ben19185074 Posted March 6, 2005 Report Share Posted March 6, 2005 What is some phosphate removers you guys use? Rowaphos, salifert, JBL etc? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetskisteve Posted March 6, 2005 Report Share Posted March 6, 2005 Zeovit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reef Posted March 6, 2005 Report Share Posted March 6, 2005 Rowaphos and salifert have good reputation. both iron based. Tunze also have a new product called zeolith which removes nurients and some phostphate, pretty much like Zeovit without the bacteria. ZEOVIT is a Zeolith. "Alumin Silicate di hydrated." I don't know what kind of zeo, but it is first an adsorber of ion. The ion adsorbed depend of the quality of the Zeo. And in saturation the Zeo can release in the tank the ion adsorbed if there is in the tank ions with more affinity with the Zeo. And Secondly a support for bacteria. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pies Posted March 6, 2005 Report Share Posted March 6, 2005 I was using Salifert phosphate remover, but people I know had issues with it and stoped. There is some debate on another thread here about weather or not I am a lier about it, and ended with Reef making threats about lawyers and Habib (sp?) talking about defimation. Then it died. Rowaphos and salifert have good reputation. both iron based. I would like to point out the Reef does import and sell both these products in NZ, so be-ware the sales talk, he has a comercial interest in promoting these products. If you want to read about the dangers of Iron based phosphate binders check the reefcentral.com link from the other thread. I am currently using Aquamedic, because I can fluidose it. I have 0 phosphates. Prior to that I was using Salifert "phosphate killer". I would like to use ROWAPHOS but I don't have a source for it. There are some other products out there, phos-sorb etc I have no experance with them, I am sure someone else can share the experances. Not sure if the question about if freshwater products are OK from saltware was answered, so if you are looking at using a freshwater product may pay to do some research first. I belive there are aluminimun based products out there that can be very troublesome in saltware. Good luck. Pies Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted March 6, 2005 Report Share Posted March 6, 2005 Before going zeovit I did a ton of reading on RC about iron based Po4 removers. The "issue" is RTN, but nobody could come up with an explanation. The evidence though, is that the RTN would tend to occur a week to a fortnight after the media had been changed, and was more likely if the more effective media such as Rowaphos was used. This would fit with the theory that RTN is related to a sudden drop in nutrients. A number of people were able to solve the problem by putting their phosphate reactor on a timer. The first few days after changing the media, it would only run two hours a day, then this would gradually be increased until after 3 or 4 weeks it would run 24/7. Those using this method did not have any further issues with RTN, and generally believed that this was due to reducing any sudden changes, by means of the timer. The other thing is there are a number of phosphate removers on the market that simply do not do a good enough job to be of value to us. Stick with the iron based ones, or certain of the zeolite products. Having said all that, RTN is only an issue for those keeping sps corals. Nobody else need care. And even many reefers with sps never had a problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lduncan Posted March 6, 2005 Report Share Posted March 6, 2005 This would fit with the theory that RTN is related to a sudden drop in nutrients. Here we go again. What if it was just the opposite which is occuring... a sudden increase of nutrients? Layton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lduncan Posted March 6, 2005 Report Share Posted March 6, 2005 If you want to read about the dangers of Iron based phosphate binders check the reefcentral.com link from the other thread. Exactly. No iron based product is totally immune from these problems. Layton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reef Posted March 6, 2005 Report Share Posted March 6, 2005 Pies does make a valid point that I am the distributor of salifert and rowaphos, Wasp makes very good points. Having said all that, RTN is only an issue for those keeping sps corals. Nobody else need care. And even many reefers with sps never had a problem. Pies claims that hobbyist have problems with the Salifert products which is a liar as there is no proof. There is info on iron based phosphate remover which does drop your ph a bit, so if you add kaltwasser this is not a problem. I have been using both products and have never had any problem, nor has anyone in New Zealand. Salifert phosphate killer has a big following in New Zealand and is the most popular phosphate Remover. Aqua medic which is sold by his friend Steve( jetkski ) like salifert/rowaphos are also iron based. So a total contradiction by Mark as he now uses Aquamedic and then wants to use rowaphos which is also iron based. Ben , If you try some of the phostphate killer I will give you a 100% refund if it does not work.Email me