cichlid7 Posted December 21, 2007 Report Share Posted December 21, 2007 im thinking of setting up a small saltwater tank either the Aqua 1 Ar380 or Jebo r338 the jebo has stronger lights (i think) i wanted to have a clown fish or 2 in there is it big enough also what rock could i use and how much thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markoshark Posted December 21, 2007 Report Share Posted December 21, 2007 From memory thats a 24 L tank? Try like an AR-510, or an AR-620 Thats like stuffing you into a bathroom and saying. Here is your life Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted December 21, 2007 Report Share Posted December 21, 2007 Not familiar with either of those tanks but the smallest species of clownfish, percula, would want a minimum of 60 litres for a pair of them to be reasonably happy. They normally live in a family so 2 is much better than one. They will only behave naturally, as in nature, if they have an anemone to live in, you can also keep a bubbletip anemone in a 60 litre tank, provided you have enough and the right kind, of lighting, the anemone relies on photosynthesis. Rock, no hard and fast rules but a KG of coral rock (which will become "live"), to each 10 litres is a rough guide. Filtration in a salt water tank is quite different from how it is done in a fresh water tank. For decent results you will need to do some research on this, not just set it up like a fresh water tank. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cichlid7 Posted December 21, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 21, 2007 yea im not going to set one up for ages its a 40L tank im just trying to get a lot of info atm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted December 21, 2007 Report Share Posted December 21, 2007 They will survive in a 40 litre, but it will be somewhat cramped, not so pleasant for the fish, or for you to watch. In Chch, there is a very keen and enthusiastic group of reefers, most of them fairly new, and they even have a monthly get together. I would strongly suggest you get hold of someone like Wilson, or TheConch, (to name two), and see if you can join their get together, or at least visit, look at and talk about tanks, you will learn heaps and it will help you decide wether you can start a marine tank. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cichlid7 Posted December 21, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 21, 2007 yea that is a good idea might wait till after new years tho i was just think i have a juwel 80L tank and could use that, would that be better to use? now with the filter would a sump be best and and i have got a protien skimmer that i got with a 600L tank it was in the sump but now that is just sitting there not used Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted December 21, 2007 Report Share Posted December 21, 2007 Awesome! If you can set it up with a good powerful skimmer, you are a long way towards success. A sump is really just to put equipment in, wether you have one or not is just a matter of how you arrange everything, although it does make life easier. Didn't really make it clear in the previous post, but in a marine tank we don't use just any rock, coral rock is best because it is porous and an excellent home for the bacteria we need to complete the nitrogen cycle. This is one of the differences from a fresh water tank, we use coral rock in a marine tank for biological filtration, not cannisters and such. If you buy the coral rock dry, it has to be "cured", ie left in water for a few weeks till all the bacteria become established in it and all the crud in it has been processed. This usually takes 6 weeks plus, and fish cannot be put into the tank till it's done. So, if you want to get started, start curing some rock soon as you can, so it will be ready by the time you got everything else set up. And DO talk to those other reefers down there. There is much more to this marine tank keeping than can be explained in just a few posts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cichlid7 Posted December 21, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 21, 2007 Would a 2000 LPH power head be good for a tank this size for the sump What media do you use in a marine sump and would a 60L sump work. the reason i say that i want to use a sump is that i have seen such a difference in my 600L freshwater tank. with the coral rock how do i cure it do i need to put anything in the water and any heat,air, ect... thanks so much for the help i have been looking on google for about 5 hours today and you have give me more info than i got from google. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted December 21, 2007 Report Share Posted December 21, 2007 Yes 2000 litres is plenty. You need a minimum turnover, sump to tank, 5 x's per hour. So tank 80 litres, sump 60 litres, total = 140 litres. 5 x's that is 700 lph, so 2000 lph will be plenty. If you have a sump, use it, most marine tanks do. BTW you also need some more flow in the tank, the above calculation is just the sump to tank turnover. Media, none, in a marine tank. Leave all biological (bacterial) filtration to the bacteria in the coral rock (liverock). Using any other type of media can cause nitrate to build up, which is not very important in a fresh water tank, but is a big no no in a marine tank, once you start keeping corals and invertebrates in there. And trust me, sooner or later you will want to try corals and inverts. To cure the rock you put it in salt water same as what would be in the tank. You can do this in a tank, plastic container, or anything similar. Put a few powerheads in there, the more the better, to get excellent circulation. This will also encourage good aeration from the water surface. A heater is not essential, but will speed things up if you keep the water at 25 degrees. If you test the water, you will find ammonia build up for the first 2 weeks or so, and then it will dissapear once the ammonia eating bacteria are established. Then you get nitrite, for 4 weeks or so. Once that is gone, has to test zero, the rock is ready for the tank. There will still be nitrate (not nitrite) for several months but it will slowly come down. If you have not already seen it there is a beginner guide at the top of the salt water section, will run you through some start up type information. