New To MArine Keeping! - Help me out?

[Pies]

Hi everyone! My names Mark and I am an experanced freshwater tropical fishkeeper.

I have decided to make the plunge into saltwater tropical (reef) fishkeeping.

I have so many questions, and i will leave my email at the bottom for anyone who wants to help me out! I will also post progress etc here, please share your ideas with me.

1st my tank will be 4ftx2.5ftx2ft. Average size, a little deeper than average. I have every intention of building a larger tank for the saltwater fish, but because of the costs of skimmers and lights I am going to start small...

I am going to use Metal Halide lights (1000k, HQI 150 watt) x2, and 2 VHO fluro or Power Compaqs, depending on price. Unless you can suggest better. Places to get this stuff from in NZ etc would be a great use. I have rung every electrical place in Wellington! But I now know I can get the Halides, and am about to start my search for Power Compacts.

I am going to setup a sump, with skimmer, heater, micron filter bag etc. I am also going to setup a 2nd tank as a refrigum. And I am going to install a Plenum in the refrigum. Can I get 'capualla' in NZ?

The biggest questions I have at this stage is one of 'micro inverts'. EVERYTHING I read talks about 'live sand', 'live rock' and 'micro inverts'. But I understand that I cannot get Live Rock, Live Sand or Micro Inverts here...

What can I do? Is the white dead rock OK? Will it eventually become 'Live Rock'? The same answer will apply for live sand I assume?

Can I get these micro inverts? Worms, crabs etc living in my sand bed. I want the Refrigum to supply my tank with Photo plankton etc. I think the micro inverts are KEY to success in my planed tank. Can I get them? If so where? What are others using? I want to avoid using mechinacal canister filters and do everything with 'biology'.

Can any of what I am intending to do be done in NZ? I am ready to start. I know its going to cost big $ (currently I estimate somewhere between $5k-$6k not including stock). I am prepared for this.

I guess I would love to hear from other saltwater fish keepers in NZ. I would love some advice. And i would love to know that I can indeed get these microinverts into my sandbed and start a successful tank in NZ.

Can you help? If so let me know!

Thanks!

Mark

[email protected]

PS: Any www sites about NZ tropical saltwater fishkeeping?

[Rob]

Regarding 'live rock', to the best of my knowledge (based on talking to a guy how used to import marines) we can't get live rack the same way those in America can (ie $/pound) you can still get live rock of a sort here though. All those anenomes, leathers etc for sale attached to a rock are attached to a live rock. My understanding of the quarantine process is that if the rock has an identifiable organism on it, the importer doesn't have to sterilise the rock - going to be alot more expensive than just being a weight of live rock though.

Regarding live sand - the only thoughts on how you could get it, is beg and plead with the shop for some sand out of the bottom of the tank they house all the inverts for sale in. This should act to seed your 'dead' sand.

[Pies]

Yeah none of my local shops here in Wellington carry Marine fish or inverts anyway so I may need some help from someone out there!

Not being able to get these micro inverts is a real problem. I am woundering if I can really have a successful aquirum without the live sand bed technology.

Come on! There must be some reef keepers out there somwhere with words of wisdom! :>

I am also looking to plumb my tank and am looking for what Americans call a 'PVC' bulkhead fitting. Anyone know where to get these in NZ? I need to plumb PVC into my tank (overflow box).

CHEERS!

[Pegasus]

Hi Pies,

Can't help on the Marine Side, but you asked,

I am also looking to plumb my tank and am looking for what Americans call a 'PVC' bulkhead fitting. Anyone know where to get these in NZ? I need to plumb PVC into my tank (overflow box).

Any Hardware shop will sell these. Just go in and ask for "bulkhead Fittings" and they will know what you mean.

BTW: Have you entered "Marine Supplies NZ" into your browser.... You could find some answers.

[Goldie]

Chappie at Pet World, Ferry Road, Christchurch is big in marine fish and sells the equipment etc, His phone is 03 3890 870 I think his name is Eddie. He certainly knows his fish and fish keeping. So maybe he would courier what you need up. Best of luck.

[Pies]

I rung about 3 plumbing stores / DIY places today and they didn't know what I was on about when I started talking about 'bulk heads'. And when I tried to explain it got worse! I'll get down to one this week, just a pain cause I can't get away from work right now.

I did a search for "marine suppliers NZ" and others like it in the past however all I get is boat/fish/dive etc...

I am starting to wounder if there are more than just 2 or 3 people keeping a reef Aquirum in NZ. I was hoping that I would be able to (eventually) swap corals etc.

But I am going to persevere! Still if anyone out there knows about my 'micro inverts' problems don't be shy! Any info at all is appreciated. Live rock! Live sand! Someone?

