Aftaburn

Assuming you want nothing to survive... sodium metabisulphate disolves them pretty well (home brew sterilizer). I take it you've still got them albiet no snails now? Hardy... yeah and some. Potassium permangenate upsets them (they split like crazy with double (might've been stronger) dose). I ended up using sodium metabi... on top so dunno if it would've finished them off eventually but doubt they'd divide out of existance. Formalin doesn't seem to bother them much if at all even if way higher dose than anything else will cope with.

Most of my tanks have guppies... as far as them cleaning up the planaria I haven't noticed them having any effect on the population. I suspect Corydoras & Angelfish possibly do have an effect but cant confirm this 100%. I've heard members of the Gourmis family do eat planaria most noteably Paradise fish. Thanks for the suggestion though, do you have planaria?

I've never seen anything eat planaria although I suspect Corydoras may be helping keep them under control. They aren't a problem overly... now I suck em up at water change time... one way to remove the bulk each time you change water is to have shallow gravel & a piece of wood on it, move the wood & vacum under it as most of the planaria will be there. Syphon removal seems to be the most effective control I've found.... bamboo makes them go nuts. They can be destroyed but when it happened I was unsure of exactly what got them in the finish had been trialing formalin & temperature shock & starvation & suspect it could be possible paraformaldehyde formed & took them out but I dont know as I didn't repeat the process enough times & confirm any specific set of parameters. The strong baths of formalin weren't the most effective (at 100x the normal formalin dose). If you have planaria: Minimize gravel volume Have some wood you can vaccum under Keep your gravel very clean & move it around a bit when syphoning as this loosens planaria Dont feed heavily Dont assume theyre gone when you havent seen them for a while (they'll be there). Dont transfer anything from a contaminated tank to an uncontaminated (I use seperate nets even & syphons are very dangerous for transfering them). I did try leaving plant in an empty tank for months in an effort to starve them off but it didn't work. Only one guaranteed removal method exists I'm aware of & thats strong chemical sterilization (sodium metabisulphate does the trick).

I'd have to guess that if given a series of washes they'd clean out most of the unwanted material & bugs... couldn't they then be put through a series of broad spectrum bug treatments & rewashed assuming they survived the treatment. I may be able to keep them in running water for a few days off & on untill clean (temp at a guess 10 C). So far as the dairy farm goes... I don't know of any locally as the area is better suited to vineyards than dairy untill you're closer to central southland. I have to go to Manapouri in a few days time perhaps I can find a dairy farm en route. Does anyone know the method used to clean frozen bloodworm? They're supposedly bug free. ***alanmin4304... I take it you don't supply them to shops now... is that due to bug problems? How did you clean them? 45lbs about a 20 litre bucket solid!! thas a lot of worms. Can you still supply clean worms? BTW is anyone going to be in Queenstown over winterfest (started Friday for 10 days)? I was up Coronet yesterday & although a bit thin in a couple of places the snow is pretty good (the Remarkables is just open). Theres a few other things I need to look at re tubifex such as: lifecycle temperature range treatment tollerances / intollerances culture volumes vs productivity potential food sources (possibly rabbit pellets). Are tubifex native to NZ or are they something that came about with cows?

Does anyone have or know where I can get a Tubifex worm culture?

Solid colours is a big ask... closest I've got is greeny teal... waiting on photos really then you can see what I've got.

If you can keep the conditions stable they should be ok. I'd be insulating the tank round the sides exposed to sun & or non viewing areas if putting it anywhere subject to temperature fluctuations. Cant see it being a good idea without heating though & as I assume you'll have a filter of some sort running (you might want to lag your plumbing) power shouldn't be an issue. Personally... I'd avoid sun. I had thought of putting guppies outside in a heavily insulated tank myself at one stage (no room in lounge) but was looking at double or triple glazing for the exposed glass & arranging so no direct sun. All the literature I've seen suggests avoid drafts near tanks... I looked a while back at a project to put about a 1000 litre tank outside but I think they opted for goldfish in the end due to simplicity & hadn't double glazed / insulated when it was built, that tank I'd expect to be exposed to as low as -10 celcius. White Clouds would handle it (had some outside temp was over 30 at one stage & down to 8 with about a 5 degree day/night fluctuation at a guess). None of the plants I had with them survived but young white clouds did well fed entirely by daphnia growing in the tank. Albino guppies... I had an Albino Cobra pattern male but he didn't produce offspring (not that I've seen yet anyway) & seems to have expired recently while I was away... I'll keep an eye out he may be still about. If anyone is looking for large volumes of mixed guppies I have about 2000 at various stages... photos pretty blurry so far I'm waiting for a photographer friend to upgrade her digital camera gear & hopefully will get some decent photos soon.

