Trilobite Posted November 27, 2013 Report Share Posted November 27, 2013 Apparently I have an albino betta juvie who was hiding amongst my baby dragons, red eyes and all :happy1: He bumps into the driftwood so his eyesights not the best but somehow he manges to keep up with his brothers and sisters since he is one of the bigger kids. Im so excited, I never thought Id see one in real life :nilly: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reptilez Posted November 27, 2013 Report Share Posted November 27, 2013 Wow congrats :cophot: Will be nice to see how it grows! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trilobite Posted November 27, 2013 Author Report Share Posted November 27, 2013 Thanks :-D Yeah hopefully it will survive lol, Ill keep an eye on him incase his eyes get worse and his siblings start to take all the food. Cant believe I never noticed it in the tank before Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss_boy86 Posted November 27, 2013 Report Share Posted November 27, 2013 a strain would be nice what a lovely fish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trilobite Posted November 27, 2013 Author Report Share Posted November 27, 2013 Apparently I have to breed it asap otherwise its eyes will deteriorate and impossible to breed. But I cant even tell what sex it is yet Think Im going to take it out and give him his own dark little tank since the one hes in is pretty bright Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rcon021 Posted November 27, 2013 Report Share Posted November 27, 2013 I haven't had Albino Betta but I do have a lot of other albino fish/birds. Giving this albino its own tank will be the best thing to do till it matures. Also some floating plants to break the light, if you decide to have a light. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghaz Posted November 27, 2013 Report Share Posted November 27, 2013 Congrats!!! Definitely separate it and keep an eye on it till you can breed. would be good to see if any colouration shows as it gets older but looks like it might be a true albino. What are the parents? how old are they? and will you be selling some siblings(shipped)? would be keen to try get an albino strain going, and unless it was a complete fluke of a mutation the siblings should carry a lil albinism even if its not visible, gave it a go a while ago but gave up lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trilobite Posted November 27, 2013 Author Report Share Posted November 27, 2013 Ill set up a little tank for it later today then, got lots of indan fern floating around my tanks which will be perfect Parents were marble dragon pk x blue red dragon hmpk from this thread hhttp://www.fnzas.org.nz/fishroom/viewt ... 14&t=64668 The siblings are mostly all normal looking marble dragons and some solid coloured ones too, but there are a couple of cellophanes where either the marble has removed the dragon scales or they never got it. Those will be the ones Ill probably use to breed it to (hopefully those will be the little albino carriers) Theyre still a bit young, their dragon scales havent even filled in yet but when they are big enough Ill definitely be selling them, got too many lol. How did you get yours to breed? were there any different techniques you had to use for their bad eyes? Heres some siblings, in the background you can see 2 that have little-no dragon scales, hopefully they dont all end up the same sex though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghaz Posted November 27, 2013 Report Share Posted November 27, 2013 best chance of survival: Separate, lots of cover and live food, Daphnia if you can, otherwise white or blood worms, keeping water quality as good as you can. as long as he isn't a random mutation, the siblings should carry some albinism so should be good candidates to breed from. I'd keep the best looking siblings of it, cellophane's, dragon or double tails if any in there. I found DT and dragons had the highest possibility of having a suppressed albino gene in them. both your parents should have the gene, or its a random mutation, hard to tell unless more albinos' show up. then cross back to the mother or father, which ever you like better as both "should" have the albino gene. I tried mine with blue marble PK DT x dragon VT, and Blue marble PK DT x mustard HM, had a few come out with red eyes but had a lil colour and most died after 2 or 3 months. Had 1 survive to breeding age, but lost almost everything(dragons, dumbo's, and my fave - Mustards, had Dumbo mustards and oranges at 4.5 months old too which was heart breaking.) in the last lot of Welly earthquakes. 1 mustard Fem survived, so im on African Cichlids(only tank to make it) now as i can't afford to replace everything just yet as welly has the worst selection of fighters, or people are like me on don't really publish what they do lol. Alternatively, start at the top with the new Albino, and breed with what you like best, then cross the daughter/brother back, introducing new unrelated genes on 3rd gen that show strong tail type you want, then cross back again see what happens, try for a higher than normal albino ratio, then start picking out the good tail types your wanting and continue on. Note: all my personal opinion and mainly on the theory of genetics, a little on personal experience but hard to predict especially with albino blah blah blah. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss_boy86 Posted November 27, 2013 Report Share Posted November 27, 2013 those other ones are beutiful also, wonder if i could find some albino halfmoons.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexyay Posted November 27, 2013 Report Share Posted November 27, 2013 Not an attack, but out of curiosity, if the albinos have a low chance of survival and need their eyesight (and often get bad eyes), should we be breeding more of them? (other to find out about their genetics) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghaz Posted November 27, 2013 Report Share Posted November 27, 2013 Not an attack, but out of curiosity, if the albinos have a low chance of survival and need their eyesight (and often get bad eyes), should we be breeding more of them? (other to find out about their genetics) Same dealeo with Dragons(and fighters in general), They have a possibility to have bad genetics/faults, but some will be strong and have no/little "side effects" of having the desired traits, hence the reason to improve them and their genetics through line breeding so they are stronger. Fighters with longer tails technically wouldn't survive very well in the wild as they would be out competed for food by the faster short-fins, so in that respect, we would would only have plakat if we went by that logic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexyay Posted November 27, 2013 Report Share Posted November 27, 2013 Same dealeo with Dragons(and fighters in general), They have a possibility to have bad genetics/faults, but some will be strong and have no/little "side effects" of having the desired traits, hence the reason to improve them and their genetics through line breeding so they are stronger. Fighters with longer tails technically wouldn't survive very well in the wild as they would be out competed for food by the faster short-fins, so in that respect, we would would only have plakat if we went by that logic. Ah okay. Longfins aren't outcompeted in captive tanks though, where it seems to be the albinos are (may not even do well in isolation). So I'm not saying low chances of survival in the wild (most of our current fish wouldn't do so well in the wild!) but low chance of survival in captivity is something different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss_boy86 Posted November 27, 2013 Report Share Posted November 27, 2013 we should almost have some breeding competitions, see who can get the desired trait fastest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rcon021 Posted November 28, 2013 Report Share Posted November 28, 2013 By crossing the albinos with other stronger normal you do make the albino gene a lot stronger as time goes. Eg - The albino guppies we have in NZ are getting stronger by the year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trilobite Posted November 29, 2013 Author Report Share Posted November 29, 2013 Ghaz thats really helpful info Interesting that you got some from a marble x as well...maybe the marble might have something to do with it. Unfortunately the mother died which was a shame because she was the nicer fish than the father, she would have been able to improve the form quite nicely. Sorry you lost your fighters in the quake :-( mine did the opposite in the chch ones, lost everything but the fighters. Ive put it in a little dark tank with heaps of plant cover and Im pretty sure this guy is blind as a bat :-( It cant find food even though its directly in front of him and bumps into every single thing. I think he found food by sensing all the crazy movement in the water made by his siblings and following it. Ive mixed garlic into his beefheart so hopefully that helps him to find it easier. I dont think this guy will ever breed since hes pretty blind and I dont think he would even know theres a female/male in the tank (dont why why but I keep refering to it as a male even though I dont know it sex yet) Wonder if it was because I left him in the brightly lit tank for too long and his eyesight deteriorated faster tan normal. Alexyay, I get where youre coming from, personally I dont like albino anythings (they creep me out lol) I prefer the bright shiny dragons. Im mainly curious about how its inherited in bettas and how they grow, especially since they are so rare not much is known about them. It would be good to develop a strain that doesnt go blind or at least find out how to prevent/reduce the chance of them from going blind as they get older. But fighters are solitary animals so its not unheard of to keep a single fighter by itself. Blind fish can learn pretty quickly how to find food so as long as the albinos are treated with extra care and attention then they should be