[Bruce]

Hi

pojt me to an American site that talks about "Bulkhead Fittings"

I think I know what you mean but want to get my facts straight first before I dive on in :-)

Good luck with your project, it is something that I have been contimplating for some time, just a matter of convincing the better half

/Bruce

[Ira]

There are way mroe than 3-4 people with marine tanks in NZ. There's gotta be at least 5 or 6!

Really frustrating how expensive and difficult to set up even a basic marine tank here in NZ is. In the US I think setting up a nice marine tank is about as expensive as a nice tropical tank here in NZ.

Man, I wanna move back to the US. Access to any fish you could want for cheap, cheap hardware...Too bad I didn't get into fish before I moved to NZ.

[Pies]

http://www.plumbingsupply.com/bulkhead.html has a diagram of a 'bulkhead'. possilby called a 'flange' here in NZ... I will know this week.

Ira - You are right about the tank, and the expense is off-putting. Its the lighting that is the most expensive part though, you can DIY the rest (kinda, and use some recycled freshwater stuff). But they look outstanding. I am still going to do it, but I think without the 'micro inverts' it will be tuff to get the seaded sand bed. I also wounder about crabs etc. And your right, it would be easy in the USA. Even in Australia it would be easier. Can't say I haven't thought about moving, dive the barrier reef and collect my own live sand!

I hope to order my tank, sump and refrigum this week. And have it plumbed with saltwater in it early January. This it will take at least 6 weeks to cycle. And before I stock the tank I am stocking and 'experimenting' with some local crabs/starfish/shrimps etc in the Refrigum first.

[Pegasus]

Hi Pies.... hey... that rhymes

A Bulkhead fitting in the general sense is just a threaded piece of pipe Metal/Nylon/Brass, that can be passed though a wall/tank/bucket, and be secured by a locking ring or nut on either or both sides.

They also come in what is known as M and F... meaning they can have a thread on the outside (Male .. M... ) and a tread on the inside (Female.. F.. )

To complicate things further, they also come in "Reducing Types" where you might have say 25mm going through your tank wall, and 20mm for the external portion.

They also come in "Flange Base" types, where there is a flange on one end that butts up to the inner wall of the tank or whatever, and would then only use one locking ring or nut.

You could use an M and F reducing nipple with a locking nut on the inside.

This would allow you to drill the correct sized hole, slip the fitting through and secure from either side with the lock nut.

You would then fit the correct fittings to the outside to suit your piping.

Look at the ball valve unit on your toilet.

Imagine the ball valve was not there.... just the threaded part that goes through the cistern.... this would be a type of bulkhead fitting.

It's a standard name in the trade (which I am not in) and I can't understand how they don't know what you mean.

Regards,

Bill (Pegasus)

[Bruce]

Hi looks as though that will do the trick

You will need to get a hole(s) cut in your tank by a local glass company, they charge around $10.00 per hole to drill them but well worth it as they will be responsible for the damage if any :oops:

You should be able to get these fittings from

Plumbing World

Mico Wakefield

Mastertrade

They are supplied with a rubber gasket but I would be inclined to throw the seal and use a aqurium sealant on both sides to be certain of a good water tight seal

/Bruce

Ira, I recently spent some time in the States and found the prices were comparable with what we pay here. There was a better selection but on the whole I think we do alright here.

I did see Pirahnas for sale though :roll: , but really couldnt see me having those

[Pies]

I am going to try and drive up to plumbing world tommorow and say 'oi'! I had a look in the toilet and see exactly what you mean. I'll let you know and set up some pics when I get started (next week I hope).

I had a call from a fish guy who seems to think its easier that what i think. Still spening the money is unavoidable though!

owwwww soooo excited!

He also answered my sand bed/rock question. Its not what i wanted to hear but it was good news. So what I am really hoping is that some friendly fish tank owners will 'give/swap/sell/lend' me some inverts/sand from their own established tanks and into mine. It will takes months to sort (it won't happen over night, but it will happen) but eventually i will at least have life in my sandbed and on my rocks.

[Pies]

Thanks for the advice bruce! I will go down their tommorow and nab me some!

If you are a salt water fish keeper share some wisdom with me.

And you are right about the prices too. Equipment is more expensive, but stock is comparable.

[Bruce]

I am not keeping marines at the moment, need to convince the btter half first and find some time to get it done, there is a Marine club forming in Auckland I believe, will try and find an email address for you, you should be able to get some info from some of those involved

Good Luck

/Bruce

[Caryl]

www.aqua.net.nz/index.html

The lady with the beautiful tank at this site is the one starting up the marine club I believe.

[Pies]

Thanks! I have been in contact with the owner of that reef tank and he has been awesome! Full of advice and encouragement!

I am meeting with a hortocultural/hydroponic supplier tommorow night and can confirm my plumbing. I will start a www site and post pics of progress for any interested.