Had a silly idea... of posting a number of photos & doing the what flavour is that thing. The sort of thing I had in mind was if for example each picture posted have the opportunity for people to submit what flavour they'd class it as. Take a list of classes/flavours (with photo) & do a most desired list which could have more added as people come up with new fishes. Would be nice to perhaps have 2 lists one international class & one NZ class. Something along those lines anyways maybe just a silly idea. Any thoughts? Not sure how to make that work on a website as yet but it shouldn't be too hard maybe its just a silly idea.

Afore mentioned growth rates seem about right to full size depending on conditions. I''d estimate some are getting close to full size in 10 weeks but most a little longer. I currently have around 1800 guppies at a guess... the nickname "millions of fish" seems fairly appropriate. Feeding regime includes sometimes several dried flake feeds daily and brine shrimp daily. Large tank definately helps as do water changes... one of my rules of thumb is... if in doubt, change more water... if they look sad, change more water. In answer to your question specifically... I'd give them both if possible. Even my adults enjoy a bit of brine shrimp regularly... anything really they just like to eat. Hope thats helpful.

Some have had trouble with these worms... I don't know about the availability of the stuff but here is a treatment meathod from "Fish Diseases" Dieter Untergasser. The worms are very resistant, thus difficult to combat. Treatment Meathod C6 is effective. Flubendazol and acetone or DMSO, flubenol 5% Flubendazol is a solvent used for gill, skin and intestinal workms. Since the active ingredent is insoluble in water, it has to be first disolved in and organic solvent. Dimenthylsulfoxide (DMSO) was used in recent years. It is very toxic and should not come in contact with unprotected human skin. In nocase should children get hold of it. Fish tolerate it well when no other chemicals or drugs are in the water. Even water preparation substances can become toxic in the presence of DMSO. The tank or breeding facilities must be in an absolutely clean condition. High levels of nitrite or ammonia, in the presence of DMSO, can become leathal to fish. Rinsing out the filter material and changing a large portion of the water beforehand has a good effect. DMSO also causes an unpleasant tank odor for weeks. Since treatment also kills gill worm eggs, the treatment does not have to be repeated . Because of all of the above riskis associated with DMSO, it should not be used by aquarists any longer. Acetone has been used very successfully since 1988 as a well tolerated solvent for flubedazol. All gill and intestinal worms as well as their eggs are destroyed. Only at 100x normal doseage does acetone become toxic to fish. It does not leave any unpleasant odors in the vicinity of the tank. Feeding with flubenol 5% in feed mix B5 destroys the intestinal worms but reinfection is possible wen fish pick up eggs from the bottom. DOSEAGE A: For each 100 litres of tank water, put 200mg flubenol 5% in a small glass (do not use plastic) and then add 5ml acetone or DMSO. After agitating several minutes, distribute the ilky suspension over the surface of the water. After five to eight days begin to remove the medication by water changes. The water can become silightly turbid. Aerate the water well during treatment. Bacterial overgrowtn may occur in many cases, causing turbitity and oxygen-depletion symptos in the fish. An immediate major water change is necessary. Dosage B: Add 100 mg flubenol 5% to 100g feed mix B5 Give it five times every second day. On those days feed only once with the regular diet. Microscopic monitoring of the treament will not reveal any results for ten days, but after this time the worms begin to die. That is expected because flubenol 5% blocks the resorption of certain nutrients from the intestine, thus straving the worms. That taks about eight days for gill worms, for Wxyurdia about ten days, adn for Capillaria anout 15 days. In the female worms, however, damage to the egg walls can be seen as soon as the second day of treament. They seem malformed and burst when expelled. Therfore there are no worms eggs visible in the feces or on the gills by the third day of treatment. Method B5 Recipie for preparation of medicinal feed. Prepare a mash of 2/3 beef heart or lean beef and one third spinach. Both ingredients must be minced small enough to be ingested by small fish. After torough mixing, 50 gram protins are froxen in small plastic containers or bags then later thawed as needed. Now, to a small tin can, add 50ml cold water and 1 gram powdered agar agar. A tiny amount of red food dye makes the feed more appetizing, as does some Maggi, not more than needed for a cup of sup. Strir with a small fork while heating the can fo mix in a wate bath until the agar dissolves and the solution thickens. at about 80 deg C, stir in the 50g beef mash in small portions without letting the temperature drop significantly. When all the beef mash is stirred in, remove the tin can from the water bath and let it cool slowly. Depending on its heat stability, the medication is stirred into the hot, liquid feed or added just before solidification at about 40-50 deg C (follow the instructions under meathods of treatment). Many antibiotics do not tollerate any heat, so the feed must be cooled quickly (refrigerator 2 to 5 deg C) after stirring in the active ingredient. Do not let it freeze or the agar again liquifies. The finished feed has a solid, rubbery consistency and fish like to eat it once the become accustomed to it. It can be kept 3 days in a refrigerator at 2 to 5 deg C. For feeding, cut the mass into mouth size pieces that will remain solid in the aquarium at up to 28 deg C (just 82 F). After 12 hours at the most, all uneaten food jst be removed from the tank, otherwise it will become moldy, Any antibiotics mixed into the feed soon lose thier effacy, therefore do not give more medicated feed than can be eaten in an hour.