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cichlid7 Posted December 21, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 21, 2007 yep i read that i was looking at these 2 pumps on tm http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing ... =132291665 are they any good plus im not sure how to use the skimmer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cichlid7 Posted December 21, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 21, 2007 plus i will need to buy a few test kits would you be able to list the important ones. thank you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jolliolli Posted December 21, 2007 Report Share Posted December 21, 2007 I have an aqua one circ pump similar to the atman, its reliable etc but i'm looking to change over to tunze nanos as the flow is quite directional, whereas the tunzes have a wider area for dispersion and can be angeld inside the tank which is good if you want o aim it at rockwork in the centre of the tank etc. Skimmers are pretty eash to setup, the simple gist of it, is water comes in, bubbles are produced in the main chamber, and as the bubbles are produced organic waste is bubbled up in to a collection cup which you empty. Water exits the skimmer and returns in to the tank via a return pipe (if running a sump) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jolliolli Posted December 21, 2007 Report Share Posted December 21, 2007 test kits you will need, at the start of cycling your rock you'll need a test for ammonia, nitrite, nitrate. You'll also need to test for pH, alkalinity, phosphates and calcium (also look at testing for magnesium a bit further down the track) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cichlid7 Posted December 21, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 21, 2007 my skimmer is strange its like a rectangle box tht sits inside the sump it was from the big marine tank at pet world ferry rd that used to be there (i got the tank now) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jolliolli Posted December 21, 2007 Report Share Posted December 21, 2007 sounds like an in sump model, i haven't seen a rectangular version but probably one of the other guys will know what type it is. Do you know the make/model? PS you can use your freshwater test kits, when you test the water the salt tends to give a cloudy appearance to the result but its still the same. pH you'll need a high range test kit (although you may already have one of these if you've kept african cichlids etc). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cichlid7 Posted December 21, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 21, 2007 not sure its in the fish room atm outside and down the back of the garden and its cold lol so i will have a look tomorrow but i carn't remember seeing a make of model number on it tho Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted December 21, 2007 Report Share Posted December 21, 2007 Those pumps are a cheaper brand so will have a shorter life, but good price they will get you started. The big thing is not just the lph, but also the maximum lift of 2 metres. That means flow gradually lessens the higher the pump has to pump it, till by 2 meters it stops. So you'll need to set it so it doesn't have to lift more than a meter or so. That is not from the pump, but from the top of the water in the sump, to the top of the water in the tank. Test kits, minimum ( to do things right ), is nitrate, calcium, magnesium, and alkalinity. You may also want to get ammonia and nitrite to monitor the rock cycling, but once the cycle is done you don't need them any more, so borrowing someone elses is a cheaper option. You also need something to test salinity, which has to be kept around a specific gravity (sg) of 1.025. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasp Posted December 21, 2007 Report Share Posted December 21, 2007 Sorry, posted before I saw your posts Jolliolli. Do you Chch people ever sleep? That rectangular skimmer, sounds like you might have lucked out and got a Deltec, if so an excellent brand. Signing out for the day now! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cichlid7 Posted December 21, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 21, 2007 what sort of salt do you add to the water is it that red sea salt or something cannot remember the name. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilson Posted December 21, 2007 Report Share Posted December 21, 2007 Red sea salt is the stuff i use http://www.redseafish.com/Product.asp?d ... &proID=190 as i said to dixon when he was thinking about it if you want a bit of live rock ill give you a bit to start with Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jolliolli Posted December 22, 2007 Report Share Posted December 22, 2007 Sorry, posted before I saw your posts Jolliolli. Do you Chch people ever sleep? lol, what about you auckland ppl i was in bed straight after that post. organism had quite a good price on the large buckets of red sea salt when i was there last weekend, 25 litres and get 4 litres free i think, although if its a small tank it would take a long time to get through! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilson Posted December 22, 2007 Report Share Posted December 22, 2007 yea its almost $30 worth of salt free Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cichlid7 Posted December 22, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 22, 2007 thanks the skimmers says pro twin venturi protein skimmer i carn't find any info on it tho Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cichlid7 Posted December 26, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 26, 2007 just brought a 140L marine tank http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing ... =133058576 do you think i need to put a sump under it or is there no point i am going to make doors and sides for the stand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jolliolli Posted December 26, 2007 Report Share Posted December 26, 2007 Its really up to you. There's decent space for a sump and having one will increase your water volume, which will mean it will be easier to keep your water parameters stable with a larger volume of water. Also it will allow you to keep all your gear (heater, pumps) out of the tank which will free up more room in the tank. Were you thinking of drilling the tank and putting an overflow in? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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