chimera Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 tell you what Layton, if I can brew 100 litres for $10, I'll switch to ASW Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lduncan Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 I could do 100 litres for $16 retail, how's that? You wouldn't have to be doing all those water changes if it wasn't for zeo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chimera Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 You wouldn't have to be doing all those water changes if it wasn't for zeo. i seriously hope that was an attempt at humour otherwise your @#$!@# status has just gone up a notch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookie extreme Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 You wouldn't have to be doing all those water changes if it wasn't for zeo. wanna buy lots of SPS coral frags and colonies. seems i grow quite a few of them lately. must be all those water changes with no other supplements except zeo. and mainly under 150 watters too. bummer that zeo stuff must be real crap if my corals grow like weed. damit how i hate weed. :roll: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lduncan Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 Bit of both Using zeo you must do 5% WC weekly, do you not? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lduncan Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 cookie, i think you got the wrong end of the stick there. I was saying that following the zeo guidelines, people generally do more water changes than those not using zeo, and therefore spend more on salt a month. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookie extreme Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 Using zeo you must do 5% WC weekly, do you not? true. and this comming from me who didn't do water changes for up to 6 months. but i used a hell of an amount of extra additves which costed a small fortune. doing a weekly water changes actually works out cheaper plus SPS seem to grow a lot better. i did notice the growth spurt within a very short time after starting that horrible z....t. dillution is the solution to pollution. (sorry not from me but very true) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookie extreme Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 spend more on salt a month maybe but when i look at how much stuff i sell in a month and how much i spend on salt, i have got money left over in my pocket (well not for long until the wife finds it that is :-? ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chimera Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 zeovit guidelines is 10% a week. however even WITHOUT using zeovit, i would certainly try and opt for the same maintenance regime. I typically try for 20% every 2 weeks but lately i've been slack so its 20% every 4-6 weeks (AND I run zeovit) it would be very interesting to see how much diatom/algae growth i actually got (which I did get) if i did exactly the same thing in the last 6 weeks but did NOT run zeovit. would i have the same? would i have less? would i have more? who knows, but to make a statement like "zeovit adds a nutrient" is a pretty big call. so what if it does? proof is in the pudding. so far WITHOUT water changes (ok, other than 100 litres or 10% in the last 6 weeks) I still seemed to gain much better colours in my acro's in any 6 week period before that. even after all these years reef keeping is still such a new and unknown hobby. so much to learn - even for the so called "experts". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lduncan Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 zeovit guidelines is 10% a week. The guide changes so quickly i can't keep up who knows, but to make a statement like "zeovit adds a nutrient" is a pretty big call. so what if it does? proof is in the pudding. Again, for some reason, people think because i'm saying it is adding a nutrient, i'm saying it doesn't work. Clearly it works, and clearly the results indicate it is adding a nutrient (even ignoring the analysis done in the past). so far WITHOUT water changes (ok, other than 100 litres or 10% in the last 6 weeks) I still seemed to gain much better colours in my acro's in any 6 week period before that. But you said you have had increase algae growth at the same time? Interesting. This indicates an increase in nutrients, while at the same time colours are improving. What could causes that to happen? Many of the zeo tanks i see have really colourful corals, yet the tank contains a lot of cyano and other "high nutrient" type algaes all over the rocks, yet it claims to be a low nutrient system? I've noticed this even in well established zeo tanks. Sure it works, in that it produces colourful corals, but i don't think it is a low nutrient system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chimera Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 What could causes that to happen? no export of nutrients by changing the water in a closed system? i seem to recall a similar increase in diatom growth the last time I didnt change water for 6 weeks... bloody crap deltec skimmers Many of the zeo tanks i see have really colourful corals, yet the tank contains a lot of cyano and other "high nutrient" type algaes all over the rocks, yet it claims to be a low nutrient system? Mmmm, perhaps. Problem is proving the theory scientifically. If you have evidence (no sarcasm here) show me. I do have some cyano growth after starting zeovit which I did not have for quite sometime prior and diatom growth is perhaps a little up on last time. Probably why they state 10% weekly water changes. I dont think that is in the user guide for the hell of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reef Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 Many of the zeo tanks i see have really colourful corals, yet the tank contains a lot of cyano and other "high nutrient" type algaes all over the rocks, yet it claims to be a low nutrient system? You do have to take the experience of the reef keeper into account as the more experience reefers don’t have any algae or cyno when they use zeo, just because you use zeo does not mean you will have a great tank. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lduncan Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 You do have to take the experience of the reef keeper into account as the more experience reefers don’t have any algae or cyno, just because you use zeo does not mean you will have a great tank. Many of the pictures i've seen of G.Alexander's tank i've seen cyano and other algaes, which wouldn't survive in a truly low nutrient environment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chimera Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 You do have to take the experience of the reef keeper into account as the more experience reefers don’t have any algae or cyno, just because you use zeo does not mean you will have a great tank but of course, just look at my tank :-? takes more than just zeovit to have a great tank... blood, sweat and tears Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 Many of the zeo tanks i see have really colourful corals, yet the tank contains a lot of cyano and other "high nutrient" type algaes all over the rocks, yet it claims to be a low nutrient system? Where are these many zeovit tanks with colourful corals, cyano, and algae all over the rocks? I'd like to see them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lduncan Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 no export of nutrients by changing the water in a closed system? i seem to recall a similar increase in diatom growth the last time I didnt change water for 6 weeks... bloody crap deltec skimmers But without zeovit did you're colours improve... probably not. So what is the difference with zeovit? This is by no means proof, but is interesting: http://www.fnzas.org.nz/fishroom/iron-f ... t7454.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chimera Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 But without zeovit did you're colours improve... probably not. So what is the difference with zeovit? colour only. perhaps a little extra unwanted algae growth. CHIMERAS ZEOVIT GUIDE vII zeovit adds iron. dose zeovit, dose iron. change water, remove iron. corals get colourful, chimera is happy. corals bleach, chimera blames himself for overdosing zeovit or lack in water changes. end of manual. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 Could be wrong but I thought Chimera asked for evidence. A bunch of your own statements layton, is not evidence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 While Habib claims that in a home experiment zeovit rock leached iron, it has never been shown that the water in a zeovit tank has more iron in it than any other tank. How do you explain that Layton? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chimera Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 so who has an iron test kit? someone about to start using zeovit? iron test prior to dosing zeovit, then another test a week later (no water changes to influence results) surely iron test kits arent that hard to get hold of? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ira Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 zeovit adds iron. dose zeovit, dose iron. change water, remove iron Dose magnets to remove iron, save money on waterchanges... :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 so who has an iron test kit? someone about to start using zeovit? iron test prior to dosing zeovit, then another test a week later (no water changes to influence results) surely iron test kits arent that hard to get hold of? According to what Layton said a while back, testing for iron is very difficult / expensive. In fact it has never been done on a zeovit tank, meaning Laytons iron theory is still a theory not a fact. One thing that puzzles me, is why do some zeovit users dose iron to their tanks? If Laytons iron theory was true this would not be needed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lduncan Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 While Habib claims that in a home experiment zeovit rock leached iron Yip, and his test didn't measure all of the iron released, just some of it. It would also be before any metal eating bacteria got in on the action too. so who has an iron test kit? someone about to start using zeovit? iron test prior to dosing zeovit, then another test a week later (no water changes to influence results) surely iron test kits arent that hard to get hold of? Using a test kit to test iron won't tell you how much iron is being released and used in a tank. Nor is it easy to test using a hobby kit for something which is in the parts per billions. So testing for iron like this is not going to tell you much. A bunch of your own statements layton, is not evidence. I didn't just make that stuff up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 I didn't just make that stuff up. Well, Ummm... Actually, you did. 1. Where has it ever been demonstrated the water in a zeovit tank contains more iron? 2. Where are these many zeovit tanks you have seen that have colourful corals, cyano and lots of high nutrient algae all over the rocks? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reef Posted October 5, 2005 Report Share Posted October 5, 2005 I tried a seachem iron test on my tank, read zero, When I change my zeolite I do notice that I get more diatoms and the caulerpa algae in my sump gets a nice green colour, so I guess that zeolite does add some iron to the tank, if it is iron. Zeofood is an acid/ethanol so I would think that it does not add nutrients, so that leaves the zeolite which must add something I think this thread was about saltmix Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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