lduncan Posted May 3, 2006 Report Share Posted May 3, 2006 :roll: I'm sorry I didn't explain fully. Well Deltec for example sell re-badged merck test kits. It's well known. It would be nice to know what the KZ one is, that's all. After all KZ (just like deltec) aren't in the business of water testing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lduncan Posted May 3, 2006 Report Share Posted May 3, 2006 Didn't quote you out of context at all. Never have. I used the principles you stated in another thread, to assist you to answer your own questions in this one. The meaning of what you said is unchanged. Please don't get all defensive and turn this into another arguing thread. That's not what you've done. You have completely changed the meaning. I'll PM you why, and keep the details out of this thread. As for the other questions in your post, I don't know the answers. I told you before I've answered you as fully as I can. I am not a walking dictionary on all things! :lol: I wasn't specifically addressing you, it's just some things to think about. Bottom line, I don't know what potassium does, how it works, and whatever. But dosing it as needed has been shown to give nice results. And you should know me by now, "If it works, I'll use it" :lol: . That's fine. If you do come across anything interesting on potassium, post it. Layton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chimera Posted May 3, 2006 Report Share Posted May 3, 2006 That's not what you've done. You have completely changed the meaning. I'll PM you why, and keep the details out of this thread. great idea. keep the thread on topic! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted May 3, 2006 Report Share Posted May 3, 2006 Layton I'll give you one thing, you are good at searching things out, in fact you enjoy it. You have asked a heckuva lot of questions in this thread, and I'd be interested in the answers to them myself, as would others. Howzabout you go searching it all out elsewhere, and report back, myself and others will be interested. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lduncan Posted May 3, 2006 Report Share Posted May 3, 2006 Another interesting thing is that some people have been dosing potassium for years in the form of iodine additions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted May 5, 2006 Report Share Posted May 5, 2006 Did you find the answers to any of your questions Layton? Other than that I've used it I don't really know any more on the subject than you did, so would be interested in anything you have found. As would others. I'll be getting one of those test kits also, so that will be interesting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lduncan Posted May 5, 2006 Report Share Posted May 5, 2006 Nope. Busy at work. I'll get round to looking some time. You know there's nothing stopping you from looking too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cracker Posted May 5, 2006 Report Share Posted May 5, 2006 Another interesting thing is that some people have been dosing potassium for years in the form of iodine additions. That would depend whether it was Pottasium iodide or sodium iodide. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cracker Posted May 5, 2006 Report Share Posted May 5, 2006 I dont think it is any of those either. iodine is dosed not iodide. Not sure where you get the pottasium portion layton. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lduncan Posted May 5, 2006 Report Share Posted May 5, 2006 It is generally the iodide ion which is dosed. Elemental iodine is still a relatively strong oxidizer (like ozone or chlorine but not as reactive), not something you usually want to be adding directly to the tank. It serves it's purpose as a dip, but what's added to the aquarium as a supplement is generally iodide. Many commercial iodine supplements are potassium iodide (Seachem, Red Sea etc). The iodine you get from the chemist is different, it can be a mixture of different things: elemental iodine dissolved in alcohol and potassium iodide are common. Why is potassium used over sodium? Well KI is commonly used in medicine, it's used in preference to NaI because NaI is hydgroscopic. KI is less hydgroscopic. Because KI is more widely used than NaI, it's easier and less expensive to get hold of, and that's why i guess most commercial supplements use it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cracker Posted May 5, 2006 Report Share Posted May 5, 2006 Mmmm... So adding iodine is a way to get both then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TM Posted May 7, 2006 Author Report Share Posted May 7, 2006 Check this out http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showt ... ost6022178 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted May 7, 2006 Report Share Posted May 7, 2006 Well that's interesting! What has had me wondering also, is that only a tiny amount is dosed, which I would have thought would make little difference to the total amount in the water, yet it had a very good effect. Bit of a mystery Also, it is not that zeovit have got some secret ingredient in it or anything, because the first potassium I ever dosed was not the zeovit one, just commercially available potassium chloride, a tiny amount, and the effect was quite marked. A few days ago I heard from another respected reefer on this forum who said he tried it, but there was no effect! So - there is still much to learn. Just one thing I'd say to anyone thinking of trying it, be careful not to overdose, keep the amount tiny. Also, as far as I can tell, it only works if the acros are already showing nice