I've cleaned out most tanks & am trying to run very clean tanks 50% water 2nd day. Only one tank has substraite & the neons are healthy again after a long bath of furan 2. 1 black neon is swimming upward constantly. I should have a UV sterilizer arriving tomorrow hopefully that eliminates the bug permanantly. I've got 7 tanks & run in through a purifier, several are species tanks & sick fish get seperate housing as I only have guppies in one at this stage. Most tanks are quarantined now. zeolite seems to help with nts but so do very frequent water changes. I change 2 tanks daily generally. I'm getting salt free guppies from an importer who has the fish in quarantine now. No idea what they are but the next batch he gets in he will find me whichever I wish via a contact in Thailand. I have specific fish from a specific breeder that I want. They are guranteed clean fish & some of the nicest guppies I've ever seen, most are solid colour. I'm still trying to source King Cobra guppies to satin cross & see what happens. All fish healthy except 1 tank of guppies which has had 2 females die within 12 hours of each other. The babies are doing fine & the 2 pair of adults one female looks really good the other... so so but shes still dropping so im not complaining. The wonky neon is the only other puzzle. The new fish will be brought into identical conditions they were kept in quarantine & quarantined from each other. Water in is treated with Cycle then Aqua Plus or Stress Coat depending on circumstances. Most of my tanks all get regular Corgette slices & they love them. The Planaria... vastly reduced & in quarantined plant holding with a formalin bath starving out. Then I'll make clean cuttings from there of everything I can which is cleanable & tested to guarantee no Planaria (easy to test for so you do know for sure, put some dry bamboo in the tank for 2 weeks & if theres one theres 10,000 any tank overfeeding system should do provided it can handle the ammonia load) 3 leaf cuttings can be cleaned & held in quarantine to planaria free them. Using a tray I've found it is effective lowering the water level with the plants in the tray & the Planaria go for the water below every time. It doesn't gurantee removal... seeding clean new plants with 100 planaria & getting them all off successfully would suggest a fairly effective meathod for larger volumes. Quarantine batches thereafter untill absolutely certain they're clean. As everything else is in quarantine from everything mostly bug & planaria are coming nicely under control. The surviving healthy Gourmis are in a new home & doing fine in a 165 litre planted community tank. Hopefully by running all inbound water through the UV sterilizer & running bare tanks with water sprite only (isolated stocks of seperate origin) & cycling the UV around the tanks on a regular basis will help keep my tanks clean & healthy. Some tanks will get 25% changes daily depending on stock level. I've got a nicely developing new community tank with a heated florabase substrate & clean planaria free plant for the main tank occupants. Cabomba goes insane with CO2 added in & zeolite keeps the ammonia under control for now with 2nd day water changes. Tank partially cycled with Daphnia so the fish had a snack on arrival. I have 2 daphnia cultures which are perfectly clean & have been in large sealed jars forever without input just the occasional harvest & water top up (did that once & split 3 litres of culture added tiny bit of zuchini skin to one with no noticible difference between cultures since) now I have about 5 litres of it left. Corydoras cleaned up the algae problem on the Florabase tank & everything cleaned up the daphina & has been happy as since. Theres another with about 50 young bristlenose. Time will tell I guess but I think its finally sorted. With healthy guppies as a result... hopefully. Has anyone got really stunning guppies they can guarantee are "good" about? I just hope it works.

