ljtan55 Posted April 17, 2006 Report Share Posted April 17, 2006 Hi everyone, Its amazing seeing how much information there is here , and its nice to have a site that discusses nz shops and trademe items. Been browsing through the forum everytime I see something in trademe... Anyways, I've just moved up from down south, got a new job and everything so just settlin in, but I've been itching to get a bigger aquarium. I've had some experience with dwarf gouramis, ottos and blue rams, but have never got any of them to breed which is a big goal for me :lol: Got one of those small octagonal 10 gallon one at the moment planted with 3 small goldfish, a borneo sucker and 2 armored cats, but my real interest is in discus and bettas. The great news is my birthdays coming up and I'm thinking about getting either the aqua one 620T or the Jebo R390 from: http://aquariumfx.shopnz.biz/catalog/in ... 1fe68e26e1 Has anyone had any experiences with either of these tanks? The 620T looks really good, but the Jebo R390 costs about the same but has about 90 litres more. And i can't really decide if i want a community tank full of female fighters or discus and cardinals. Any advice? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharn Posted April 17, 2006 Report Share Posted April 17, 2006 welcome to the forums!! discus are IMO alot harder to care for maintenance wise compared to say your average community tank, they need very very clean water. i would advise you to get the biggest tank you can afford, no need for it to be a flash tank but the equipment must be of good quality. i would also work your way up to discus, fighters are much easier to care for than discus, discus arent fraglie fish if you keep their water nice but they aint called 'the king of the aquarium' for nothing :lol: i would suggest going with a community tank with your female bettas and other tankmates for starters, discus need at least 40L per adult and overstocking will see you upping your water changes (i normally do 30% every 2-3 days on my normal discus tank). fighters dont need much room but theyd prefer more than a glass id imagine. go with the jebo, 90L more is a fair amount and larger bodies are easier to keep stable. im not too sure how well those filters on those tanks work tho so you may need to look at getting another, ive never had flash tanks like that. you can always work your way up the scale with fish. in the end what fish you want to keep is up to you but be prepared to put alot more effort in for discus if you go that way, i advise you read up on www.simplydiscus.com as that has a fair amount of good stuff. you pay for their prettyness by the work you put in p.s. might want to upgrade goldfish tank, messy buggers that can reach 30cm long depending on species, most grow averagly large (might be time to build that pond huh) :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jude Posted April 17, 2006 Report Share Posted April 17, 2006 Hi and welcome to the forum. It's great to hear you're already finding all the information useful. Cheers Jude Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ljtan55 Posted April 17, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2006 Wow gotta say didn't expect replies so quick. Thanks for the information Sharn, been reading through that site you gave me and Im leaning more towards getting discus now. I've had a couple of experiences with the male bettas in the past, tried going community with them, but betta 1 systematicly attacked and killed all the platies so he had to be returned to the store, betta 2 commited suicide by jumping out of the tank during a water change. But I hear the females are not as aggressive so was interested in getting 5 or 6 of them in a community tank. Made a big mistake last year by buying ONE discus to put in my octagonal 10 gallon when I was completely clueless about them (the LFS had them on half-price), and compounded my mistake by putting ottos in with him. Many long hours reading later, and realising I had a lonely discus plagued by attack ottos, I decided to put him up for adoption with someone with a much bigger discus tank. Lol as I'm rambling about my fish troubles, a platy I got when I was down in Dunedin got a bent spine, and the lady and the fish store thought he had tuberculosis? And a lone female dwarf gourami suddenly got aggressive homicidal and dessimated my school of sterba's cories, all these things happening within a year and a half So probably going to get the bigger tank (224 litres). The jebo is 900lx 480d x 520h with an inbuilt filter, which you can put in ceramic noodles with? Might look at getting the external canister filters to supplement it if its not enough. How would you know if your filter isn't strong enough btw? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharn Posted April 18, 2006 Report Share Posted April 18, 2006 ok, thats around my size, youd be able to fit five in properly, pushing six with no other fish apart from a few small ones that dont really add to the bio load. i have no experience with those filters on those tanks, theyre small so wouldnt hold much media other than a few cartridges maybe and not sure how my LPH which is what you need to look at, dont trust it when it says 'for tanks up to 200L' cause every tank has specific requirements for the different stocking and fish. i would definatly look at getting another canister. bent spines are normally just a defomity from bad genes etc, tb is pretty hard out, they normally get sores i think. i have no other advice for you other than to READ READ READ and read some more about discus, make sure you have access to metro or something to treat hex with (youll find more about that in your readings) as its pretty common. with a tank that size and fish over 6-8cm your wanting to do water changes at least every 2-3 days of 30%, if you can do 50% a day go for it! do remember other fish may not like those water changes but discus love it as long as its got the same params as the tank water. you will quickly find you need to buy a aging bin/barrel. any fish smaller than 6-8 cm i wouldnt buy if your wanting to put them into a normal tank as youd want to grow them out a bit more, get the biggest you can afford (healthiest too). people make the mistake (me included) of buying babies cause theyre cheaper, raising them is hard and it doesnt always work out. start with ones at least 10cm (not including tail!) and you should find it alot easier. if you would like me to put you onto a good breeder in aucks chuck me a pm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Discusguru Posted April 18, 2006 Report Share Posted April 18, 2006 Have to agree with Sharn, if you are going for discus buy the biggest tank that you can afford and a good filter. Ronnie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ljtan55 Posted April 18, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 18, 2006 Wow thanks Sharn and Ronnie, was going to make heaps of mistakes. Bought a couple of books about discus when i got one last year, which made me realise mistake with buying only one, but they were pretty basic and didn't mention much about diseases. Is that metro = metronidazole? :lol: Quite good cos I'm a dentist so I use that quite a bit, didn't think I'd prescribe it for my fish tho :lol: Anyways thanks for that, saw a couple of babies in Jansens Botany so was kinda eyeing them but I'll stay away for the moment. Pity cos wanted to see em grow up but better off not killin them... Which canister filter would you guys recommend? Theres a guy selling a year old eheim 2213 classic on trademe, any difference buying new and used? And been reading lots of info about planted vs bare bottom tanks for discus, definately aiming for planted but do you think it'll be kinda difficult for a discus noob like me? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharn Posted April 19, 2006 Report Share Posted April 19, 2006 well if you are starting with fish under 8cm i think you should go for BB, but in saying that i dont advise it for your first tank (starting with small fish). BB tanks are able to be kept so much cleaner and while at first i thought they were ugly it really shows the discus off because you have nothing to look at other than them, maybe a nice piece of driftwood and a few potted plants. i have a planted discus tank and im itching to set up a BB just to see what the differences are. with a planted tank it really is hard to keep it ultra clean like a BB because of all the nooks and crannies poop gets into etc. i would not adivse you to get small discus, contact ronnie, he has some really good stock at sizes that would be good to start with and very reasonably priced too which is a bonus. dont buy from LFS, most fish at LFS arent in great health anyway and you want to make sure theyre super healthy for your starting ones. it will really help that much more to have healthy stock you dont need to grow up (growing up consisits of major water changes, ronnie does 80% twice daily on his!!!). looking back at it now if i wasnt so stubborn i would have gone with BB for starters, that way you can get used to keeping them and then go onto planted which can be a little harder. now with metro, it is a really handy thing to have on hand. hex is present in all discus but normally only takes over when they get stressed or have bad water conditions, it makes them have white stringy poop and it wont go away by itself. the most effective way to get it to them if they get sick is by food, that way itll go straight to their gut but you can dose it in the water, obviously not as effective though. alot of people treat any new discus they get with it even if they show no signs (in quarentine and something you will need to look into). alot of canisters are around, eheim are a really really good brand and if you can get it do so! the only downside of buying second hand is you have no warrenty, it might be a little noisier than brand new cause its been used etc etc. you need to completely sterilise the whole thing before it comes into contact with your tank. it would be advisable to either get yourself kits (so much handier) or get your water tested at a LFS, i didnt know we had really soft water and i was getting ph swings from low kh and it was upsetting my discus. theyre not as picky as everyone thinks about water quality, its stability thats the key unless you want to breed also if you buy kits then you can moniter the cycle. i would get ammonia, nitrite (you should have 0 for both readings, anything else is really bad) nitrate (as low as possible, i say anything over 20 you need to do a water change, checking your nitrites will tell you if you need to do one), ph and if your water