panz Posted December 27, 2007 Report Share Posted December 27, 2007 hi, we have been given 2 comets for a birthday present, had them now for about 6 weeks and have had problem after problem. Background: Never owned fish, love them to bits and am trying really hard, they live in a bowl i estimate to be about 10-15 litres. The UGF has carbon media and my water has never been tested to date. Prob # 1 - after about 2 weeks of moving them into their new home, they started to go to the top of the tank i though it was because they were hungry then checked at the petshop and they said they might need some air so told me to buy oxygen plant which i did and put it in their tank. After one day they were still doing it so i went to another petshop who told me to buy a pump, airstone, undergravel filter and a pump gravel vacuum which i did. Prob # 2 - after doing a full water change and putting the new filter and airstone in the water became blacklike and murky so i assumed i did it wrong and after 3 days did another full water change, then again after 3 days noticed the water changed to the same colour and decided to pull the filter out. I believe this to be the problem and decided to just do a 10% change everyday to keep them happy Prob # 3 - before the last water chage i notice my fish were really fat, alot fatter in the tummy than when i got them so jumped on the net and realised i may be over feeding them so have now cut down the amount of food i give them especially cause they live in a bowl! Prob # 4 - after noticing the large bellies - i notice one of my fish has two white spots on both sides of its tummy and am now worried it is sick. I have done alot of reading and want to get more fish so am investing in a larger tank - hopefully this will make my current two fish happier. After that i want to add another 7 goldfish to make 9 my total collection. I would like advice on what decisions i have made so far, how to fix my whitespot problem, and advice on how many litres my new tank should be for a total of 9 fish, what size fish i should buy, what accesories will be needed to keep them happy? At the end of the day i love these fish and am trying really hard to look after them well! Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilson Posted December 27, 2007 Report Share Posted December 27, 2007 Welcome panz glad you made it here after the other place sorry I carnt help I don't know much About goldfish Any way welcome :bounce: :bounce: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rozski Posted December 27, 2007 Report Share Posted December 27, 2007 Have you had a google yet? Lots of info out there http://www.fishlore.com/FirstTankSetup.htm And heres some info on the Nitrogen Cycle http://www.aquahobby.com/articles/e_ciclo.php For 9 goldfish you are looking at quite a big tank I think. The rough guide for fish is 1 inch of fish (adult size) to 1 gallon of water. Goldfish are messy and grow big, so really need big tanks to be healthy in. For whitespot, you will need to head to your pet store and get some treatments. I've never had to treat it myself yet *fingers crossed* so will leave the explaining to the more experienced in here Good luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panz Posted December 27, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 27, 2007 Rozski for your help, i have tried to google it but dont really know what to ask for seeing as i have a # of problems or things i need to learn about. thats why i joined FNZAS to get help from people who know what they are talking about. So thank you again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel1708 Posted December 27, 2007 Report Share Posted December 27, 2007 Hi there, Welcome to the forums1 I think your black murky water might be due to the carbon in your undergravel filter, did you rinse it well before you added it? If not then I think that will be the cause. I would not use oxygen weed it just goes rotten and wrecks the tank water. If you are cutting down on your feeding then I think the water will clear up also. What are you feeding them? If it is pellets then it can help to soak them in some water before feeding them to the goldfish. If the fish are bloated at the moment try feeding them some shelled peas, hopefully that will clear the bloating/constipation. The whitespots will need treatment from the pet shop, I'm no expert but I think a bit of salt could help be rid of them also but before you do anything I would reccomend searching the forums for whitespot first, there is alot of information on it. To have nine goldfish comfortably inside would require a large tank, I haven't done the calculations but i think something like a 3-4 foot would be around what size you need. Hope that helps, Mel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panz Posted December 27, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 27, 2007 Thank You very much Mel1708! That is the best advice i have had so far. I have been reading alot off the net since i posted this and am slowly learning what i need to do! Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caryl Posted December 27, 2007 Report Share Posted December 27, 2007 Hi and welcome. Sorry your first foray into fish keeping is not going well. Let's look at the problems one at a time... Prob # 1 - after about 2 weeks of moving them into their new home, they started to go to the top of the tank i though it was because they were hungry then checked at the petshop and they said they might need some air so told me to buy oxygen plant which i did and put it in their tank. A bowl is totally unsuitable for goldfish (they have been banned in some countries) and they need something much bigger. Personally I like to see all but the fancy long finned varieties in ponds, not tanks or bowls. If oxygen lack was the problem (and it probably was) an oxygen lpant would have done little to alleviate it. An airstone would have been better. Prob # 2 - after doing a full water change and putting the new filter and airstone in the water became blacklike and murky so i assumed i did it wrong and after 3 days did another full water change, then again after 3 days noticed the water changed to the same colour and decided to pull the filter out. I believe this to be the problem and decided to just do a 10% change everyday to keep them happy As suggested, did it have carbon in it somewhere? Sounds like loose carbon dust has fouled the water. What sort of filter is it? If it was one you put under the fravel, did you clean the gravel? If not, you will have stirred up all the muck trapped in the gravel since you had not been cleaning it before this by the sounds of it. Prob # 3 - before the last water chage i notice my fish were really fat, alot fatter in the tummy than when i got them so jumped on the net and realised i may be over feeding them so have now cut down the amount of food i give them especially cause they live in a bowl! Some species of goldfish are supposed to be fat. Feeding once a day, a small pinch, is plenty. More important is to make suer there is no leftover uneaten food which will foul the water. Prob # 4 - after noticing the large bellies - i notice one of my fish has two white spots on both sides of its tummy and am now worried it is sick. Do you mean it has 2 white spots at the front of its belly, behind the gills? If so, this means you have a male who is ready to spawn if given the chance. If further down the belly it is most likely whitespot, caused by stress. I have done alot of reading and want to get more fish so am investing in a larger tank - hopefully this will make my current two fish happier. After that i want to add another 7 goldfish to make 9 my total collection. Please do not put 9 goldfish in a bowl or tank. As said, they shuold be in a opnd. Have you considered a different species of fish to try? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panz Posted December 27, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 27, 2007 Hi and thanks for your help! A bowl is totally unsuitable for goldfish (they have been banned in some countries) and they need something much bigger. Personally I like to see all but the fancy long finned varieties in ponds, not tanks or bowls. If oxygen lack was the problem (and it probably was) an oxygen lpant would have done little to alleviate it. An airstone would have been better. A: I may have to look at a different species to keep in a tank then, i was thinking a really large tank as suggested above. As suggested, did it have carbon in it somewhere? Sounds like loose carbon dust has fouled the water. What sort of filter is it? If it was one you put under the fravel, did you clean the gravel? If not, you will have stirred up all the muck trapped in the gravel since you had not been cleaning it before this by the sounds of it. A: Yes my undergravel filter does have Carbon Media that i did not wash out before using it, i will wash it before i put it back in i think. And i did wash the gravel and whole tank when i first put the filter in just not the media cartridge but will do thanks for the pointer! Q?: One other thing is that i bought an Unipet No. 1601 Automatic Unbreakable Adjustable Vacuum Cleaner (it is supposed to be pump actioned) but i tried and tried to use it to vacuum the gravel but it wouldnt work and i have now broken it, I even rang the store i bought it from and they didnt know how to work it, i rang another pet store and same story there! Would be interesting to see if anyone else on here has one and if they have used it? Some species of goldfish are supposed to be fat. Feeding once a day, a small pinch, is plenty. More important is to make suer there is no leftover uneaten food which will foul the water. A: Thanks for that i have now lowered their food intake Do you mean it has 2 white spots at the front of its belly, behind the gills? If so, this means you have a male who is ready to spawn if given the chance. If further down the belly it is most likely whitespot, caused by stress. A: Unfortunately no it has whitespots before the gills so i will read more about that and maybe go and get some medicine for it. Q?: How do you know if you have males and females? Please do not put 9 goldfish in a bowl or tank. As said, they shuold be in a opnd. Have you considered a different species of fish to try? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caryl Posted December 27, 2007 Report Share Posted December 27, 2007 Sorry about the typos in my last post. I am at work and rushed it off before a proper check :roll: Goldfish need a lot of space so 3 would fit in a 3ft tank - minimum. Sorry I know nothing about the cleaner you purchased so can't help there. Whitespot remedies are easy to find at any LFS. Just follow the instructions on the bottle. Sexing goldfish isn't always easy. Look down on them from above. The males are more streamlined. Females tend to bulge slightly to one side making their tails look slightly out of line. Also, when about to spawn, males develop white spots around the gill plates. When I mentioned the fancier types of goldfish, I meant veiltails or fantails. For other types of fish you would have to go tropical. You can get gold gouramis or black widow tetras as an example. Google these and see what you think. You would have to buy a heaterstat if you decided to do this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rozski Posted December 27, 2007 Report Share Posted December 27, 2007 check out the swordtails online, they are bright orange like goldfish too. Hardier and don't grow as large either. All they need extra to be happy is is a heater Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caryl Posted December 27, 2007 Report Share Posted December 27, 2007 Of course I should have thought of swordtails and platys :roll: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panz Posted December 27, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 27, 2007 Wow Thats great thanks for the good advice guys & gals! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ianab Posted December 28, 2007 Report Share Posted December 28, 2007 Another Gold fish thats more suitable for smaller tanks. The GOLD barb http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gold_barb Again it's a tropical species, but they are common, dont grow big and you could keep them with swordtails and platys too. The reason folks are trying to steer you away from goldfish is that they grow BIG. Those little Comets can be 8" long in a couple of years. Well they wont be if they are kept in a bowl.. they will be dead No reason you cant keep goldfish in a tank, but it takes a LOT bigger tank than most beginners are prepared to invest in. Think 200l +. Cheers Ian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeash007 Posted December 28, 2007 Report Share Posted December 28, 2007 Hi I'm pretty sure there are a variety of species that are okay in cold water (Ruby Barbs an Mountain Minnows are two i think - stand to be corrected :-? . They are small and won't grow nearly as big as goldfish. Have fun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ianab Posted December 28, 2007 Report Share Posted December 28, 2007 Hi I'm pretty sure there are a variety of species that are okay in cold water (Ruby Barbs an Mountain Minnows are two i think - stand to be corrected :-? . They are small and won't grow nearly as big as goldfish. Have fun Yes thats true, and you can actually keep White Clouds in a 15l tank with a bit of normal care. I used to breed them in a 18l tank But Panz wants gold and/or black fish, and if thats the case it would really be best go tropical where there are several good choices for a sensible sized tank Cheers Ian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelsta Posted January 17, 2008 Report Share Posted January 17, 2008 If you stick with goldfish, there are two other very good sites that are dedicated to goldfish. They have great info on keeping healthy goldies. www.goldfishconnection.com and www.kokosgoldfish.com I found both very helpful when I was just starting out with my tank. Goldfish require about 35-40litres of water each, so the others are right - if you want lots of fish it would be best to go with another species. All the best Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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