I noticed earlier today our new female siamese has got very swollen gills (or gill covers?). She isn't eating. Water tests come back fine. she is swimming ok. although she does seem a bit quieter than usual. she isn't gasping.

I don't think it is dropsy 'cause it is only her gills that are sticking out.

She is not taking a breath here,

Does anyone have any suggestions as to what could be the cause? and ideas for treating?

please? she still looks very unhappy and i don't want to lose her. Does anyone have any ideas or suggestions? i have looked through all my books and they haven't been any help.

Well, it's not dropsy. More of a pine-cone effect with that -

http://www.fnzas.org.nz/fishroom/viewtopic.php?t=7357

There's many different things that are symptomatic of swollen gills, but it's hard to determine what it might be by pictures from above. Can you get a side pic? Perhaps one looking at the gill from the tail direction without a fin blocking the gill? If they're high enough resolution youcan magnify them to see what's going on in there. Gill flukes, ammonia burn... could be anything at this point...

Catch fish in net, apply dab from cottonbud dripped in formalin. This worked for an old male siamese fighter I use to have that was even doing death circles and displaying similar symptoms.

Are you treating her with anything at the moment? Some Melafix wouldn't hurt. At least until you find out exactly what is wrong. What are your water parameters? (from the tank she was originally in - looks as though you have her in quarantine/hospital tank?) Chlorine can also have a similar effect, although the gills often go brown inside.

yeah i did add a bit of melafix to her little tank. might go and see if i can get any better photos of her. i just wish i had an idea whether i should be treating for a parasite, bacteria, or whatever and if i should be concerned about the other fish although no-one else is causing any concern so far.

Right got a couple more photos and when i compared them to the other ones (apart from the lighting difference) she has sort of "prickled out?".

Oh i forgot to add (i keep forgetting to say everything in the same post)

pH 7.0

Nitrite 0

Ammonia 0ppm

temperature 26

Whatever it is, it's getting farther along. I'd treat for dropsy with pinecone-ing. Also, add some Prime to the water as well (or a good de-chlorinator/heavy metal remover). Couldn't hurt.

There is no positive cure for dropsy.

I'm sorry, but keep your eyes open for a replacement.

Is she in an isolation tank?

If not, do it.

Just float herin an icecream container.

Alan 104

I've been led to believe dropsy is a bacterial infection. If this is the case, wouldn't some sort of antibiotic work? This said, I've also been told that by the time they get to the "pinecone" stage, it's all over Rover. I know I shouldn't, but my Dr was always prescribing me antibiotics, and a lot of the time I just put them in the cupboard and never used them. I got better anyway and hence, ended up with a bunch of AB's (mostly amoxicyllin). If you or anyone you know has done the same, perhaps you could try them, in isolation of course, 'cos as it is a very broad spectrum AB, it will kill all the bacteria, good or bad.

If she's gonna die anyway, perhaps you could try this and let us know the result. I'd dose at 0.5-1mg per litre of water and dose for at least ten days, otherwise you could end up with super-bugs. Also, if she dies anyway, throw some bleach into the water she was in (only if you used the AB's of course)

P.S. don't tell my doc I suggested this!! :lol:

Cheers,

Vapo

I was just looking at Furan-2 today in the LFS while talking with the resident fish expert on de-worming Discus. On the bottle/insert it said that it treated dropsy... along with a WHOLE list of stuff, including gill flukes. Worth a shot, if you ask me....

well i have accepted that she may die. and if she is gonna die then it isn't going to hurt to try the amoxycillan. i have some that was prescribed to my daughter. it is liquid and since it is for a baby it is a less potent strength. i have dipped a pin into the bottle and swirled it round in the hospital tank. i will be interested to see how she looks tomorrow. i know it could be too early to tell but it will be interesting to see if she looks better or worse.

Doh! did it again! keep hitting submit and then think of something else to type.

Just a couple of questions. (Please forgive me if they are silly questions.)

BlueandKim -

Also, add some Prime to the water as well (or a good de-chlorinator/heavy metal remover).

What is "prime"?

vapo -

Also, if she dies anyway, throw some bleach into the water she was in (only if you used the AB's of course)

Why add bleach? Do you mean this to sterilise the tank after she has been in it?

So if there are any super bacteria they will die in the bleach and have no possible way of spreading.

Cheers vapo

Hi Loopy...so to hear about your fishie (I'm just catching up here, haven't been on much).

As you know, I DON'T know a lot about fish. But I did see a pic somewhere like yours (the one you have taken from the top of the little guy) and it was said to have dropsy.

I hate that I can't help people here when everyone's been so great to help me.

I'll be anxious to see how things go.

Take care!

thanks for your kind words Caper.

Well she hasn't died yet, i don't know if that is a good thing or not.

i guess i will just have to carry on treating until something happens.

Well last time i checked the female betta was still alive. she hasn't really gotten any worse but she still hasn't gotten any better either. i have been treating with the amoycillian everyday. will still keep posting until she either carks it or gets better.

well it has been 2 weeks and the siamese girl is still hanging in there!!! i am surprised, i thought she would have been a goner ages ago. she looks still pretty good considering she looks enormous. i wonder if there is anything else i could do for her as she isn't getting better though, at least she isn't getting worse. i am still swirling a tiny bit of amoxycillian every 2 or so days. it hasn't killed her yet so i assume it can't be THAT bad..

I'd suggest dosing her more frequently. At least once per day, as otherwise the bacteria may just get more resistant to the AB's. Bacteria multiplies at an astounding rate (every few seconds) and will mutate to become immune to any treatment, as it is an amazingly adaptive lifeform. better to kill it fast.

Salt baths may help, along with water changes before every treatment.

Also, I read that Indian Almond leaves are very effective at preventing further infection/problems. It seems it helps to harden scales and is quite prevalent in their natural environment. Check this link http://www.aqualandpetsplus.com/Betta,% ... Leaves.htm

Cheers,

Vapo.

Hi Loopy, just wanted to know of any updates. Did she make it?

Cheers,

Vapo

i am amazed to say she is STILL kicking (or swimming)!!

i am just trying to get hold of some augmentin.

She is still as bloated as every eally but she seems to have learnt to live with it! she is eatting fine, she just seems a bit depressed about being cooped up in the hospital for so long! i am still a bit peeved though cause i could imagine it would be a bit difficult to breed her when she is like this! especially with the way the bettas breed! it would be kinda funny and sad to watch a male trying to squeeze eggs out of her!!!

Wicked!! If she lives through all of this, you'll probably have one hard (tough) fish on your hands. If you breed her after everything, you may end up with some very resilient betta babies! Just what we need in NZ. Keep us posted!

Cheers,

Vapo

How much Augmentin do you need and do you need pills or liquid?