colours, it's not going to colour up brown ones or anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lduncan Posted May 8, 2006 Report Share Posted May 8, 2006 Placebo effect maybe? Looks like an interesting thread, I'll read it properly tonight. Looks like Habib answered many of my questions: Not one of the 9 brands of salts tested for potassium showed a low concentration. As a matter of fact they all had potassium close to natural seawater values: http://saltaquarium.about.com/gi/dy...s/1/default.asp From the scientific data I have seen regarding potassium and corals and from my own data and those of others I have to conclude, so far, that potassium is hardly depleted in aquaria even not if it is fully packed with corals. Layton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted May 8, 2006 Report Share Posted May 8, 2006 Placebo effect maybe? . No. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TM Posted May 8, 2006 Author Report Share Posted May 8, 2006 . No. How do you no. Would you have seen the same results if you didn't dose anything??? I don't know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted May 8, 2006 Report Share Posted May 8, 2006 A placebo effect is when someone is given fake medicine for a headache, or whatever, and they get better, cos it's psychological. They imagined they would get better, so they did. The nice purples that came about each time I dosed potassium were not imaginary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lduncan Posted May 8, 2006 Report Share Posted May 8, 2006 I think you miss the point of the whole concept behind the placebo effect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZEOvitANZ Posted May 8, 2006 Report Share Posted May 8, 2006 We will see, I presume when, we get our test kits. But also be careful what you are saying about a product Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lduncan Posted May 8, 2006 Report Share Posted May 8, 2006 Well I find it interesting that Habib as the owner Salifert, a company which produces both test kits and supplements, has looked at research, and by the sound of it experimented with potassium, shows little interest in producing a test kit or potassium additive. Randy has stated: I don't doubt that if potassium were very low, that there might be issues. However, potassium does not seem to typically become depleted in reef aquaria. There is no significant sink for it, and there is a lot in seawater. Layton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cracker Posted May 8, 2006 Report Share Posted May 8, 2006 Another thing to be careful about is that Potasium Chloride is the mixture used, (At 100ppm) for the LETHAL INJECTION In prisons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chimera Posted May 8, 2006 Report Share Posted May 8, 2006 another thing to be aware of, with all this talk of dosing xxx chloride (calcium, magnesium, potassium etc) is that the chloride component cannot be removed other than by water changes. i think layton suggested dosing magnesium chloride and calcium something? to ensure you're closer to the levels of seawater? sorry cant remember exact name Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lduncan Posted May 8, 2006 Report Share Posted May 8, 2006 Another thing to be careful about is that Potasium Chloride is the mixture used, (At 100ppm) for the LETHAL INJECTION In prisons. I think that should be 100 meq which is approx 7,400 ppm (7.4 ppt) Chim, that was when adding magnesium. A combo of sulfate and chloride to try and balance things a little more due to the mass that needs to be added. For dosing things like potassium, by the sound of how much is generally added, it's a non issue. The amount of chloride added is really not significant relative to the concentration which is already there. Which makes me wonder where the rumor that the chloride added if you dose potassium chloride causes corals to brown came from. Layton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cracker Posted May 8, 2006 Report Share Posted May 8, 2006 another thing to be aware of, with all this talk of dosing xxx chloride (calcium, magnesium, potassium etc) is that the chloride component cannot be removed other than by water changes. i think layton suggested dosing magnesium chloride and calcium something? to ensure you're closer to the levels of seawater? sorry cant remember exact name Chimera, not sure if you're aware, but NSW is 60% Sodium Chloride. In other words most of the water in your tank is a chloride which is a neutral form of chlorine! Convert it and your tanks history... but dosing XXX chlorides is a non issue because there is so much chloride any way. You would probably have to dose for one whole year before you dosed enough chlorides to increase the existing 60% concentration by anything that would be worthy of worrying. There has been ZERO issues arising from the sole use of chlorides in reef tanks. I have hunted the web fully. If you are keen to prove me wrong I would love to read the info you do find and learn some more! Layton and others have been taking about adding MAG Sulphate, (Epsom salts), in order to balance things with the chloride, but I dont know how imoprtant sulphate is in relation to mag. I know there is a lot of sulphate which I think does help with corals....May have a read later maybe! Layton? anything? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cracker Posted May 8, 2006 Report Share Posted May 8, 2006 You would probably have to WATER CHANGE...(sorry, wrong word there). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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