frame it with img brackets you can even insert it in here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiverJohn Posted February 28, 2006 Report Share Posted February 28, 2006 Hi Sharn, as blue said "sure can" . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharn Posted February 28, 2006 Author Report Share Posted February 28, 2006 so is it that microsword? and was the dude bullsh**ing me when he told me it was a relatvly easy plant to grow? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanksman Posted March 1, 2006 Report Share Posted March 1, 2006 Hard to tell from the picture. Could be val. Looks to tall for microsword. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faran Posted March 1, 2006 Report Share Posted March 1, 2006 Looks like Brazilian Microsword to me - http://www.trademe.co.nz/Home-living/Pe ... 020816.htm Due to the height it seems to be in the pic it might be Mauritius microsword - http://www.trademe.co.nz/Home-living/Pe ... 923285.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanksman Posted March 1, 2006 Report Share Posted March 1, 2006 Your plant looks healthy Sharn. When I unpotted a microsword last year I ended up with heaps of "millions" snails. My hardy tropical monster goldfish cleaned them up fortunately but some remain in another tank. Are you going to treat the plants for snails before you put them in? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharn Posted March 1, 2006 Author Report Share Posted March 1, 2006 i gave them a good rinse in the bucket before they went into the tank but i saw my damn snails on it last night its definatly not val thats for sure, the pic prob makes it look wierd but the leaves are only 3cm high max, it looks more like the brazillian to me cause the leaves arent as tall as the other one. this weekend i will be re-doing my substrate so hopefully that will whack out a fair lot of them (the snails) and i will rinse all my plants and decorations free of snails in the tank before i empty it cause im really sick of them. guna be a mission and i just have to hope and pray i have enough bacteria left to hold my tank steady while everything catches up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dimebag Posted March 1, 2006 Report Share Posted March 1, 2006 hey sharn, i just put a new bulb in my lighthood and my plants are cranking now!! before i had 1 biolux tube and 1 blue 1 for effect but plants wernt doin that well so got one called fluora from rexel 4 10$ and its made a HUGE difference u can almost see them growin! anyway sounds like uve got a busy weekend ahead . ive got sum frere tank space at the mo so if ya need any fish sitting let me know- rebuilding your tank is a big job and almost never goes according to plan(for me anyway ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stagger lee Posted March 4, 2006 Report Share Posted March 4, 2006 Hi Sharn, once you get that light business sorted your plants should grow great. A tank full of beautiful plants is the best look IMHO. I am always dilemmering about how much light to put on my tank, i keep thinking i need to add another tube or 2 but never seem to get round to it... my plants grow good, just can't get those pretty red ones... But i need to replace my 4 ft tubes (which a friend gave me). i have the whole K thing & CRI thing sorted out (in theory). But in practise it doesn't seem that easy. Can someone reccomend me a brand from Mastertrade? Last time i went in there to get tubes for my 2 ft it got a bit confusing for me and the sales guy. Not all tubes have the K rating on them... They ended up ordering me some sylvania gro lux ones but they have a real pinky purple colour to them... Any recomendations would be greatly appreciated Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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