affected fish did not survive. Yes it looked like the blue fish but extremely wasted. Those treatment ingredients sound familiar that is probably what caused the death in the finish... was a very nice fish the other which I brought in both died of wasting & bacterial skin infections. I haven't diagnosed the cause yet. The disease hadn't been particularly noticeable when these fish arrived but the rate the disease progressed suggested it was bacterial. The infected fish went down pretty fast. I have to wonder then about formalin, is it safe with gourmis? I know Corydoras & Bristlenose & Melanotaenia boesmani + Melanotaenia praecox can handle it at about a 65% strength dose. I could do with treating the tank with a broad spectrum antibiotic & fungicide. Whats safe at full strength with a huge mixture of species that covers the works shy stripping down a tank which has been established for 18 months. I tend to try to dose longer about 60% doserate bath treatment which usually works pretty well with a very mixed community tank. My biggest problem with disease treatment is that I'm not certain of which species disagree with which treatments it'd be nice to have a chart with that kind of info. Catfish all dose half strength & they'll be ok but I've never noticed a single diseased catfish excepting corydoras fry. Tank temperature 26.4 for the main community tank. Isolation tank for sick gourmis 28.0 celcius. Its completely hopeless trying to catch fish also in the tank they're now in... far too much hard & soft cover for them with heaps of logs... I built a glass trap which lets me get most of the catfish eventually but bristlenose have no trouble escaping quickly even with a neck. With the sump the tank is about 600 litres 4' x 2' 6" x 2' roughly. I'd have quarantined the fish when they came in but for no empty tanks available. I tend to lose fish in the plant cover in the tank this little red guy had been they were hiding mainly near the surface & I usually have to wait for a while to see the female she disappeared for a week at first. I think that fish had had the disease for several days without me seeing it the gourmis seem to be delicate feeders compared with rainbows which strike, probable they also were simply outcompeted although I still have a very healthy female doing well & 2 tiny dwarf gourmis the red fish was approx 50mm in length these guys are about 15mm (the female about 40mm).

Shannon... yeah I had wanted to do that but... everything else is tied up full of fish & although I've got glass & goo I dont have anywhere else for more tanks... I've already got them in stacks so up is no longer an option. The computer desk is also shared by an aquarium (guppies). Ideally I think you're onto the answer... but where do I put a large 4 foot tank worth of fish for 2 months while I deal with the issue... also they'd need to be spread across several systems as some species are fine & others so so. Then theres the plants... ... then theres the planaria infection which has been in that tank... possibly killed by gourmis & formalin but I've learnt something... never assume the last one is gone coz as soon as you do they'll be back... nothing is sureer. The plants host the planaria (well the ones I cant sterilize for). ... kinda tricky... I could do with someone about with a few empty tanks to help out with the housing problem for a while but I seem to be the only one from QT area that visits this forum. I'd like to see some sort of aquarist club start up here but the transient nature of the town doesn't help... it'd be nice to have several serious keepers work together for the common good.

I haven't tried salt but will... wasn't sure if it was a good idea with gourmis. What dose rate do you use for salt?

I've got a recent spawn of bristlenose catfish... when a little bigger they'd be my pick for algae control.

Dwarf bummer

Seems to be a fitting name for the guppy bug. I recently bought some which appear to be virus free. From East Road Pets in Invercargill. I haven't had guppies in 10 years due to the bug. These are spawning well & appear to be healthy fish which will be available once suitably sized. I suspect most stock coming into NZ of guppies is either already infected or infected during the importation etc... process. I'm starting to investigate the possibility of importing some from the USA as I think I've found a breeder with the sort of stock we could do with in NZ. If this goes ahead I'll be clearing the current stock I have & sterilizing everything before starting with the new strains. NZ needs a supply of quality guaranteed "virus free bug free guppies". Has anyone here done anything like this before. I'm just starting out with the import idea & am prepared to go to a fair amount of trouble to make it work. I thought I had a quarantine facility orgainized but cant get hold of the guy... can anyone help me set this up? I'd be quite happy to go in with a few others wanting to start fresh with clean fish (can get more true breeding strains going here as a result as I can probably handle 2 max & it'd be nice to be able to access some of the others from time to time). Anyone interested in helping out or joining in? I've just started organizing this so as yet am still waiting on a strains list & photos. I'd like to be able to import say 10 or more different varieties if possible & set them up around NZ so we can keep a supply of quality guppies in NZ. Perhaps I've posted this in the wrong section but... guppies & bug seem to have become sorta... one. I'd like to see that change.

Large very heavily planted community tank. Ongoing finrot & fungus outbreaks. Tank has been established nearly 2 years. I've dosed with furan, methblue, malachite green, quinine, formalin. It seems to clear up but keeps returning... I'm starting to think I'm not managing to kill the bug off in the substrate which I cant syphon due to heavy planting. Ideas anyone? This has been about for a long while. Finally I think too the planaria problem is diminishing (formalin / gourmis treatment) they have been reduced only to the main community system. I don't lose many fish to this but it is a regular annoyance. I've run the treatments up to 2 weeks without improved results.