fine. Definitely not for a beginner who wants an easy pet though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexyay Posted November 29, 2013 Report Share Posted November 29, 2013 Ghaz thats really helpful info Interesting that you got some from a marble x as well...maybe the marble might have something to do with it. Unfortunately the mother died which was a shame because she was the nicer fish than the father, she would have been able to improve the form quite nicely. Sorry you lost your fighters in the quake :-( mine did the opposite in the chch ones, lost everything but the fighters. Ive put it in a little dark tank with heaps of plant cover and Im pretty sure this guy is blind as a bat :-( It cant find food even though its directly in front of him and bumps into every single thing. I think he found food by sensing all the crazy movement in the water made by his siblings and following it. Ive mixed garlic into his beefheart so hopefully that helps him to find it easier. I dont think this guy will ever breed since hes pretty blind and I dont think he would even know theres a female/male in the tank (dont why why but I keep refering to it as a male even though I dont know it sex yet) Wonder if it was because I left him in the brightly lit tank for too long and his eyesight deteriorated faster tan normal. Alexyay, I get where youre coming from, personally I dont like albino anythings (they creep me out lol) I prefer the bright shiny dragons. Im mainly curious about how its inherited in bettas and how they grow, especially since they are so rare not much is known about them. It would be good to develop a strain that doesnt go blind or at least find out how to prevent/reduce the chance of them from going blind as they get older. But fighters are solitary animals so its not unheard of to keep a single fighter by itself. Blind fish can learn pretty quickly how to find food so as long as the albinos are treated with extra care and attention then they should be fine. Definitely not for a beginner who wants an easy pet though Yeah - I think herbivores might have less of an issue but I've noticed the carnivorous fish really have trouble when they're blind - I just didn't really see any reason to get blind bettas into the gene pool but if you can "fix" the strain that'd be pretty cool (I'd be interested to know more about them too). My puffer went blind in one eye (I think he wounded it and pop eye developed from there), and he won't see food even if it's right in front of him - I had to move the other because he simply couldn't get food in time. I usually keep my fighters in my community tank so I guess not having "disabled" fish isn't really my aim. A white one will do just fine for me lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trilobite Posted November 29, 2013 Author Report Share Posted November 29, 2013 Just been googling them, and found quite a bit of interesting info, particularly here,http://www.predatoryfishkeepers.com/forums/showthread.php?223-Red-Eye-Bettas. Apparently you can get partial albinos which have red eyes but half of them can see, they also have colour. I wonder if crossing a full albino to a partial albino with good eyes will help strengthen the vision of a pure albino. I had an angelfish who went blind, he could only eat blood worms that were in front of his face, but yeah a herbivore would find life easier, I wonder if albino cories are blind or partially blind as well? Im going to see if I can train him to come when I tap the water, my other bettas do it and it will make finding food much easier for him if he learns Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss_boy86 Posted November 30, 2013 Report Share Posted November 30, 2013 thanks, i will have a read also Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss_boy86 Posted November 30, 2013 Report Share Posted November 30, 2013 I want it BTW Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 30, 2013 Report Share Posted November 30, 2013 wow... you lot know your stuff... im only a beginner in the world of betta breeding... my poor bettas are just from animates and are the undesired crosses of crosses probably... i don't even have cool looking dragons... just normal veil-tails.. and one crowntail; well.. just so you all know im probably going to pick your brains more then you would want im interested in trying to breed pastel colours, like a cherry blossom pink and a light purple. Currently I have three males, all blue two with red ventral fins and one with off white ventral fins - one is a Crowntail the others are veil-tail. i have two females, a red one with green - have no idea what kind of tail (the females are what im bad at knowing about) and a blue one with red in her.. although i think she has a fin deformity from being picked on when younger. I have two lots of fry at current, one is almost four months old and about 30 - 40 of them in a 90l tank; just started fighting properly today however im still struggling to tell if some are female or male and have only separated one as they were not fighting till today....tomorrow is a new day! ** experienced people.. how big would your teenagers be at this age?