Debbie

The only reason I am posting this is to offer additional information to previous posts on this issue. I feel I have the right to reply since my e-mail, which I thought was confidential, has been plastered all over this thread. Doesn't take a rocket scientist to work out which business it was coming from. We are now working under the NZFSA, I can't speak for operators of quarantine facilities in the NI, only from what we experience in the South Island. Our shipment fees have increased from $300-$400 18 months ago to just under $1000 for our last shipment PLUS over $1600 worth of testing fees. Work that out! From $400 to $2600 in 18mths. Makes even petrol look OK :lol: How does this affect what we import? losses of over 20% in 5 days require specimens to be sent to Wtn for testing. This is $800 PER SPECIES. If you send your fish off in week 4 (of the 6 week quarantine period) the balance of your fish need to wait until the results are released, worse case senario - fish are in quarantine for 10+ weeks! Solution - to import the major percentage of your fish from your best source, this may not be from the importer that has all the exotic plecos, cichlids etc but makes sound economic sense from the operators point of view. The $$$ at the end of the rainbow for importing Tropheus - just doesn't happen. i.e. we requested 10 of each type of Tropheus available on the stock list for our shipment this week. 3 Variaties not sent as exporter felt they were not in the best condition, the one variety we received had 1/2 dead on arrival. The allure of 1/2 deposit up front would surely only be for live fish at the end of the quarantine period, not paying for fish and freight to get them here. Who pays if they die in quarantine (pretty easy to answer). The last large cichlid shipment we had in - half way through the quarantine period they decided to turn on each other and rip each other up. I only offer this from an importers point of view. Many things need to be considered when bringing a shipment in. Surely - The larger importers in the North Island should be able to cope with the NI demands for fish incl exotic's and cichlids. If not - why not? :roll: Maybe it's to do with some of my comments above.

Nah ........ in fact he had a chuckle. Cheers

I'm not trying to drag this out any further because what has been said has been said. Personally, I felt We were entitled to the right of reply (not attack) In fact several members asked for it. Pommereef seems to keep bringing up that I resurrected a dead thread, not being a regular poster I was not aware that there was a time limit for reply. I only chose to print the entire thread (and give to Bob) after Bob had been made aware by his customers of the subject issue. Doesn' t take a brain surgeon to work out who it's about. He does not use or have a computer which is why (the third party - me!) entered the reply. I would like to personally thank Warren Stilwell, FNZAS President for offering to remove this thread altogether because of the personal attack but consider that the comments of the last few posts sum up the situation pretty well. Bob'sfinal reply to this is "the grumpy ole bugger is going to dust his books" :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: Just out of interest, I have used "those old dusty books" to prove several species of marine fish have changed their names from the 1950's (when the standard was first written) as there was no "modern" information to prove this (for the recent MAF project, that we were involved - and spent a considerable amount of time on) Hopefully these fish will still be able to be imported for the hobby? Cheers Debbie

I post this reply on behalf of my father, sorry not sure how to paste quotes right back at the beginning, so have typed name of member and their comments, trust it's not too confusing - thanks Debbie He writes:- Now that the storm in the teacup has subsided and I have had time to read the preceeding posts, I thought it appropriate to reply on behalf of my staff member involved and myself (as business owner). Mainly for the point as some people were curious to learn “the other side†of the saga. eg. Chimera wrote: if the above is not your circumstances and only an example, im intrigued to know what actually did happen? Feelers wrote: think that the store should have an official (written on the wall) policy when selling things like fish to deal with this sort of problem, as its obviously a pretty common situation. I aslo think there is some responsibility on the buyers behalf to make sure they know what that policy is. Firstly, we clearly state and display our terms of sale AT THE COUNTER AT POINT OF SALE (In line with the Consumer Guarantees Act) and in terms of Livestock sales – as not returnable, “please ensure you choose your purchases carefully†Thank you “Pies†for your intelligent appraisal of this point :- Pies wrote: I don't think the shop has any responsibility other than to sell you a healthy animal with good long term life prospects. I wouldn't expect them to have refund any money. And as the SPCA add's say don't buy an animal unless you are prepared to look after it. So as long as the fish is healthy, the shop has done their bit. And I am not saying shops shouldn't consider taking a fish back for store credit or whatever is amicable to both parties (e.g. the yellow tang example would surly be and example of a fish easy to on-sell etc) but we shouldn't expect it. Joe Blogg wrote: - He said that they are not in the business of selling and taking back fish. Mind you that all I wanted was store credit. I was still going to spend the money there as I have for YEARS, and heaps of it. I will consider a refund depending on the situation and the customer. On this occasion I offered to accept the fish back (at wholesale plus GST). I have in the past accepted fish back from this customer – it would want to be noted he purchased several fish and asked and received discount. Joe Blogg wrote: The example that I present originally in this post is one in which the behavior of the fish is out of the norm, so not the ignorance of the purchaser. This is simply NOT TRUE - The fish in question was a Labroids Cleaner Wrasse which he wished to return (this fish was not the problem). The culprit was infact a six lined wrasses which he already owned that was harassing the cleaner (appears to be an ongoing problem and not out of the norm for this fish). It is also noted from my staff member that the day he purchased the cleaner he tried to onsell the six lined wrasse to one of my customers present in my store. Joe Blogg wrote: I guess this is established by a long term relationship and the reason that I am so pissed off is that I feel as though they have broken this contract. This comment mystifies me somewhat, Joe Blogg has spent little in our shop compared to the time we spent with him in the early days (sorting out and fixing his marine system and problems - set up by another shop) of him becoming a marine customer. There is no loyally to us, by observation he prefers to purchase off shore or recently with Auckland marine suppliers Joe Blogg wrote - OK, lets add to the equation that it comes from a very long term customer that has probably more knowledge about marines than the owner (at least current knowledge from this decade). As for my expertise in the field – I concede to any self-proclaimed expert and will ponder on my 30 years in the business and accept that you cannot please everybody all the time. Bob Ward Owner/Director Redwood Aquatics Aquarium & Water Garden Centre