I hope to get the glass cut this week. Assemble the tank soon after. Then I will build a stand (quick and dirty 4x2 style!) and get it plumbed. As soon as its plumbed, coral sand, phlenum, and saltwater to follow.

That its all on!

Thanks to EVERYONE who has offered advice, help or just said hi!

Keep speaking to me though! :>

Its interesting that no-one here so far is a reef keeper though... Surley there are some out there?

[Bruce]

Just wondering if you looked at joining a local fish club?

There are 3 in Wellington and some of the members have marine tanks or are setting them up I understand

The more people with marine tanks who join local clubs will hopefully encourage members to get into this side of fishkeeping

/Bruce

[Pies]

No I am not a member of the one of the clubs here but I will join soon. Just not sure what one.

My partner Jane is a member of the Kapati club and holds an official role in the FZNAS (not sure what but she goes to meeting every 3 months). I see the the latest news letter an article about a woman settings up a marine tank. Was good to see others getting into it. The more people who do it, the cheaper and easier it gets.

I have contacted all 3 clubs and no-one here has saltwater tanks.

I have been to the plumbers and got my fittings! So next stop is to ring my glass guy and get it all cut. Then I am off like a rocket!

[Caryl]

Join Kapi-Mana with Jane (and we might then get you on the FNZAS committee as well )! Your enthusiasm for marines will encourage others to give it a go. I think a lot of people are put off due to the added expense and extra equipment needed.

That woman in the Aquarium World is Julie, a member of our club. Her enthusiasm is infectious so perhaps some more Marlborough members will give marines a go.

[Pies]

The owner of that tank is a guy not a girl. But he is invloved in a marine club in Auckland, which he told me has 60 members! Maybee i'll be 61!

He has been VERY friendly and helpful with my new venture and is helping me out as much as someone in another city can. I just hope I can get my tank looking half as heathy as his...

[Caryl]

Do you mean Alois Wolloner? I thought it was a female name :oops:

Didn't realise they now had so many. It would be great if they would also sign up with the FNZAS as their knowledge would be a marvellous asset. There are too few marine keepers out there. Obviously not a problem in Auckland!

[dogmatix]

Hi Pies

Glad to hear another fine young man is taking the plunge.

A small word of caution if you set up a cold H20 sys you must completly cycle the tank again befor you put the tropical marines in it, it isnt just a matter of putting a heater/stat in there and some inverts. As the bacteria will be killed off due to temperature. Also if you are using a wet/dry filter in the sump make sure that u have a sloped panel in the sump below the wet dry, probably 20 degrees with a small powerhead mounted there, this will prvent the build up of fine detritus in your sump.

Jansens in Mt Eden sells live rock but none will be ready for six weeks . You may or may not know all this but i hope it helps.

P.S try aqua.net.nz

[Pies]

Hi thanks!

I will contact the Mt Eden store on Monday and 'order' some. Am in Wellington which is a bit fo a pain, but hopefull I can work something out.

As for the 'cold' tank. It will be heated from day one. I am aware of the nitrogen cycle and know that it will take 4-6 weeks before I can think about adding livestock. Hance the reason I am so keen to get started.

I have found some base rock, and coral sand. But some live rock & some 'oolite' would be good. Do you know if you can get different types/grades of ands in NZ?

I am setting up the tank hopefuly next week, but possibley the week after depending on time constraints and work.

I would love to see some sumo designs and PICs of peoples tanks and setups if there are some around.

I have talked Alios who runs www.aquanet.co.nz and he has been fantastic.

Any other advice? I am very interested in learning about how I can get some worms,crabs etc for my sand bed & Refugum. Also if anyone else has tried the deep sand bed plenum technique in a dedicated refrigum (this is what I am going to set-up).

Thanks for the response!

[Caryl]

Would you ask Alois if he would like to sign up to this forum? He would be able to help the newbie marine keepers. He could put his site as his signature so increase traffic to his own site too. The photos there are fantastic, I imagine the actual tanks are spectacular!

[Pies]

Yes I will certainly pass your suggestion along to him.

I get the last of my plumbing fixtures next week from Mico (in Lower Hutt). The people there were really helpful (which is more than I could say for others), and have found exactly what I need and are even offering some advice on how to best connect it all up!

So I will get the glass cut for my tank during next week.

I have also found a very useful place for all fishkeepers. www.sog.co.nz is a comercial hydroponic gardening shop with EXCELLENT online shop. They also sell RIO and VIAAQUA water pumps. Americans use the RIOs a lot (they don't seem to use or have access to EHIEM) and seem to think they are one of the best pumps on the market. So I am buying one of the 4200ltr an hr jobbies for my return/sump pump and a smaller one for my Refugim. I may also use these pumps insted of 'propper' power heads in the tank.

Check them out, AWESOME prices on lighting fixtures, Metal Halide lights etc.

Pies