and i will send you a small sample) Also don’t worry about the Liars by Mark as he can’t provide any details of hobbyist having problems with the Salifert product. There is nothing on the Net that blames Salifert for any problems, And if he does it will be a isolated case. Mark is fairly new in the Hobby so his knowledge and experience is very limited and all he is doing is trying to put doubt in your mind about the Salifert Phostphate so he can promote Aquamedic which is not really stocked by any shops. Ben i have the most expensive tank in New Zealand and if i was having any problems i would not be distributing any of these products. The best way to use the salifert product is to put it in a canister filter so you push the water through it, this way you will get better water contact Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogmatix Posted March 6, 2005 Report Share Posted March 6, 2005 Iand many of my customers use the Sea-Chem PO4 remover, works very well for all of us. I would recomend trying the cheapest ones first, if one doesnt work great try another. I would recomend the sea-chem or rowaphos Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted March 6, 2005 Report Share Posted March 6, 2005 Using a phosphate remover will not cause a sudden increase in nutrients. It will cause a decrease. The Seachem product is an effective phosphate remover, but has also been shown to leach aluminium. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pies Posted March 6, 2005 Report Share Posted March 6, 2005 Pies claims that hobbyist have problems with the Salifert products which is a liar as there is no proof. Just because you don't belive me doesn't make me a lier Alois. Mark is fairly new in the Hobby so his knowledge and experience is very limited and all he is doing is trying to put doubt in your mind about the Salifert Phostphate so he can promote Aquamedic which is not really stocked by any shops. Now this is a lie, and frankly I am offended. I will restate my comments on this because its obvious you have not read what I have written, pay attention: I am using the Aquamedic phosphate remover because people I know have warned me off it, I switched to the Aquamedic product because its all I could get, as I have stated several times now I would rather be using the ROWA product, which Alois you do sell. How is me saying what i've said promiting Aquamedic, its not my product of choice, I have made no seceret about this. I have even asked for you to sell me some ROWA, but no response from you. As for shop stocking, I live in Wellington, NOTHING is stocked. Aqua medic which is sold by his friend Steve( jetkski ) like salifert/rowaphos are also iron based. So a total contradiction by Mark as he now uses Aquamedic and then wants to use rowaphos which is also iron based. Do you know what contridiction means Alois, if you don't www.dictionary.com may help you out. Nowhere have I said dont use Salifert because its iron based and the the Aquamedic product isn't. My post if you read it says to check about this risks of using these products before you use them regardless of if you use salifert/aquamedic/ROWA/other. I understand the dangers and potention problems, I think someone considering using a new product should read this information. Also don’t worry about the Liars by Mark as he can’t provide any details of hobbyist having problems with the Salifert product. There is nothing on the Net that blames Salifert for any problems, And if he does it will be a isolated case. Well if its not on the Net it can't be true... Bottom line, iron based products can cause problems (read the reefcentral.com article), the salifert product is iron based. Also Alois has stated on this forum that most of the stuff on reefcentral is incorrect anyway, we I guess he knows better than them (in this case Randy Homes Farley). Ben i have the most expensive tank in New Zealand and if i was having any problems i would not be distributing any of these products. Its hard to know if it is the most expensive tank is NZ or not, because last time we quoted how much you said it cost you attacked me saying I was making it up. Even if it is the most expenive tank in NZ, its certainly not the nicest. Personally i'd rather have the nicest tank, not the most expensive. How do you know its the most expenive Alois? Tell us how much you think its worth/insured for and we can compare. Alois - Why do you continue with these personal attacks and mis-information? Why not put it to rest I am growing tired of your relentless attacks towards me and others just so you can product your comercial interests in what is just a hobby for most of us. I am fairly new to the hobby, and have shared with EVERYONE on this forum my success's and failures. I consider myself and my tank to be successful and belive I know enough to empart what I have learned with others. What I don't have is any comercial interest in any aspect of this hobby whatsoever. I contribute to this hobby because I enjoy it, not because I leech from it. Pie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lduncan Posted March 6, 2005 Report Share Posted March 6, 2005 Using a phosphate remover will not cause a sudden increase in nutrients. It will cause a decrease. How do you know