:-? Hi List, this is my first post. (Sorry for the huge size!) Firstly I would like to say a big thankyou to Anal Fin & Tee Cee for their comments Mark (Pies) has mentioned my name on the list so I feel I have the right of reply. (On my behalf not Bob's). Yes Mark, I have the e-mails too! that you mention and I think it would only be fair to the rest of the list to show those e-mails .................. !! to allow the list to make up their own mind after your slanderous comments earlier! I personally feel disappointed with your comments and that you feel this way. Debbie First e-mail after sending shipment: (NOTE THE COMMENT OF THE FEATHER DUSTERS, WHICH HE HAS JUST TOLD THE LIST THAT WERE EMPTY??) Hi Debbie The order arrived at my door at exactly 8:30am this morning. Firstly I would like to say how impressed I was with the way everything was packaged. All stock was double bagged. The contents of the box was packed to avoid anything from being knocked around in the box. Everything was taped closed, with a clearly marked box "Fragile, THIS WAY UP" etc. Also the bag that contained the fish had ample water and oxygen which greatly helps with the health of the shipping stock. So thanks to whoever packaged up my order, very happy. After approx a 2hr acclimitisation period, floated in sump with a drip the stock was added to my tank. The 3 Feather Duster worms opened within about 5 minutes of being placed into the tank. They appear to be in perfect condition with no visible damage. Very happy with them! The Mixed rock was exactly as I expected, and opened within 15min of the first lights coming on in the tank. Again am very happy with it. The Scooter Blenny was exploring the tank after about 10 minutes of being placed into the tank. I know I mentioned this to you before, but this fish is VERY skinny. It has very taunt skin, and visible bones where the skin is streatched. This is quite common for dragonetts, as they are very tuff animals to feed, often only eating 'copods' from live rock tanks and not taking frozen or dry foods. He seams happy enough though, so I hope he fattens up nicely and will be OK. I am not overly concerned about it, but felt I should mention it to you. Overall I am happy with the order, and look forward to recieving a list from you when your Hawaii shipment clears is quarantine. I am sure I will be purchasing more livestock from you in the future. Thanks for all your help and patience, taking the photos and always responding to my mails. Cheers! Mark 2nd e-mail about his fish death: Debbie Woke up this morning and saw the scooter blenny i purchased last week had died. He had been very shy yesterday and I was quite concerned. He had been quite active up until then. I believe that this fish died simply because it was weakened by being skinny. I remember bringing this up with you prior to purchasing the fish, and after it arrived. I wouldn't have purchased it if I had known how poor its condition was. These fish are very hard to keep in tanks without aged live rock, the same as the manderin fish (they are the same species, its not a blenny at all). By looking at pictures on the internet as well as fish in other aquairums it is obvious that this fish was extremely malnurished.I am slightly disapointed as its the first fish to have died in the tank,and I know all my water paramaters etc are fine, as are all the other fish and inverts. Just thought I should let you know, as I am quite dissapointed. Regards Mark My Reply I have forwarded your e-mail to Bob who replies as follows: He has another blenny of the same shipment still in the same system with no problems, as mentioned he also has had one of these blennies for over a year and it still looks in his description "boney". It obviously was happy enough for the last week and you mentioned in your e-mail that you were not concerned about the fish. It you had any concerns after seeing the photos you should have cancelled your order. On the few marine "out of Christchurch" sales we have had we have never had any problems or complaints. We did have an invertebrate returned from Auckland as the Latin name was wrong and we accepted this fine. The out of town sales have been very time consuming and it is a lot harder to send one or two fish in a box with the cooling effect etc but we have done this to help our out of town customers. We always hear that everyone's water is fine after they lose a fish but we can only compare with our system and we have not had any problems with the existing stock and other blenny of same species that is still in the system (Bob said that he picked out the best/largest one for you, so on that basis the other blenny should have died also) You are disappointed and we can appreciate that. Obviously you are not happy with our stock (and we feel it is OK or we would not send it) so it might pay to source your stock elsewhere from now, as we do not want to repeat your disappointment. We will cancel your existing order. Regards Debbie Fawcett Mark's Reply Debbie & Bob Thanks for the thoughtful reply. Redwood Aquatics have a good reputation, which is the reason why I choose to deal with you. I would like you to understand that I felt I should give you feedback, as I would do the same if it had come from my local fish store. My feedback was not intended as an attack, and I am not asking for anything, it is just honest feedback. You have a very good point about me being happy enough to keep this fish,you are right, if was so unhappy I should have made an effort to return it. I have been happy with the service from you, and although I have had a disappointment, I understand that it is out of your control, this however doesn't stop me from being disappointed. I hope this makes sense. I would still very much like you to send my order. And I do appreciate the fact that it requires extra effort on you part to send stuff to your out of town customers. Sincerely Mark