I bought several Gourmis recently... ... of 7 I only have 4 left. Symptoms: extreme wasting, skin looks rough (like potential skin infection possibly secondary infection). They drop fast, it seems to take about 3 days to knock them over. I have one removed to a hospital tank currently treated with a combo treatment of: Acriflavin, Meth-Blue, Melachite Green, Quinine, & furan. Yes all combined, yes marginal for overdose. Fish feeding fine, which I'm taking as a good sign. I have also used formalin which is currently out of the treatment. Still got the bug though which I'm sure came in with the same fish which are infected. Anyone got any ideas?

Yes neons are supposed to be hard to breed. So far as I know you need a special setup to manage it. Re: Dropsy... how to tell: Fish looks like pinecone. Often they also get popeye at the same time. It is caused by a massive bacterial infection which bloats the fish hence the scales (or something like that). It is easy to recognize even in small fish. The best option if you get it is to dispose of infected fish or remove to hospital tank for treatment (can be treated by antibiotic but the most effective you'll have trouble getting (Chloramaphenicol I think). For treatment instructions see my earlier post in this thread There are several others but I have not had luck with them & I cant get Chloramaphenicol as its distribution is controlled.

Thanks suphew Any idea how they get around water treatment issues such as fertilizer & water conditioners. That was basically what I was looking at as an initial system. Ideally eventually I'd like to move to a PC controlled system but it seems likely quite expensive to set up. PC benefits include data logging giving a conditions picture over a period of time, also condition/quality triggered events eventually.

Thanks guys... lol... ok here is how I see it... For starters I am a slug at maths but... 1+1=11 Chimera... I think your maths works the best... makes perfect sense $15 change sounds about rite (i failed englisssh two). As for the mixing etc... for arguement sake lets say its one 500 liter tank... no my friend who can tie both his shoe laces unassisted says its impossible to put more water in than you put in. I think he might have a point (really not sure its a tough one). Ok something I need to clarify... the tanks are NOT connected in series for those unsure. Water input... probably near the filter intake. Water overflow... from near the surface at the opposite end of the tank. Mixing very well. I take it no-one here has actually done this before?? System Definition: Semi-Open i.e. I think its self explanatory but... partly open system means fresh throughput plus recycling processing simultaneously. Evapouration issues: None I have excellent lids (hatchet fish) therefore evapouration = condensation and returns to tank (in other words not an issue). Maths aside any ideas? To be perfectly honest the mathematical side is a minor detail imho. The bottom line still has to be if enough is being changed it is if not its not, so... make damn sure it is enough which should be relatively easy. These tanks have rainbows so effectively changing a huge percentage weekly will likely be appreciated, I'll change heavier rather than lighter the limiting factors being heating and water treatment. So far as overflows go on a mixing sump... system output is the factor that drives input hence the ballcock arrangement... good point though I could use overflows & just control the overall system input but... that doesn't give precise control over the individual tank inputs the way I'm looking at controlling it.

The tanks will need to be sterilized in the move & will be set up with fresh gravel so will be prone to new tank syndrome. Probably I want to change 30% daily automatically with treatments & possibly a heater on full time in a sump with a ballcock arrangement with failsafe drain. I've got 20L or 40L plastic header tanks, hoses & tubing some basic taps. The system has to be able to run a total working aquarium capacity of 1000L. There are 3 water conditioning agent controls needed. Has anyone done this or have any ideas on what taps & controls I can use?

I'm likely going to be moving house shortly & want to set up an automatic water changing system for a variety of size tanks. The new landlord will let me drill through the floor for drainage. The tanks are at different heights with capacities ranging from 60 liter to 400 liter. Anyone got any suggestions? I had thought possibly a drip system for input & could look at sumps along side each tank running an syphon overflow which overflows to the drain. The idea is to avoid drilling holes in the tanks & for speed & efficency of implimentation. If I limit the throughput of the system ideally it should change 20% of the total water volume weekly. I would rather have a slow enough trickle system that chlorine is not a problem although there may be chloramine in the local water supply. I don't intend to preheat water either. The tanks will likely end up spread around a lounge so plumbing lengths will probably vary considerably.

I once heard that Pyrethrum can be deadly to fish at a concentration of parts per billion. I wont allow it in my house. Cactus's also work well for flies if you've enough along the window sill, mine spear them regularly. What about a bug zapper??