**** which were bred with my blue/white male and red/green female. i also have fry that is three weeks old, breed from both my females vs my blue crowntail.. he likes his ladies! starting to show flecks of colour and can see crowntails *i think* in a 30L tank atm they are only tiny like less then a CM still... Any help appreciated.. you all sound like the Siamese fighter gods I've been looking for..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss_boy86 Posted November 30, 2013 Report Share Posted November 30, 2013 Thanks :-D Yeah hopefully it will survive lol, Ill keep an eye on him incase his eyes get worse and his siblings start to take all the food. Cant believe I never noticed it in the tank before As a side note, are you going to try these 2 parents again to see if ya get any more? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss_boy86 Posted December 1, 2013 Report Share Posted December 1, 2013 wow... you lot know your stuff... im only a beginner in the world of betta breeding... my poor bettas are just from animates and are the undesired crosses of crosses probably... i don't even have cool looking dragons... just normal veil-tails.. and one crowntail; well.. just so you all know im probably going to pick your brains more then you would want im interested in trying to breed pastel colours, like a cherry blossom pink and a light purple. Currently I have three males, all blue two with red ventral fins and one with off white ventral fins - one is a Crowntail the others are veil-tail. i have two females, a red one with green - have no idea what kind of tail (the females are what im bad at knowing about) and a blue one with red in her.. although i think she has a fin deformity from being picked on when younger. I have two lots of fry at current, one is almost four months old and about 30 - 40 of them in a 90l tank; just started fighting properly today however im still struggling to tell if some are female or male and have only separated one as they were not fighting till today....tomorrow is a new day! ** experienced people.. how big would your teenagers be at this age?**** which were bred with my blue/white male and red/green female. i also have fry that is three weeks old, breed from both my females vs my blue crowntail.. he likes his ladies! starting to show flecks of colour and can see crowntails *i think* in a 30L tank atm they are only tiny like less then a CM still... Any help appreciated.. you all sound like the Siamese fighter gods I've been looking for..... You should add your location to your profile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trilobite Posted December 2, 2013 Author Report Share Posted December 2, 2013 Forzamaxxi1 fighters are pretty addicting! especially once you start breeding them as Im sure youve found lol I usually jar based on size and aggression, mine are usually 3-3.5cm when I jar. I like to keep the good ones in the growout as long as possible and jar the less promising earlier so I can grow them up and get rid of them faster. But with longfinned fish like hm or ct some people like to jar the good ones first so theres less risk of fin damage in the growout (but I have hmpk so I dont need to worry about that too much lol) I find that age doesnt really matter in terns of jarring, if you put them in a big tank and make sure they always have fat, full tummies then they will grow fast. My black line grows really slowly but these dragons are growing much faster even though they are given the same treatment so genetics also plays into how fast a spawn grows. SS Nah I cant do a repeat of this spawn because the female died :-( Im definitely doing an F2 though, maybe Ill get albino again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss_boy86 Posted December 5, 2013 Report Share Posted December 5, 2013 Forzamaxxi1 fighters are pretty addicting! especially once you start breeding them as Im sure youve found lol I usually jar based on size and aggression, mine are usually 3-3.5cm when I jar. I like to keep the good ones in the growout as long as possible and jar the less promising earlier so I can grow them up and get rid of them faster. But with longfinned fish like hm or ct some people like to jar the good ones first so theres less risk of fin damage in the growout (but I have hmpk so I dont need to worry about that too much lol) I find that age doesnt really matter in terns of jarring, if you put them in a big tank and make sure they always have fat, full tummies then they will grow fast. My black line grows really slowly but these dragons are growing much faster even though they are given the same treatment so genetics also plays into how fast a spawn grows. SS Nah I cant do a repeat of this spawn because the female died :-( Im definitely doing an F2 though, maybe Ill get albino again i will be very interested in thgetting some of your (Fighters)babys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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