cracker Posted November 5, 2005 Report Share Posted November 5, 2005 some interseting reading from Albert J Theil. Silicates in the aquarium: Many hobbyists are under the impression that using reverse osmosis water or deionized water will solve the problem, and that doing so will remove the silicates and silicic acid from that water. This is, unfortunately, not the case. Such units, even if combined, will remove silicate and silicic acid for a very short period of time only and, then, the silicate and silicic acid will get through the membrane and the resins and will start to build up in the tank. By a short period of time I mean in a matter of days, depending on how much silicate and silicic acid the water you are treating actually contains. Tests have shown that, when treating water with 14 ppm of silicate, the silicate and silicic acid came through the membrane and the resins used in combination with the R.O. unit, after less than 100 gallons of water had passed through the filtration set-up (lab. notes ref. 95/6/-012). Monaco"This is really not much water when you consider that most hobbyists believe that using reverse osmosis, deionization or a combination of both, gives them water quality of very high purity levels. Obviously this is not so, and that belief is a totally false one". R.O. and D.I. remove silicates and silicic acid for "some" time" only, after which the membrane of the reverse osmosis filter and the resins in the deionizers let the compounds through. The conclusion to draw from this is that, regardless of how you filter your water, silicates and silicic acid will find their way into your aquarium's water, and you are going to have to take steps to remove it. This is discussed in the Next section for both the water in the tank and the raw water. If you do not, diatoms willappear in your tank. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cracker Posted November 5, 2005 Author Report Share Posted November 5, 2005 From the same article. Make sure that you use a compound that is specific for silicate removal and that says so on the label. It should not be a multi-purpose product. The best results are obtained with compounds that state that all they remove is silicate and silicic acid and nothing else. That is how you will obtain the maximum silicate and silicic acid removal rate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cracker Posted November 5, 2005 Author Report Share Posted November 5, 2005 Interesting thread by an "old school" reefer from an American website: Neither PO4 nor SiO2 are villains, nor should be. A healthy reef has surprising amounts of both floating around. It is simply the fleeting lack of a balanced set of organisms to exploit such energy sources that leads to blooms of one sort or the other. Take SiO2 --it's correctly implicated in diatom blooms, but all effort to remove SiO2 from the reef tank is in vain, because your rock and even your tank glass will continue to release it. Diatom blooms in new tanks are typically superseded by cyanobacteria, and those in turn by microalgae, and those in turn by higher algae. PO4 is an even more vital part of animal nutrition than SiO2! You simply cannot aim to eradicate it. If you have excessive --or more correctly "underutilized" amounts of SiO2 in your system, diatoms will take care of them, and in turn support higher lifeforms. Diatoms are VITAL components of a reef tank, and most experienced reefers know that a new-tank diatom bloom will eventually subside. If you have underutilized amounts of PO4 in your system, and do not wish certain algae to benefit from it, you have to look to eliminating the source rather than mopping up the effect. 8 cases out of 10, 'excess' PO4 comes from the hobbyist's own hands: when feeding or dosing with 'additives'. More rarely, a death in the tank has re-released the animal's bound-up PO4 into the environment. The whole issue of filling in all biological niches with the appropriate species, to exploit all 'excesses' and achieve chemical and ecological balance --that is the esence of reefkeeping. I think I believe this theory actually. CRACKER Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cracker Posted November 5, 2005 Author Report Share Posted November 5, 2005 Interesting that no one has replied here. 8) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted November 5, 2005 Report Share Posted November 5, 2005 Was just going to! Just to say IMO silicates are not a problem, they are skimmed more easily than they are added. Once they enter the tank they are assimilated into mainly diatoms, which are very prone to skimming. Silicates were sometimes a problem back in the days of crappy skimmers, but not now. Phosphate, well that's awhole different ball game Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reef Posted November 5, 2005 Report Share Posted November 5, 2005 Silicate acid is not easy removed, silicate is . Best to get a good Ro/di then no problems. I had a big silicate problem as my di resin was old. when i changed the resin within 2 days i had no diatoms. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cracker Posted November 5, 2005 Author Report Share Posted November 5, 2005 will be interesting to see how long it lasts Reef. BB tanks wouldnt notice Silicates the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feelers Posted November 5, 2005 Report Share Posted November 5, 2005 Diatoms are amazing animals, we got to look at their structures under an electron microscope, very cool. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cracker Posted November 5, 2005 Author Report Share Posted November 5, 2005 they are pretty cool to look at. But they look like crap on the top of the sand. even after a tank has matured you still get bouts of it. im gonna try and do somethin' about this issue. working on it..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reef Posted November 6, 2005 Report Share Posted November 6, 2005 BB tanks wouldnt notice Silicates the same Why?? It covers all the glass, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feelers Posted November 6, 2005 Report Share Posted November 6, 2005 Wouldnt UV kills those things? With the money you guys spend on setups surely $100 would be worth the hassle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cracker Posted November 6, 2005 Author Report Share Posted November 6, 2005 Why?? It covers all the glass, You notice it first on the sand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cracker Posted November 6, 2005 Author Report Share Posted November 6, 2005 Wouldnt UV kills those things? With the money you guys spend on setups surely $100 would be worth the hassle No. Not trying to remove the diatoms as such, more the cause, being the silicic acids. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feelers Posted November 6, 2005 Report Share Posted November 6, 2005 Whats the difference between having dead diatoms and silicon sources elsewhere in the tank? After they die they leave behind their shell, - either being skimmed or resting dead on the bottom. As far as I can geuss silicon isnt a component in anythings metabolism?,(other than diatoms) so other than causing diatom blooms, - , what other problems does silicon create? So UV wont kill diatoms? Ozone would :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cracker Posted November 6, 2005 Author Report Share Posted November 6, 2005 nothing as far as i know, but they are a pain in the butt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reef Posted November 6, 2005 Report Share Posted November 6, 2005 but they are a pain in the butt. Thats what my boyfriend says Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feelers Posted November 6, 2005 Report Share Posted November 6, 2005 So are you sure about UV not killing them? Maybe the shell protects them, I rekon it would be worth a look. Increased light is supposed to make them go away - dont know how reliable that info is. As they are photosynthectic - so unless the shell specifically filters UV it would work. (it may do - glass is good at blocking uv I think) They are succeptable to temperature - but I dont know what you could do with that. Take the water out cook it and put it back? I would say 60C for an hour would probably kill most of them. Not the most practical - but it sounds like you have taken quite a disliking to them. Surely ozone would kill them. $900 is a lot of cash though, but there are obviously other benefits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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