Scuba Sam Posted November 5, 2007 Report Share Posted November 5, 2007 Hi guys, your advice please. My new golden severum has started twitching. Not noticed before this evening - I was at work all day but he was fine this morning. He has been twitching his fins, shaking his rear end, and bumping into things (like scratching his back). He is clamping a bit, and favouring the bottom of the tank. He is new so I am getting to know all his marks and abnormalities, but I have noticed the following differences from my old sev: a clear raised area kind of like a blister but flatter on his nose, and one rough area on a scale - looks almost like a deformed scale rather than white spot or fungus or a wound - like the scale has a bump of scale on it. Neither of these look particularly concerning though. Water details - 180 litres pH - 7.2 Nitrate 5ppm (has been higher last week, two water changes since then) Nitrate nil Ammonia not tested tonight but nil on Saturday Sharing a tank with cories, bristlenoses, clown loaches, a zebra danio and two guppies. Three guppies missing in last week - eaten or dead I'm not sure. Your advice would be appreciated please - he doesn't look sick yet but I want to take action early if it is needed. Cheers, Sam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loopy Posted November 5, 2007 Report Share Posted November 5, 2007 Have you got any other severums in the tank with it? My Male severum twitches his fins and shimmies/shakes when he is a bit peeved or flirting with his girlfriend. The bump on it's nose could be just another hint that it is a male as a lot of male cichlids develop slight bumps or lumps on their noses and foreheads as they mature. completely normal. How long has it been in the new tank and how old is it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scuba Sam Posted November 5, 2007 Author Report Share Posted November 5, 2007 Hi Loopy, thanks for your reply. He is the only severum in the tank. I got him two and a half weeks ago, from a tank with two bigger severum's where he was being bullied. His old owner sold all three to different owners. He had a ragged tail which hasn't fully grown right yet. I have just added a school of cory's which are fairly consipicuous on the bottom of the tank so perhaps he is just peeved. He looks fine this morning but still twitching his fins as he was last night. As to age, my last one was five years old, and this one is about quarter of the size, but half the length - hope that makes sense. I'm guessing he is less than a year old, or a dwarf!! He has good coloured spots compared to my old boy. As I said earlier he doesn't look too poorly, but with the clamped fins, I wanted to get advice earlier rather than later!! Thanks, Sam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bananalobster Posted November 5, 2007 Report Share Posted November 5, 2007 I'm not too clued up on this so may be wrong, but could it be flukes? They are like little worms that attach themselves to fish, and fish almost act itchy. Might want to wait for one of the other more experienced members to comment on this before medicating though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scuba Sam Posted November 5, 2007 Author Report Share Posted November 5, 2007 Thanks for suggestion Bananalobster - I know nothing about flukes, and welcome any ideas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bananalobster Posted November 5, 2007 Report Share Posted November 5, 2007 http://article.discusnews.com/cat-02/flukes1.shtml This is a website that popped up when I googled "Gill flukes". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scuba Sam Posted November 6, 2007 Author Report Share Posted November 6, 2007 Hmmm, doesn't sound too good - I will have a good look at his gills when I get home. Has anyone seen flukes in a severum? Thanks Bananalobster for link - I have some info now if that proves to be what it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snookie Posted November 6, 2007 Report Share Posted November 6, 2007 i would crank temp up a few degrees for a couple of days Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scuba Sam Posted November 6, 2007 Author Report Share Posted November 6, 2007 Hi Alan, tank is at 26 at the moment so will give it a try. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tHEcONCH Posted November 6, 2007 Report Share Posted November 6, 2007 Hmmm, doesn't sound too good - I will have a good look at his gills when I get home. Has anyone seen flukes in a severum? Thanks Bananalobster for link - I have some info now if that proves to be what it is. You can't see flukes with the naked eye. Start with the basics: make sure your water is right and leave the temperature where it is. Wait until you can positively diagnose an illness BEFORE you start treating - treating for an illness that you can't positively identify isn't a very good idea - you'll make the fish sick trying random medications. Here's some info on Flukes from an article I wrote... Gill and Skin Flukes Flukes are a kind of parasite that attach themselves to specific parts of the fish. Different flukes attach different parts of the body. There is a particular gill fluke that is known to occur only in Discus gills, and is responsible for the death of many juvenile fish. Most adult Fish tolerate small numbers of flukes without bother - young and weakened fish may succumb to outbreaks. What it looks like: Skin and Gill Flukes are usually invisible to the naked eye, but the behaviour of the fish can indicate an infection. Fish that 'flash' or 'strike' objects in the tank may be irritated by skin flukes - those that breathe heavily through one gill whilst clamping the other shut may have gill flukes. What causes it: Flukes are parasites that can be carried by Adult fish with little effect. Adult fish can usually suppress any outbeak through their own immune system's defences, however young fish, or uninfected fish that are bought into contact with 'carriers' can be overwhelmed before they develop immunity. What to do: Check you water parameters. Treat with Fluke Tabs or Trichlorphon, following the manufactures instructions. Most remedies are organo-phosphates, which lose potency rapidly (especially in humid atmospheres), so buy fresh supplies as you need them and don't store them in your fishroom. Read the warning labels - strong doses of organo-phosphates kill certain fish (like elephant fish) instantly. There are other treatments, however they involve dangerous chemicals and specialist knowledge, and along with the remedies mentioned above can kill other kinds of fish instantly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jn Posted November 6, 2007 Report Share Posted November 6, 2007 Treat with Fluke Tabs or Trichlorphon, following the manufactures instructions. Except you can't get fluketabs in NZ anymore, I contacted brooklands who used to import them and they said definitely not allowed to import them anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scuba Sam Posted November 6, 2007 Author Report Share Posted November 6, 2007 Hi Conch and JN, thanks for your responses. Conch I now find myself a little confused. My fish shows no sign of mucus around the gills as mentioned in the Cichlid forum article linked to above. He has not been scraping himself on things very often, it is mostly a tremor in his fins - tail fin, dorsal, etc. Gills look fine. Dorsal fin is held close to his body more than normal. I have not initiated any treatment apart from raising the thermostat slightly. On your advice I will turn back to where it was - won't have raised temp in two hours. You mention I need to check water parameters - what other parameters should I check other than the ones I have recorded above? You say to get my water right - what do I need to change? I thought my water was pretty good!! Ignorance is bliss... Thanks, Sam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snookie Posted November 6, 2007 Report Share Posted November 6, 2007 sounds like the start of white spot (itch) to me , or could br particles in the water ,that is annoying sevs gills , and that can cause shimmering , raising temp will speed up cycle of itch ,raising temp for a few days will not harm fish ,as long as water is well oxygenated Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jn Posted November 6, 2007 Report Share Posted November 6, 2007 I never hear anyone mention velvet? Is it uncommon? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tHEcONCH Posted November 6, 2007 Report Share Posted November 6, 2007 I never hear anyone mention velvet? Is it uncommon? Extremely uncommon - most fish succumb to something else and die long before velvet takes effect - I think it is more common overseas where they have heavily treated water. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tHEcONCH Posted November 6, 2007 Report Share Posted November 6, 2007 Hi Conch and JN, thanks for your responses. Conch I now find myself a little confused. My fish shows no sign of mucus around the gills as mentioned in the Cichlid forum article linked to above. He has not been scraping himself on things very often, it is mostly a tremor in his fins - tail fin, dorsal, etc. Gills look fine. Dorsal fin is held close to his body more than normal. I have not initiated any treatment apart from raising the thermostat slightly. On your advice I will turn back to where it was - won't have raised temp in two hours. You mention I need to check water parameters - what other parameters should I check other than the ones I have recorded above? You say to get my water right - what do I need to change? I thought my water was pretty good!! Ignorance is bliss... Thanks, Sam Do a retest to confirm, and if your water tests are favourable (they appear to be) and you have other fish that are fine, it may be that the fish is still getting used to your particular water chemistry - I'd just wait a couple of days and see if anything develops. You could test for copper, phosphate etc., but all the fish would be affected if those substances were present to dangerous levels. There is no point doing anything until you can pinpoint the cause - otherwise you'll just compound the problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caper Posted November 6, 2007 Report Share Posted November 6, 2007 Rather than start a new thread, I thought I'd post here because I have a goldfish who is doing the same thing! The other night he was "twitching" his body, almost in an "s" like shape. Only did this for a few seconds then stopped. I gave him as close a look as you can with him in his watery home :-? 8) and could not see anything on him or anything about him that didn't look "right". Last night, he did the same thing only thing different he did "flash" himself on the gravel. Again, I couldn't see anything on him. Water parameters are all fine. But as a precaution I did do a water change. For those of you who didn't see the thread, I had a power outage the other day (7.5 hours). He shares his home with another goldfish & 3 ottos (the other goldie is temp in the small tank) and so far have not seen them doing anything like he is doing. He is not doing this constantly, mind you I do not sit 24/7 in front of the tank, but it is in my living room by the TV so I do see what's going on in there quite a bit. Any suggestions? Caper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tHEcONCH Posted November 6, 2007 Report Share Posted November 6, 2007 Just wait. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caper Posted November 6, 2007 Report Share Posted November 6, 2007 Thank you Yes, I thought that too but wanted to check with all you wise fishy people. Not overly concerned just yet, because this is not something that is constantly happening. Caper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scuba Sam Posted November 17, 2007 Author Report Share Posted November 17, 2007 Hi all, thanks for all your suggestions. Snookie - you seem to have been on the right track. A couple of days later one of my clown loaches showed up with mild whitespot, and my severum had a few spots on one pectoral. I treated with half the recommended dose of Wunder Tonic, and all seems well. All fish look normal now, except my Severum has a raised red pimple on it. It sticks out more than it is wide, and has a visible blood vessel running to it. He seems happy enough. Any comments please? Sam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snookie Posted November 17, 2007 Report Share Posted November 17, 2007 could be a cyst ,any chance of a pic ? blood vessels are going to be more visible on a golden sev Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanmin4304 Posted November 17, 2007 Report Share Posted November 17, 2007 Velvet is actually quite common---particularly in some fish, but is not always easy to recognise. Nothobranchius killies are buggers for it. The easiest way to find it is to look at the fish with a torch at night with the lights out. If white spot looks like grains of salt then velvet looks like fine pepper. There are a number of cures but I used to use chelated copper sulphate. Check to see if that is the problem first. It is a similar disease to white spot in that what you see is a drug resistant cyst and you need to treat the vegetative stage when released from the cyst. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scuba Sam Posted November 19, 2007 Author Report Share Posted November 19, 2007 I will try to take a photo. If I can't upload it, can I email it to you snookie for loading pls? I have your email address... Thanks for suggestions, I will try the lights out trick. There is only one spot - does that make a difference to the velvet idea? Sam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snookie Posted November 19, 2007 Report Share Posted November 19, 2007 no worries sam 8) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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