is very soft kh and gh kits. dont bother getting kh and gh if the pet shop tells you its fine, you want a kh and gh of at least 3 degrees hardness (times by 17.9 to get ppm) IMO. hope this helps p.s. you do know about cycling right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ljtan55 Posted April 20, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 20, 2006 Thanks for the advice Sharn, yeah know a bit about nitrogen cycling, have an established tank at the moment, should help speed it along when I get the new one. Still looking around at the moment for good tanks still interested in those all in one tanks with the light and the filter but I've come to accept, the bigger the better lol. Bare bottomed sounds like a good idea at the moment, or maybe a hybrid tank like what i've been reading about, a little gravel and driftwood makes for a lot easier cleaning :lol: and looking online for good canister filters at the moment. Anyways at the moment looking at 3-5 medium size discus, with armored cats, cardinals, and possibly blue rams, heard they go well with discus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharn Posted April 20, 2006 Report Share Posted April 20, 2006 your tank mate list sounds good, what species of cats are you looking into? i would get at least 4 discus, preferably 6 if you can, they do better in groups because they feel more secure and then you dont have as much aggression problems, with three two often buddy up and pick on the other one or one becomes boss and nails the other two, third wheel syndrome i call it and 'hybrid' tanks do work well and often still look quite nice, if your wanting easy but still fairly 'natural' that would be a good way to go i think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ljtan55 Posted April 20, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 20, 2006 Yeah I'm thinking at least if you start out with a hybrid tank it doesn't take much to *convert* it to become a planted tank heh heh, which is where I know i'm gonna go... Spend too much time looking at plants at fish shops for that tank to stay bare for long :lol: But it'll be hybrid while I learn the ropes. The books I've been reading recommend at least 3 discus, but dun wanna overcrowd the tank. So basically dream tank goes: 5 discus 10? cardinals = nice big school 2 blue rams = male and female 5-7? sterbai cories cleaner fishes? May be a bit much for a 224 litre tank, but planning to have hood filter and canister filter going at the same time, any suggestions? Armor catwise hands down goes to sterbais, had a 3 of them which were AWESOME fish, really beautiful fish with HEAPS of personality, they used to aggravate my betta <-- real aggro and in on the other side of the divider, and really try to hack him off which i thought was hilarious. Unfortunately, crazy hormonal dwarf gourami did them in one by one... Water parameters wise tho dunno whether their suitable, they're ok in warmer temps so planning to maintain the tank at 28 degrees to 31 degrees but thats something i gotta check out. Read that plecos are bad for discus tanks, ottos as well cos they latch on to them. Saw my ottos do that to discus didn't leave any marks tho. Any experiences with cleaner fishes in discus tanks? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharn Posted April 21, 2006 Report Share Posted April 21, 2006 alot of people are suspcious about plecos and discus, i made my mind up after reading that some are more prone but ones like bristlenose (id look into them, plain but still really cool and dont get too large) are pretty good, keep them well fed on fresh vegies and they should stay away. the plecos eat the slime coat when they latch on which can leave the fish open to some nasty stuff. i would stay away from any common pleco, and if you wanted something fancier do your homework first, www.planetcatfish.com has a cat-e-log which would give you some good info though do realise we cant get all of them. your stocking list is fine, but do make sure you do water changes every 3 days at least, if you cant do that then i would suggest looking at other fish, it might sound hard out but really they do need clean water, rams are quite picky about their water also. sterbai are fine. cardinals are also fine. i keep my discus tank at 29C, 31C for normal tanks is a bit high IMO, most people keep their grow outs at that temp as it speeds up metabolism, just something to consider. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ljtan55 Posted April 21, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 21, 2006 Yeah thats what I heard about them too, heard the same about ottos too, so hopefully if i get a school of 6 and feed em well they'll leave my discus alone. Thanks for the site, but you know I haven't seen many sterbai's cories in the shops here. But anyways will cycle the tank for a couple of weeks, and the cardinals will go in first cos they're everywhere and a bit more hardier than the other fish that are going in. Heh heh can't wait planning stages almost complete, bank account is gonna look pretty empty sometime over the next couple of weeks, but I'm gonna be a happy broke fishowner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Discusguru Posted April 22, 2006 Report Share Posted April 22, 2006 Hi ljtan55, quote:Heh heh can't wait planning stages almost complete, bank