this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reef Posted March 6, 2005 Report Share Posted March 6, 2005 Alois - Why do you continue with these personal attacks and mis-information? Why not put it to rest I am growing tired of your relentless attacks towards me and others just so you can product your comercial interests in what is just a hobby for most of us. If you are sick and tired then get some sleep. As i said you are a liar and always have a hidden agenda. relentless attacks towards me and others Get a new line. You can talk. Start writing the truth then this would not happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted March 6, 2005 Report Share Posted March 6, 2005 It is probably called a phosphate remover because it removes them, not adds them. Also, if you look at the label on a bottle of Salifert Phosphate Killer, you will see stated that it also reduces many types of organics, and also heavy metals. I guess in the end it will come down to wether or not you are going to believe the label. But I do, no worries. And to say a phosphate remover will increase nutrients is ludicrous. I hope that clears it up for you, but if not, I will say now that the evidence is clear and I am not going to be drawn into a silly argument over it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lduncan Posted March 6, 2005 Report Share Posted March 6, 2005 It is probably called a phosphate remover because it removes them, not adds them. I never said they add phosphate, that would be stupid. And yes, it doesn't just remove phosphate, it binds other ions too, like the label says. But when you add it, you are adding a particular nutrient, which has been found to be a limiter on reefs. Layton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drifty Posted March 6, 2005 Report Share Posted March 6, 2005 ffs guys, you are all entitled to your own opinions stop taking it personally and insulting each other. I read these forums for info not bickering Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted March 6, 2005 Report Share Posted March 6, 2005 I'm very tempted to ask you to name this mysterious nutrient that you claim gets added. But no, I must resist. I refer you to my earlier statement :- I hope that clears it up for you, but if not, I will say now that the evidence is clear and I am not going to be drawn into a silly argument over it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pies Posted March 6, 2005 Report Share Posted March 6, 2005 As i said you are a liar and always have a hidden agenda. As people who have met and delt with you know who the liar is, your reputation takes care of that. I would love to know what my hidden agenda is, why not expose me and my hidden agenda so people, myself included, know what it is? The truth is you try to discredit me because sometimes (rarely I would add) my opnions conflict directly with your comercial interests, so you feel your only option is to attack me (or anyone else) who may damage your sales. As is always the case with you in recent months, you have to resort to personal attacks because you have nothing else to contribute other than the products you sell. Pie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reef Posted March 7, 2005 Report Share Posted March 7, 2005 You are correct you have no reputation. Just always looking after number one as usual. No need to discredit you, you have done that yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nodle Posted March 7, 2005 Report Share Posted March 7, 2005 :lol: :lol: I think we have a winning thread Two simultaneous arguments going head too head Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pies Posted March 7, 2005 Report Share Posted March 7, 2005 Just always looking after number one as usual. I enjoyed having wholesale access to fish, coral, supliments, test kits, light bulbs etc. Its hardly in my own best interests to agrivate you as it has removed my access cheap kit and stock. I would much rather deal with you directly than go through the shops, as its so much cheaper to buy directly from you. So tell me, how am I looking after number one, if anything I have burned my bridges not made any. Pie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cracker Posted March 7, 2005 Report Share Posted March 7, 2005 Nodle...you're right...Its legendary!! :lol: So whats with this "rubber" fetish again.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lduncan Posted March 7, 2005 Report Share Posted March 7, 2005 I'm very tempted to ask you to name this mysterious nutrient that you claim gets added. What are phosphate removers? Iron! No mystery there at all. I thought it was obvious. Layton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted March 7, 2005 Report Share Posted March 7, 2005 What may at a simple glance seem obvious, may under proper research turn out not to be so. Was this "nutrient" you were refering to iron? SFK and other iron based phosphate removers, will in fact deplete iron from the water, along with some other metals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lduncan Posted March 7, 2005 Report Share Posted March 7, 2005 will in fact deplete iron from the water How? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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