account is gonna look pretty empty sometime over the next couple of weeks, but I'm gonna be a happy broke fishowner . Well you'll just have to extract a few more teeth , lol Ronnie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caper Posted April 23, 2006 Report Share Posted April 23, 2006 Hi there & welcome As you have seen, this site is fantastic! People are just great to help and have sooooooooo much knowledge Good luck with your plans and enjoy :bounce: :bounce: Take care, Caper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shelley Posted April 23, 2006 Report Share Posted April 23, 2006 Hi and welcome......Just got t say....that informatin from Sharn is soooooo helpful! It is amazing how quickly you can gain knwledge with people like Sharn who know all this stuff...and you hold it a lot better than reading it from a text book too because it is practical stuff....excellent sharing Sharn, thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharn Posted April 24, 2006 Report Share Posted April 24, 2006 wow, thankyou, i would certanly not say that i know alot about discus, ive only been keeping them for around 7 or 8 months myself but its all from reading and learning off people like discusguru (ronnie). these were the sort of questions i was asking at the start so i know how ya feel it feels like such a large jump because everyone tells you how hard they are to care for, yeah they might require more maintenance but its not like theyre going to just up and die if you feed them the wrong flake or something ya know :lol: when you weigh up keeping them it is definatly worth those few extra hours a week :bounce: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ljtan55 Posted April 24, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 24, 2006 Lol Ronnie I wish, new grad so huge student loan to pay :-?. Definately Shelley, Sharns' advise prob gonna be the only thing stopping my fish from keel over and dying, and everyones been great on this forum, big difference from the other forums I've been reading, doesn't have those big dramas an arguments you get sometimes. Just did my round of fish shops today, been to Hollywood, and Jansens Mt Eden, Goldfish Pagoda is closed so didn't get ta see much. But theres a LOT of aqua - one aquariums all quite pricey tho. Still partial to that Jebo I've been looking at the beginning so gonna take the plunge soon. heh heh. Plunge. I've been thinking about fish too much. :lol: Btw saw the arowanas at hollywood, gotta say they're beautiful creatures all shimmery and shiny, pity they need a huge tank. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharn Posted April 24, 2006 Report Share Posted April 24, 2006 ronnie is by far very very reasonable, im only 16 so i cant afford to spend 120+ per discus from the local fish shop, he doesnt straight out price each lot of fish, he'll be reasonable with you and charge according to size and how good they are (theyre all good but you know what i mean). honestly, pm him or something or pop around if you can, you'll probably be pleasantly surprised Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ljtan55 Posted April 24, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 24, 2006 Definately. Will be a couple of weeks before I get the tank, and then a couple of weeks more to cycle it, and then I'll get the cardinals-> cories -> ottos -> Discus, so its gonna be a looong time, at least a month and a half before I'll get the discus. Wow Sharn, can't believe you're only 16, your fishy knowledge is pretty extensive . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caryl Posted April 24, 2006 Report Share Posted April 24, 2006 Sorry for the late welcome but I have been away. Sharn knows lots cos she asks lots of questions and listens to the answers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharn Posted April 25, 2006 Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 tis true, spent hours and hours (and i mean like 5 hours a night 5 times a week) reading about fish, i still do it every day and ive got about 7 forums i frequent, gotta learn lots bout your fish to take good care of them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Discusguru Posted April 25, 2006 Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 Quote : gotta learn lots bout your fish to take good care of them .... or write a book about fish keeping Ron Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caper Posted April 25, 2006 Report Share Posted April 25, 2006 gotta learn lots bout your fish to take good care of them Yep that's for sure, I read alot & love coming to my number 1 favorite place...HERE...because you all are the best :bounce: :bounce: But I have such a rotten memory...sometimes I just wish that somebody would reboot my brain, hmmm...or is that boot my brain :-? But then, I'm not 16 either :lol: :lol: :lol: Way to go Sharn, I would have thought you were around this earth much longer And by the way ljtan55...waiting is so hard isn't it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ljtan55 Posted April 26, 2006 Author Report Share Posted April 26, 2006 LOL Caper. I know just counting the days now, but dun wanna jump in and buy/do something I'm gonna regret. Problem is, its taking so long!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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